BASC (renewing FAC)

[Minky]

well that as clear information that I have seen.  Why hasn't Connor who promotes himself as the voice of the org posted that information.  Why when all of this started didn't the orgs semi go along with it. The orgs are just total chaos as usual and the shooting public are just giving up on mass.  Gunshops are closing like the pubs.  where does all this end. 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Just now, Minky said:

well that as clear information that I have seen.  Why hasn't Connor who promotes himself as the voice of the org posted that information.  Why when all of this started didn't the orgs semi go along with it. The orgs are just total chaos as usual and the shooting public are just giving up on mass.  Gunshops are closing like the pubs.  where does all this end. 

No privately held weapons is presumably the intention.

[did i miss]

So this may be a silly question but how long before renewal of cert can you do the med cert 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

1 minute ago, did i miss said:

So this may be a silly question but how long before renewal of cert can you do the med cert 

Not a silly question, you have to get it in and done (returned) so that it dovetails with your renewal.

As of now, each and every authority have their own excuses for why things are taking so long.

Plan for your renewal, you know when it is due, contact your FEO and ask him when they want it and submit accordingly.

Good luck.

[Rewulf]

33 minutes ago, did i miss said:

So this may be a silly question but how long before renewal of cert can you do the med cert 

The pro forma lasts 6 months.
There have been cases known to me, where licencing have taken that long to process a grant/renewal that it ran out, and the applicant has had to go and get (and pay for) another one.
The police accept no responsibility for this happening.

[Conor O'Gorman]

Hopefully this helps in terms of current situation.

BASC now recommends ShootCert as its preferred provider for medical verifications. This decision was made following concerns expressed by police over some third-party providers. ShootCert was identified by BASC as having robust quality measures in place that minimised the chance of errors or other problems in the verification process. Feedback on ShootCert has been positive as per comments here and elsewhere on the forum. BASC does not get commission from ShootCert and BASC members can get a discount if they contact BASC or ShootCert in advance. 

https://www.shootcert.co.uk/basc-and-shootcert-agree-collaboration-to-provide-firearm-medical-certificates/

The use of third party providers of the medical verification service is a temporary solution until our broken firearms licensing system is fixed.

The Home Office Guidance states that the medical verification can either be enclosed with a grant or renewal application, or can be sent directly at a later date. Several forces, however, will not accept applications without the medical verification, so it makes sense to enclose it with the application. This is why BASC recommends speaking to one’s GP 20 to 24-weeks in advance of expiry. This ensures the process is complete with plenty of time to apply more than 8-weeks in advance of expiry, and therefore qualify for the automatic 8-week extension provided under Section 28B.

 

[did i miss]

Thanks for info I couldn't find anywhere it said on the form how long it was valid for

 

[Minky]

So why / how is every department able to make up any old versions as they please.  If basc says that it is the voice why have they got no influence at all.  When all of this nonsense started that was the time to get on it, not now.  Horse bolted / stable door. 

[harkom]

Same ol' story with "advice" given by Bsac..... free med certs end up as £x.  

I'v just been relieved of £96 for GP Cert....took 3 1/2 weeks to receive a bit of paper consisting of tick boxes, at most a 5 minute job for GP's subordinate.Nice work at £1000 - 1200 per hour but at least payment was on a card and receipt provided. Some GPs I am told only take £ in readies----go figure. 

[Conor O'Gorman]

5 hours ago, Rewulf said:

Thank you for your honesty and clarity Conor, it certainly doesnt negate what I said does it ?

If you somehow believe it does, I would point out that NOT paying for the pro forma (if payment is requested) meant that your grant/renewal did not continue.
This meant that some licence holders did not receive their renewals on time, the result was the 'chaos' that I mentioned.

Do you concede that the BASC advice to not participate with the pro forma system was not good advice ?

The steadily falling numbers of licence holders since 2016 is testament to the effect of the pro forma system, and the incoming licence fee increases will further diminish the number, along with the future lead ban.
Shooting, and private firearm ownership in the UK is under attack from many sides, I would rather ALL shooting orgs get their collective heads together and form a strategy to fight this, rather than remain apathetic, and not complain that this is some kind of paranoid delusion.

To answer your question whether BASC's advice was good or bad at the time will depend I guess on who acted on it and what the consequences were. If you look back on PW from that era there was a split of opinion on that. With the benefit of hindsight I think the GP perspective was not sufficiently sought and understood and relying on BMA representation alone was a mistake. Some GPs were BASC members and were quite irate at the stance taken. That said the hard-line BASC stance taken at that time concentrated minds and follow-up lobbying ensured that the next version of the guidance allowed for third party GMC registered medical practitioners to do medical verification - not only our own GP. If it had been solely our own GP then that would have left many high and dry facing exorbitant fees or a GP refusing to take part.

