mossy835 Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 what nice in laws you have,i would tell them two get stuffed and not speak two them again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nial Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 If they eat meat/chicken and don't exclusively buy organic I'd send them a copy of all Jamie Olivers programs about battery chickens and ask them how they live with themselves. Then ask them round for some 'free range' pigeon! Nial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wookie Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 how about offering to show them round your permission, then showing them all the wildlife that are not vermin and that you don't shoot. then pointing out the various studies from the GCWT and the like about vermin shooting actually increasing biodiversity? You could also mention that the RSPB shoot vermin on their reserves. If that doesn't work, wee in their shoes and never talk to them again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 The complaints may be more inspired by the clay shoots, than a desire to protect wildlife. In my area there is obviously crop protection shooting going on all year round, but as most people are at work in the week, they don't notice it too much. Its also not every day, not in the same place and probably rarely more than 100+ shots in a full day. The weekend non stop shooting for 5-6 hours of a clay shoot, is what people complain about. Two attempts locally to set up a "straw bale" layout, have been killed by noise complaints to the Landowners. One was planned to be fortnightly and one monthly, neither was within 400 yards of a house. Whilst both would have satisfied the local Council, etc., the Landowners gave in to the complaints. If I was you, I would ignore the comments completely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytie Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 If you behave calmly and rationally, point out the law on clay shooting on private land, which is as Baldrick says, 28 days in a calender year. Explain the law to them, find the exact quotes and references from the law, and agree with their right to protest. We all have that right. You also have the right to ignore them. You could do an informal survey of the wildlife on the land and list the species found, show them how you manage the habitat and what you do to encourage wildlife in your consevation areas. You could also point out to them that living anywhere involves being tolerant of your neighbours. Your mate the farmer could put a muck heap in the field next to their house (chicken or pig **** for perference) but he probably doesn't because he is considerate. If after doing all that you still cannot reach an accord, explain to them that much as it will hurt their daughter and that it saddens you to do so, you will no longer have anything to do with them as they obviously are trying to make your life a misery. I would be surprised if they are perfect and have not annoyed anyone with their behaviour in the past. ft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 how about offering to show them round your permission, then showing them all the wildlife that are not vermin and that you don't shoot. then pointing out the various studies from the GCWT and the like about vermin shooting actually increasing biodiversity? You could also mention that the RSPB shoot vermin on their reserves. If that doesn't work, wee in their shoes and never talk to them again. Nice idea Wookie, but some folk dont want to be educated in what is going on. waste of time. Id rather not speak to them again. I assume my last suggestion was not suitable then? (it got "mod'ed") Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurstpol Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) 1. I would never speak to them again. 2. It is the farmers duty to make sure pests are controlled on his land, it is a legal requirement 3. you are in a rural setting it is your right to pursue lawful activities, and they are interfering with your human right to pursue those activities, threaten to sue! The Police will not get involved! the local council has no right to interfere in lawful activities tell them to do their worst !!!! Edited June 7, 2009 by hurstpol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullbore Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 I believe that current planning law provides the owner/occupier the right to use the land for shooting clays for a total of 28 days in any calendar year, before needing planning permission Not strictly true. It is a get round of planning laws. Any activity requiring planning permission can be carried out for 28 days a year without planning. It is not specific to clay shooting, but is used by a number of clay shooting clubs, including one I was a member of. It is why a lot of clubs only shoot fortnightly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullbore Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 2. It is the farmers duty to make sure pests are controlled on his land, it is a legal requirement3. you are in a rural setting it is your right to pursue lawful activities, and they are interfering with your human right to pursue those activities, threaten to sue! The Police will not get involved! the local council has no right to interfere in lawful activities tell them to do their worst !!!! Point 2 is not pertinent to clay shooting 3 well you may like to think that is true but it's not. Like I said in an earlier post, companies have been closed due to noise pollution, churches have been made to stop ringing their bells, and farmers have been banned from keeping chickens, all due to noise, so the council do have a right to interfer in lawful activity, when it causes inconvenience to others, and as for the police not getting involved, all it needs is a phone call saying there's a man with a gun in camo clothing and watch what turns up. That is a popular tactic with the nimbys when they want to get shooting stopped. I think a lot of PW'ers have experience of being accosted by the helicopter and an armed squad while they have been going about their lawful business Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurstpol Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 Point 2 is not pertinent to clay shooting 3 well you may like to think that is true but it's not. Like I said in an earlier post, companies have been closed due to noise pollution, churches have been made to stop ringing their bells, and farmers have been banned from keeping chickens, all due to noise, so the council do have a right to interfer in lawful activity, when it causes inconvenience to others, and as for the police not getting involved, all it needs is a phone call saying there's a man with a gun in camo clothing and watch what turns up. That is a popular tactic with the nimbys when they want to get shooting stopped. I think a lot of PW'ers have experience of being accosted by the helicopter and an armed squad while they have been going about their lawful business 1. he has 500 acres, god the sound of a firearm would be lost in that size of acreage. 