Gordon R Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 My son and partner Julie own a kids nursery. One of the boundary walls is one side of an unadopted road, leading to four cottages. A spokesperson for the cottages has just visit the nursery to announce that they are having the road cobbled. During this process, they expect the foundations of the wall to be damaged and that any subsequent wall failure and repair will be down to my son and partner. My soon-to-be daughter in law queried this and the spokeperson said he had looked in to the matter and he was correct. My initial reaction was that he was an idiot. If someone damaged my wall, they would pay for it. No question. Any planners or legal eagles who can assist or point us in the right direction? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webber Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Mungler is really your man. I would take plenty of photographs now, before any work starts. Get the deads out for the property and start reading, or go and see your solicitor as soon as possible, ensure that the deads are available. webber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirnovember Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Mungler is really your man. I would take plenty of photographs now, before any work starts. Get the deads out for the property and start reading, or go and see your solicitor as soon as possible, ensure that the deads are available. webber arjimlad is your man Nice guy and knows his stuff. Went to bristol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 It certainly doesn't sound right, surely that would be criminal damage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirnovember Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 It certainly doesn't sound right, surely that would be criminal damage? It's not criminal damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter De La Mare Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Lots of info and experts on here. http://www.gardenlaw.co.uk/phpBB2/index.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J@mes Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 go to your local citizens advice office and speak to people there, try the council too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 sounds like they are talking rubbish, they won't be able to undermine the wall so it should be fine. However I would get a solicitors advice and at the least get a letter written instructing them that if their works causes damage to their property / wall that they will be liable for repairs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonevo Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 (edited) During this process, they expect the foundations of the wall to be damaged and that any subsequent wall failure and repair will be down to my son and partner. Whoever the contractor is will be liable for any damage,They will have to put the wall back to its orignal condition as before take photographs of the wall make sure its dated on the photo as proof is essential. also get someone from the council planning dept or your local councillor to also look at the wall,before any works are undertaken. A quick letter informin the afore mentioned spokesman ,making them aware of your concerns ,would not go a miss and also,get yourself a file or folder ready for the volume of paperwork etc... Edited February 6, 2009 by jonevo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Sounds like the wall in question is a Type A party fence wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
logstove Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 party wall act http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1996/Ukpga_19960040_en_1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davecooper1 Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 mate i have done a lot of unadopted roads over the yrs its my job to look and price the project up in this case i would tell the residents that this wall could be damaged and it would cost what ever that price would go on extra to my quote if i start the work and damage somebodys property then its down to me as the contractor definately look into the matter before the work starts i think there trying it on good luck mate cheers dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skippy Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 It really depends on who owns the wall. If damage is caused without consent and it belongs to the nursery, then it is criminal damage! My old force certainly would have encouraged an arrest for such behaviour. What are the grounds for the street being cobbled? Is it cobbled already or will it be a new addition? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted February 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Thanks for the replies so far. The road is gravel at the moment. The cottage residents want to upgrade to cobbles. No doubt it will be easier on their cars, cleaner and will increase the value of the property. Lad at the Council Highways, said Council would not become involved, even though it is a conservation area. He commented on the potential damage to the wall being my son's liabilty as "Cobblers". He said they should get legal advice and check the deeds. He siad that unadopted roads like these are normally jointly owned by the properties either side, with the boundary being in the middle. He said that the cottagers have a right of way which cannot be blocked. His advice was to let them do whatever they wanted with half the road (with the consent of the other owner), but refuse them permission to touch my son's half. This clearly depends on the deeds. My son, Julie and myself think that it is reasonable, as good neighbours, to let them upgrade, but with the proviso that they foot the bill for any damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexm Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 My son, Julie and myself think that it is reasonable, as good neighbours, to let them upgrade, but with the proviso that they foot the bill for any damage. That's pretty good of you considering their 'spokesperson' has basically tried to scam you into paying for damage they are planning to do to your property! Make sure you get any agreement in writing as they don't sound the most honourable of people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted February 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Julie and Martin thought they got okay with a couple of them and were a bit upset that they had said nothing. If it were my decision, I would make them pay to upgrade, but they have to live there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davecooper1 Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 you need everyone of the residents to sign an agreement but its very important you get the contractor to sign as well cheers dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arjimlad Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Hmm... Not so sure about the adjoining owners' stance on this. The Party Walls Act may be of assistance (but possibly not). The deeds need to be consulted to see who owns the wall. If both deeds are silent it may be deemed to be joint. If they damage the foundations it is their lookout. It is likely that the foundations have been in place long enough to have an "easement" by the passage of time to be present on the adjoining owner's property. The adjoining owner cannot just damage the foundations of the wall in this way. I think they've consulted some law about chopping tree branches off, which is not really the same as hacking out wall foundations ! Consult home insurance to see if you have legal expenses insurance, if so, try to use a local litigation specialist to advise. An injunction may be needed to prevent damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RC45 Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 speak to the local planning department as I am sure the landowner would need building regs, the council will put you right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 just tell em "**** right off". If they damage owt, call the poilce. :look: You cant go making a mess of peoples property and get away with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 Search on here for Party Wall Act - someone had something similar and I stuck all the links up - the Gov't's webby is rather useful in this regard. I have no idea how having the neighbouring road cobbled is likely to affect the foundations of the wall. As has been said, gather evidence and rather than see a solicitor see a surveyor who is an expert in such matters and who knows the Party Wall Act inside out - it does sound that the scope of works they are talking about may not be covered by the Act (depth of excavations, scope of works and proximity are relevant). The reason you should get a surveyor on board *now* is because if it gets near a Court these matters always end up being determined by expert evidence. The better the evidence and the expert the more likely that party will be to win (solicitors and judges cannot determine whether structural damage has happened or what caused it and or what the cost to repair will be - only an expert can). Indeed, having typed all this out it is my strongest advise you see a *surveyor*. I would also notify your insurers of what has been said and what is proposed - that way you are covered so well your bottom will be sweaty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arjimlad Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 http://www.partywalls.org.uk/index.asp A club of surveyors who profess expertise in PWA matters. They will know which local solicitors are experienced as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubix Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 We share a lot boundaries marked by stone walls with our neighbours and we are both responsible for maintenance, but only individually for repair if one of us causes the damage. Depends on who owns the wall. Even if your son and daughter do, the builders will still do some damage, as the man predicted. Now, my friend in Bristol came home from work to find his shared drive all dug out as his neighbours were having a new one laid. They did not ask him, and as they were paying for it assumed he would be OK with it. Which he would ahve been, but when he kicked off about not letting him know, vehicle access, piles of bricks etc the builder told him to ZXCV off. So he called the police and the builder was arrested and charged with criminal damage. The builder did the damage, not his neighbour, and had not checked that he could muck about with my friends drive. Chekc the deeds to see who owns the wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davecooper1 Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 gordon ask your lad to tell them ill give them a price for the job problem solved cheers dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted February 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 I'm meeting the spokesperson tomorrow, so will know more then. I suspect the rest of his neighbours have no idea what they are getting into. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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