[Conor O'Gorman]

4 hours ago, did i miss said:

So this may be a silly question but how long before renewal of cert can you do the med cert 

There is nothing in the Home Office statutory guidance about for how long a completed medical verification should be valid. Most forces have settled on six months, which is usually enough to allow for early applications, but some impose a three-month shelf life. 

Home Office guidance requires medical record checks back to birth for first grants. Doctors advise that someone with no relevant medical conditions for the previous 20 years on their records would be unlikely to have pertinent underlying problems. Medical records were digitised from about 2001, so 20 years would be proportionate. 

Because GP markers are not mandatory, police forces require medical verification at every renewal. Furthermore, there is no consistency of approach for repeated record checks, with various forces requiring checks from 10 to 30 years. If GP involvement in firearms licensing were mandatory, this unnecessary and costly repeated process could be discontinued, not to mention strengthening the argument for longer certificate life. 

[ahdinko]

On 07/01/2025 at 17:38, steve_b_wales said:

BASC are now recommending SHOOT CERT to get your GP Pro Forma. Priced at £75+VAT.

Anyone used them?

I used Shootcert as my GP refused to do a proforma. They were nice and easy to deal with, and very quick. The Doctors took a few weeks to send my records over to shootcert, I got an email from shootcert when they got the records and then the Proforma came through on an email about 2 days after that

[steve_b_wales]

17 minutes ago, ahdinko said:

I used Shootcert as my GP refused to do a proforma. They were nice and easy to deal with, and very quick. The Doctors took a few weeks to send my records over to shootcert, I got an email from shootcert when they got the records and then the Proforma came through on an email about 2 days after that

Thanks. I have started the proceedings with them a few days ago.

[moondoggy]

3 hours ago, steve_b_wales said:

Thanks. I have started the proceedings with them a few days ago.

Good luck. I have literally, ie. Yesterday, just received my report from ShootCert. It took my doctors nearly two months to get mine done. They blamed the fact that ShootCert ask for full medical records and my doctor no longer holds the old paper records, so they had to request the physical records from their storage facility. They then took an age, and several phone calls from me and letters from ShootCert, eventually prompted them to extract their finger from wherever it was firmly placed. It didn’t help with Christmas getting in the way.

The problem now is that Lincs Firearms requires around eight weeks prior to the certificate expiration to do the renewal. I have submitted mine yesterday with five weeks to my certificate expiring.

So, I may have been put in a position by my doctors whereby I may have to put my guns into temporary storage. I am not a happy bunny.

ShootCert were very good though, but we were at the mercy of my doctors.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

I hope you added a covering letter explaining it was not your fault.

[steve_b_wales]

12 hours ago, moondoggy said:

Good luck. I have literally, ie. Yesterday, just received my report from ShootCert. It took my doctors nearly two months to get mine done. They blamed the fact that ShootCert ask for full medical records and my doctor no longer holds the old paper records, so they had to request the physical records from their storage facility. They then took an age, and several phone calls from me and letters from ShootCert, eventually prompted them to extract their finger from wherever it was firmly placed. It didn’t help with Christmas getting in the way.

The problem now is that Lincs Firearms requires around eight weeks prior to the certificate expiration to do the renewal. I have submitted mine yesterday with five weeks to my certificate expiring.

So, I may have been put in a position by my doctors whereby I may have to put my guns into temporary storage. I am not a happy bunny.

ShootCert were very good though, but we were at the mercy of my doctors.

GP's have to provide you with your medical records within one month of you requesting them, this is a legal requirement. The fact that they didn't have them to hand etc is not your concern.

[Rewulf]

15 hours ago, moondoggy said:

They blamed the fact that ShootCert ask for full medical records and my doctor no longer holds the old paper records

The police AFAIK require at least 10 years worth of medical records, if Shootcert are asking for your entire medical history that seems IMHO a little excessive (depending on your age)
I would have thought that 10 years worth of medical history would be easily accessible via computer records.

Its certainly an interesting concept, that what may be relevant (say you were rushed into hospital) and your full medical history was not available ?

2 hours ago, steve_b_wales said:

GP's have to provide you with your medical records within one month of you requesting them, this is a legal requirement. The fact that they didn't have them to hand etc is not your concern.

The doctor may indeed be dragging their heels, having to do the work of accumulating medical records for no fee ?

[eightlittlebits]

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

The police AFAIK require at least 10 years worth of medical records, if Shootcert are asking for your entire medical history that seems IMHO a little excessive (depending on your age)

I think it's another postcode lottery, some police forces are asking since birth, others less.

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

The doctor may indeed be dragging their heels, having to do the work of accumulating medical records for no fee ?