2. he did say he was shooting other than clays as well. 3. we all risk the wrath of a nimby when it comes to a call to the police about a man with a gun, there are a few things he can do in his situation,if the police come out he must comply and cooperate with them, he can carry a copy of his permission letter and the farmers phone number so the Police Officer who checks him out can do the necessary checks, he can ring the Police Before he goes shooting and let them know where he will be, also he can get the Police to check the source of the complaint, and if it turns out to be the In laws being malicious, the Police can take a dim view of it and consider wasting Police time , he has the right to pursue a complaint against anyone who accuses him of any offence and the Police must assist him if it turns out to be malicious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullbore Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 1. he has 500 acres, god the sound of a firearm would be lost in that size of acreage.2. he did say he was shooting other than clays as well. 3. we all risk the wrath of a nimby when it comes to a call to the police about a man with a gun, there are a few things he can do in his situation,if the police come out he must comply and cooperate with them, he can carry a copy of his permission letter and the farmers phone number so the Police Officer who checks him out can do the necessary checks, he can ring the Police Before he goes shooting and let them know where he will be, also he can get the Police to check the source of the complaint, and if it turns out to be the In laws being malicious, the Police can take a dim view of it and consider wasting Police time , he has the right to pursue a complaint against anyone who accuses him of any offence and the Police must assist him if it turns out to be malicious. I think it is the clay shooting that is the problem. The sound of a shotgun pointing in the sky(at clays) will carry more than 500 acres. I have been to the police station to report that I will be shooting in a particular field (surrounded by houses and an hotel) due to experiences of complaints in the past and STILL had the helicopter and armed response team to deal with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utectok Posted June 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) Thanks once again to all the thoughtful comments this is the email I had from pop in law this morning..... I'm glad we spoke, even though the shooting issue may never be resolved. I appreciated the fact that you would clearly like to find a compromise if you could do so without sacrificing your own values, though sadly we don't know how this is possible. But the fact remains that the sound of the gun invades a wide space, and those of us who are within range have no choice about being subjected to it, whether we like it or not. It would be different if you went to a shooting range where we could choose to either go there or not. As it is, there is no escaping the effect, which at first is only small, but when it goes on week after week it is different. As I was driving away I had the image of people sitting around a pond enjoying reflections of the trees and the patterns of wind playing on the surface, but one person insisting on his right to throw stones in .. We are lucky to live in a very quiet place where we can hear many natural sounds, so the sound of a gun always and inevitably comes as a shock. You say it would not be fair if I was to survey the opinions of people living around, but then is it fair for one person to subject everyone to the sound of a gun without asking them first? Perhaps 50% of people actually like the sound of a gun, and 50% don't, in which case it would be stalemate, but as the figures could be quite different it might be decent to find out first. My motivation for talking to you was in part because I suspect that you simply do not know the depth of feeling aroused by the sound of your gun. When you are behind the trigger you probably have a very different perspective from the rest of us. It is, of course, not just the sound of a gun; it is also the knowledge that the effect of using one is more often than not to kill, maim or frighten other lives, whether those be of birds, animals or people, which rarely strikes a pleasurable emotion in anyone. In so far as it frightens away the wildlife, m-in-l reports no longer seeing deer or hares in the fields, or red squirrels or the buzzard down the track. We also no longer see or hear barn owls or tawny owls , nor are there any ring doves. There may be other explanations, but surely this is some sort of evidence, albeit on a small scale? By the way, did you know that pigeons mate for life? Edited June 7, 2009 by utectok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utectok Posted June 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) And this is my reply.......... Sorry there is no easy way to sort this, as for yesterday I had arranged to shoot clays with (farmers name) for some time so I did not want to blow him off and as you know I do not usually fire at clays near you or indeed shoot that many when I am on the hill which in any case you cannot hear. I suspect shooting with (farmers name) will be a rare occurrence, although he did ask me to shoot his farmyard feral pigeons so there might be the odd bang here and there. I would be grateful if you could direct your aggrievedness to the shooting community more generally as this seems a point of principle with you. Although I am an easy target it seems inconsistent to single me out and a very NIMBY way of expressing your grievances. Any wildlife studies need to be more subjective to bear any weight in my mind might I suggest you contact BASC who spend alot of money on this kind of research and are very helpful in my experience. I am sure with your goodwill and a little coercion you could get a large number of people to sign your petition or whatever it is you are planning, like wise if I was so minded I could get a lot of people who support shooting to stand up and be counted. However I shall not be entering any tat-a-tate with you or anyone else on the matter, as far as I am aware I am within the law and behaving responsibly and I shall try to be as sensitive to your concerns as I can be. You could of course petition the local MP and try and get the laws changed in which case good luck it will be a long struggle but if it is something you believe strongly is probably the best route to take. If you are interested in the lives of the pigeon I have a number of books that go into it in some detail and I