craigfssnow Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Apologies for the wordiness and having re-read this it sounds very ignorant on my part but if anyone has any suggestions, I'd be grateful I have been very fortunate since receiving my FAC and shotgun certificate in that the FEO put me in touch with a farmer who gave me permission to shoot rabbits and pigeons on his land. He has two large fields, alongside his driveway that has a hedgerow splitting the two and the bunnies will feed around the hedge. Having parked the car adjacent to the hedge and lamping out of the passenger window, I realised that due to no backstop I had to concentrate on one warren which meant a 50 yard shot (.22 CZ so not ideal). THe farmer has told me that I am not permitted to drive my 4x4 on the fields themselves. The fields cannot be walked on as it comes up to your knees and will break an ankle with ease. I received a phonecall last week from the farmer who said that my car was making a mess of he mud around the hedge and in future I was to park at the house and walk. As I only have one warren to play with, I walk up to a suitable place to lean and the bunnies scarper. I don't see them again and there are no other fields to shoot, whilst I wait for them to come out to play. Another field (across an A-road) that has a bridle path (which the farmer locks) and is edge to edge mud. I asked the farmer if he would unlock the bridle path so I can get the car down it, which he refused. Walking along the bridle path, the bunnies hear you a mile off and there is no cover for the pigeons. I'm not even sure I'm allowed on the bridle path with a loaded firearm. I have asked the farmer about the backstops and he says there is a footpath, but nobody ever walks there!!! I have explained my concerns to him but I get the distinct impression that he wants my help without wanting to help me in any way. Excuse my ignorance gents and ladies but is this unhelpful attitude of the farmer to his vermin problem common? I appreciate that I am very lucky to have permission to shoot on such land but I'm getting a bit peed off with going out three times a week and coming back with a bunny a week. I am new to rifle shooting and am curious if farmers commonly want vermin sorted in such an unreasonable way or am I being over sensitive. I don't want to lose the permission as some shooting is better than no shooting. Thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J@mes Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 I'd tell him to relax his rules or stick it up his backside! all that time getting **** shooting on his land could be spent finding permission else where, on land that is stacked with rabbits and that you can actually get on to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 I'd say you need to learn to stalk a bit better, I'm a fine one to talk though being about as stealthy as a clumsy hippo Perhaps consider FAC air as a better tool for this close range reduced backstop work, still have to consider one but with vastly reduced energy you might get more shooting in. To a certain extent I'd say I side with you on the access issues, however at this time of year it's so wet it's just not possible to drive on the fields etc. He might well change his mind when it comes to summer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taz24 Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Apologies for the wordiness and having re-read this it sounds very ignorant on my part but if anyone has any suggestions, I'd be grateful or am I being over sensitive. I don't want to lose the permission as some shooting is better than no shooting. Thank you If it was me I would politely explain the situation to him again and if he is still adament he can't help you I would then tell him to shoot his own vermin. All the best taz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codling99 Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 a lot of farmers are a bit like that.a few farms that i shoot got a few strange rules,at different times of year depending on what they got going on at the time.on one farm i aint allowed there in september,cos his friend shoots ther,ok rest of year,and other farms ,wont let me on if sheep are out,just gotto put up with their rules,their land at end of day,you might find that over time,he might relax and let you do what you want .as for bridle ways,ive had a farm turned down for fac cos of a bridleway through it,so deff not allowed to walk it with gun,unless in case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead-Eyed Duck Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Farmers are entitled to be as difficult/unreasonable/difficult as they want to be as they own the shooting rights! Get a bipod for your rimmy and 50 yards shots will present no problems. Get in position 50 yards from the set an hour before dusk and lie down and wait for the rabbits to appear - wind direction will be critical. The only long-term solution is to get additional shooting elsewhere. In the meantime be as pleasant to the farmer as you can and who knows - after you have thinned out his rabbits ask him if he knows of any other local farmers with a similar problem - it once worked for me. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webber Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 If I found myself in your position I would act tactfully. I assume that this land is your only written permission, and that your FAC is restricted to named land. Do not fall out with this particular farmer, just go there occasionally when the weather is fine and suffer his restrictions. Use some of your time to find alternative land to shoot over, even if it has not been passed for FAC, but ensure that you get some which shows some promise. Most police forces will remove the land restriction on renewal after 5 years, some will remove the condition earlier. You can always apply for additional land to be added to your FAC following police inspection, but do your own risk assessment first. Once your FAC is opened up, you will be able to shoot land which has not been passed by police, but you must learn how to risk ***** and be confident that every shot is safe. Just consider it as serving your apprenticeship, in the meantime you may well get lucky and find some alternative land which has been passed. When you find it, you will no longer need your original farmer, or his restrictions. Land needs to be respected, shooting over someone else's property is a privilege, I doubt that you would really want someone calving up your back garden with a 4x4. That's probably how he sees it. webber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobt Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 If yo cannot hit a rabbit at 50 yds, you need to practice more? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 The Farmer doesn't want you driving on his fields and tracks because they are wet and you will churn them up. That sounds like a reasonable request to me and one that most of us are hearing at the moment. Learn to adapt. Have you thought about setting up as hide or two and waiting for the rabbits ? What about ferreting them ? The air rifle option sounds a good one. Also remember that the land will not be wet all year round. If you are so overloaded with shooting opportunities, then walk away from it. I wouldn't tell him to stuff his vermin shooting as some have suggested, or you might just find out what a wide communication network exists with Farmers and Landowners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webber Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 I also agree with Dead-Eyed-Ducks comments. A bipod, crossed sticks or even shoot off a thumb stick, and 50 yarders with a .22 rimmy should be the norm. webber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nildes Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Walk, stalk, put up a hide, be prepared to wait for a shot. No farmer wants their ground chewed up and compacted. Play by his rules or loose it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auto culto Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Just smile and play by the ground rules that have been layed out. Its really no hardship not being able to drive over "his" land and think of the good exercise you will be getting at the same time, plus you get to see lots more on foot than you would in a vehicle. It may be after all that he considers that a 4x4 will do more damage than a few bunnies. Its all in the name of "sport", if you want the warrens cleared totally get a couple of ferrets on the case otherwise just enjoy the fact that your outdoors with a gun and the chance to shoot something . By the sounds of it you need to learn more patience to accomplish your stalking skills. If it was that easy it wouldnt be fun anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lurcherboy Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Use a FAC air rifle and I echo Pins, Cranfields, and Webbers responses. LB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaggyRS6 Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Ferret and a Shotgun *note to self* Shut up about Ferrets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 *note to self* Shut up about Ferrets Don't! They are fantastic things and every single time I go out with them I have an absolutely cracking time! They just amaze me every single time, such specialised and accomplished hunter the ferret - A real pleasure to watch them work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ollywally Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 I agree with all the othrs but the farmer sholdnt lock a bridal path should he ? O W Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr lee Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 I agree with all the othrs but the farmer sholdnt lock a bridal path should he ?O W It depends if there is still access for a horse/pushbike to get down it. I'm guessing there is a gate also which gives access to the field and this is locked. We can't drive onto any of our shoots at the minute due to the wet ground. The farmers quad is actually stuck in his third field. Even he won't put his own landy on there to tow it out at the minute. You will just have to be patient and wait for things to dry up a bit. Also bear in mind he doesn't know you from Adam either so I would personally play by his rules all the way and not cause issues or moan about not being able to sit in your car and shoot. At least not until you know him much better. Moaning and causing problems will only end up in you losing that shoot and him talking to other farmers about kicking some 'arsey shooter..' off his land. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerico Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 There's hundreds of us out there that would give our left nuts for a bit of land, stop moaning about what you don't have and enjoy what you do! Get off your **** and go shooting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 I'm not certain what grounds you have to moan? I'm also quite surprised at some of the comments on here! If the farmers land is knee deep mud, the last thing he wants is you charging around in a 4x4 churning up his ground. That will cause huge problems for him later when he has to sort it all out (bigger problems than the rabbits cause). Be a little reasonable, this guys land is his living remember! Come summer he'll probably let you drive wherever you want. Unless I've missed something, it's you that's expecting too much from the situation. Sorry if I sound harsh, but I walk all my permissions when it's wet and wouldn't dream of driving across fields and rutting them up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigbob Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 Just play ball by his rules the now ,and get knocking on doors for more ground .His land might be differnt after it dry's out .See how it looks in a few months Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul223 Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 Don't know what your complaining about sounds like most farms, and farmers at this time of year. Before trying a bipod may I suggest trying a stick, this will give you greater angle to the ground hopefully driving the bullet into the earth. Practise your stalking, if you frighten the bunnies off it's not the farmers fault, try sitting 'camoed up' in a hedge down wind, don't pick the bunnies when shot just leave them until you have finished your shooting session, this method is particularly enjoyable in early spring with the warm sunny days. Always try to shoot from the bridle path end of the field out, so anyone using the path is not put in danger. And yes please practise and limit yourself to a range which you know you can hold a good group but most of all safe and happy hunting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul223 Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 Forgot to add, stick, two pieces of hazel bound together with a section of bike inner tube ( like a large elastic band), will also act like a third leg in that mud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 Do intelligent people drive across fields that aren't their own? I won't bore you all about the impact of soil compaction on crop yields, but I don't drive over any fields (mine or other farmers') unless it is immediately after harvest and pre-cultivation, or if I'm in a tractor working the land. It's guaranteed to infuriate any farmer if he sees you pootling around in a 4x4 on a field, rather than on a trackway. It affects his bottom line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dusk2dawn Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 I agree with all the othrs but the farmer sholdnt lock a bridal path should he ?O W It depends if there is still access for a horse/pushbike to get down it. I'm guessing there is a gate also which gives access to the field and this is locked. We can't drive onto any of our shoots at the minute due to the wet ground. The farmers quad is actually stuck in his third field. Even he won't put his own landy on there to tow it out at the minute. You will just have to be patient and wait for things to dry up a bit. Also bear in mind he doesn't know you from Adam either so I would personally play by his rules all the way and not cause issues or moan about not being able to sit in your car and shoot. At least not until you know him much better. Moaning and causing problems will only end up in you losing that shoot and him talking to other farmers about kicking some 'arsey shooter..' off his land. I may have missed it but this is the only post that mentions the way farmers talk to each other, upset one and you are marked in the area for some time, mud sticks Be polite to him and maintain a good relationship, but have a look round for a more shooter friendly permission. D2D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owenwill Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 Do intelligent people drive across fields that aren't their own? I won't bore you all about the impact of soil compaction on crop yields, but I don't drive over any fields (mine or other farmers') unless it is immediately after harvest and pre-cultivation, or if I'm in a tractor working the land. It's guaranteed to infuriate any farmer if he sees you pootling around in a 4x4 on a field, rather than on a trackway. It affects his bottom line. Wise words, I went across some our fields on the quad yesterday and even that made more of a mess than I would like. My Dad, who you might say is the "old school" type farmer nearly threw a guy in a ditch a few years back, the twit was fixing stiles for the council and he drove straight across recently sown winter wheat field Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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