The sooner they realise that they can either do it themselves for a reasonable fee, or supply them for nothing, the better.

Someone local to me asked and was quoted a daft price for the GP to do it, then got a phone call from the GP asking why the records were being requested by a third party.

[Rewulf]

Just now, eightlittlebits said:

I think it's another postcode lottery, some police forces are asking since birth, others less.

Agreed.
The reason I quoted 10 years is because thats what I was told for Nottinghamshire.
I have a Polish club member, who has been asked to provide 10 years worth of info, he has been in the UK for 5 years, and needs to provide another 5 years from Poland, and have it translated.

[Gordon R]

A lad, who has been shooting with us for the last year, had spent quite a few years in Australia. He was advised that he needed the Australian medical records for his first shotgun certificate application and was getting a bit panicky. Whilst he was trying to get them, his shotgun certificate arrived, rendering the Aussie records surplus. I think a bit of commonsense was applied and well done to the Firearms team concerned.

[moondoggy]

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

I would have thought that 10 years worth of medical history would be easily accessible via computer records.

I was told over the phone by Lincs Firearms that they would accept 10 years worth of medical records.

The problem is, because ShootCert have to deal with all police forces of whom many say that they must be a full and complete history, they have to request the full history. They said that if they only provide a partial history and the police reject that, then the ShootCert application must be started all over again with a fresh fee paid and another delay.

I am nearly 66 years old and have continuously held a shotgun certificate since I was 15 yers old. Because of this fact, I do not see why I must submit a full medical history, or indeed, a full criminal record history. Contrary to modern belief, you cannot change history, so I would have thought that you should only be required to submit records for the last five years for any certificate renewal?

At my last renewal, my doctor carried out an interview in person and submitted the medical report all within a few days of my making an appointment at a cost of around £50. He also was very sympathetic to the process as they are a rural doctors, and fully understood the need for people to possess shotguns and firearms.

However, recently, they have decided to withdraw that service with no explanation as to why. It has certainly caused me a big headache. for which I will now have to make an appointment to get some painkillers. Lol.

[Rewulf]

53 minutes ago, moondoggy said:

The problem is, because ShootCert have to deal with all police forces of whom many say that they must be a full and complete history, they have to request the full history. They said that if they only provide a partial history and the police reject that, then the ShootCert application must be started all over again with a fresh fee paid and another delay.

That makes sense.

53 minutes ago, moondoggy said:

I am nearly 66 years old and have continuously held a shotgun certificate since I was 15 yers old. Because of this fact, I do not see why I must submit a full medical history, or indeed, a full criminal record history. Contrary to modern belief, you cannot change history, so I would have thought that you should only be required to submit records for the last five years for any certificate renewal?

Its probably a data protection issue ?

[steve_b_wales]

1 hour ago, moondoggy said:

I was told over the phone by Lincs Firearms that they would accept 10 years worth of medical records.

The problem is, because ShootCert have to deal with all police forces of whom many say that they must be a full and complete history, they have to request the full history. They said that if they only provide a partial history and the police reject that, then the ShootCert application must be started all over again with a fresh fee paid and another delay.

I am nearly 66 years old and have continuously held a shotgun certificate since I was 15 yers old. Because of this fact, I do not see why I must submit a full medical history, or indeed, a full criminal record history. Contrary to modern belief, you cannot change history, so I would have thought that you should only be required to submit records for the last five years for any certificate renewal?

At my last renewal, my doctor carried out an interview in person and submitted the medical report all within a few days of my making an appointment at a cost of around £50. He also was very sympathetic to the process as they are a rural doctors, and fully understood the need for people to possess shotguns and firearms.

However, recently, they have decided to withdraw that service with no explanation as to why. It has certainly caused me a big headache. for which I will now have to make an appointment to get some painkillers. Lol.

I asked south Wales Police if I could just send them the last five years of my medical history, seeing that they were sent all my medical records right up to 2020 during my last renewal, but no, they wanted them all again!

[wyn]

Welsh police forces want full medical records from birth  for a grant and a renewal.

[welsh1]

1 hour ago, wyn said:

Welsh police forces want full medical records from birth  for a grant and a renewal.

Good luck with that, 9 years of my medical records are missing, well i say missing they are in a big hole in the sand in saudi arabia or kuwait along with many others.


I have just renewed with dyfed powys, they sent their letter early with the doctor letter, i took that to my surgery, a doctor i had never met looked through my records and a week later for £69 i had my form back.
Sent everything off, just before christmas had my home visit which was informative and helpful,we discussed me being arrested at least 7 times in the last 10 years lol. Two days ago had my certs back the old ones were due to run out on the 20th.

Spot on service from Dyfed Powys  Police.