have seen deer when out jogging most mornings. Sorry this has come to such an impasse and perhaps it will be quieter in the winter as I shall be shooting on the syndicate shoot quite a bit. Yours Edited June 7, 2009 by utectok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullbore Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 Honest opinion? Father in law sounded reasonable, your reply sounded confrontational JMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperfection Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) If it was me-i'd let them get on with their petition cos theres nothing they can do provided you're legitemate.Dont get nasty or vindictive as all you'll do is confirm their possible opinion of you and might eventually drag your missus into the arguement as well.Infact being as pleasant as possible will likely to irritate them enough to realise their wrong. Edited June 7, 2009 by Imperfection Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groach1234 Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 He comes across reasonably but then again seems stubborn on the matter at the same time saying a compromise may not be met, i find it hard for people to live in the country side and not expect to hear the noise of a gun, the vermin has to be controlled. From my house we can hear crow scarers on near by farms and living near grass track course thing on regular occasions all you can hear is the distance revving of engines not far off, however this does not bother me at all, you just accept other people are having fun and deal that it is not any real inconvenience to you and deal with this. It is one of those things, in the country side people have guns, and use them, and in the case of protection of crops then people should accept it. It is like people complaining about the smell of muck spreading, its how it happens in the country and deal with it simple as. George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 By responding, you are inviting a counter response and so it goes on. They do not have a legitimate complaint with you, they should speak to the Landowner, have you wondered why they haven't ? You really should ignore their complaints completely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullbore Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 He comes across reasonably but then again seems stubborn on the matter at the same time saying a compromise may not be met, i find it hard for people to live in the country side and not expect to hear the noise of a gun, the vermin has to be controlled. From my house we can hear crow scarers on near by farms and living near grass track course thing on regular occasions all you can hear is the distance revving of engines not far off, however this does not bother me at all, you just accept other people are having fun and deal that it is not any real inconvenience to you and deal with this. It is one of those things, in the country side people have guns, and use them, and in the case of protection of crops then people should accept it. It is like people complaining about the smell of muck spreading, its how it happens in the country and deal with it simple as. George You are entirely correct George, but the simple fact is that not everyone thinks the same as we do, likes the same things we like, or has a live and let live attitude. Townies have moved into the country and got churches to stop ringing their bells of a Sunday morning. Farmers have been stopped from keeping roosters for the early morning crowing, so PLEASE don't anyone fall into the complacent trap and thing because what you do is legal and part and parcel of country life you will be able to carry on. Fox hunting anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEREALTHRILLER Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 This is a terrible shame, bl**dy in-laws. I don't know what I would do in the same situation.I would have to resist the urge to tell them to go and **** themselves. I would stop all forms of communication as by the sounds of it you are never going to see eye to eye or reach any sort of any compromise but I would certainly not be bullied into stopping something that I love to do. After all, you are doing nothing wrong and at least the farmer is on your side. All the best mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
libs Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 Take the petition, put it in a shoebox and fill the box up with the crops of week old dead corvids. Leave for a few more days in the sun then ask them to recycle the paper they wasted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 Your father-in-law sounds like a superb candidate for natural deselection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) There's no way on earth I'd put up with that. I'd go around their house, kick off big time and tell them you think they are complete ******* ####s for doing something like this to you. Really throw the toys out of the pram and get offensive so they know you really mean it. Then I would never visit or have them in my house if I was in ever again. Screw them, I'd hate them for life for doing something like that. If your mrs doesn't like your attitude then **** her off too. Are you really prepared to put up with that for the rest of your life for the sake of a bit of fluff? Get a new one with a better outlook on life! I'd rather **** a fat ugly field sport supporter than a fit anti Edited June 7, 2009 by njc110381 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 I'd rather **** a fat ugly field sport supporter than a fit anti If it all fails to work, then i suggest you video yourself doing your missus doggy style and send it to her dad with a note saying when im not shooting this is my other favorite hobby. Outstanding, gentlemen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markbivvy Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 I'd rather **** a fat ugly field sport supporter than a fit anti evilmad.gif give davek a ring. :hmm: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lloyd90 Posted June 7, 2009 Report Share Posted June 7, 2009 Disregarding my initial reply... I can only say if it were me, I'd tell them to go right ahead. But, that I would never speak to anyone named on that list ever again, I'd never attend any function, family or other that any of them would attend, would never help them out if I was in a position to, and so forth. I'm actually not joking. That's such a pitifully small thing to do. I'd also tell them to go **** themselves. I too would tell them to go **** themselves Who the hell do they think they are! I sure as hell wouldn't have them round my house again!!! Don't give an ince mate they'll take a fookin mile!!! Lucky ur mrs wont get involved! If she did n it was me the bitch would have to go! hahaha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.