turbo33 Posted June 17, 2012 Report Share Posted June 17, 2012 I took the .17hmr for a zeroing session today. Its a new CZ 455 thumbhole,wildcat whisper mod, secondhand Mamba lite 4-16x44. When I picked it up, the guys in the shop said Hornaday 17gr. vmax £10 a box, or remmington at £15. They suggested I try both to see if I found the Hornadays ok, different rifles etc. So we decided to pump off the cheaper Hornadays to bed the rifle in an get on zeroe., After 25 rounds, its still seemed all over the place. Ran out of adjustment on the scope, so tried Frenchie boys trick of turning the mounts round. Minimal difference. One minute a shot was close to bull the next it wasn't even hitting the target, at 25 yds :o Mod off, no difference. Starting to suspect the scope at this stage, we pumped off the last 5 of the Hornadays. Managing to get 2 close to the bull, we changed to the remmingtons. 3 shots, bang on Put the target out to 50yds, 2 close, small adjustment on the scope for elevation...3 in a pencil sized cloverleaf Ben and I quipped we won't be using Hornadays again then Puzzled about them, we examined the spent brass and found of 50 rounds 19 looked like the one in the picture :o :o Shocking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweedledee Posted June 17, 2012 Report Share Posted June 17, 2012 i think remington are the best out there. hornady are next best for me.difference of 8 quid a box here. hornady will do me. shot 150 odd yesterday with one slow burner,can live with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtailhawk1 Posted June 17, 2012 Report Share Posted June 17, 2012 You must have a bad batch. I have never had a problem with them at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben 990 Posted June 17, 2012 Report Share Posted June 17, 2012 Always used Hornadys because that's what my local gun shop stocked had no problem with them, sub inch groups at 120 yds then they changed to Remingtons can't shoot tighter than 2 inches at the same range and they don't seam to kill as well and I had a case split the other night out lamping. Seams to be a bit of a lottery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matone Posted June 17, 2012 Report Share Posted June 17, 2012 You must have a bad batch. I have never had a problem with them at all. +1 ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blunderbuss Posted June 17, 2012 Report Share Posted June 17, 2012 Hornady are incredibly accurate in my rifle. I've noticed the odd split case but it hasn't affected the accuracy one iota. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay222 Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 I mainly use remingtons but have used hornady with no problem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay222 Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 (edited) Double post Edited June 18, 2012 by jay222 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbo33 Posted June 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 Must have been a seriously duff batch then Might give them the benefit of doubt then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 I wouldnt worry too much about the cases, its not like your going to reload them I found the HMR's quite bullet fussy, at one time i could only shoot feds now its Hornady, strange things these rifles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 There was an article in sporting rifle this month about it, they had it with HMR and HM2 rounds and on the HMR there were very small cracks visible before firing which then opened into larger ones. Part of the issue is the case necks apparently can't be annealed the other side is the thin cracks let in moisture causing the slow burns and iffy accuracy if you get a bad batch. Allegedly its been sorted but presumably there is lots of stock ammo floating about so will be an issue for a while yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bewsher500 Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 can you stick the batch numbers up in the HMR spreadsheet please all valuable info https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Au0f-ch1y3-2dGZuR01jaC02U0UtR2hsc3FQSjZLM3c#gid=0 http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/208016-hmr-ammunition-database-please-add-your-batch-numbers/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildfowler.250 Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 I wouldnt worry about the split cases..as has been said, it's apparently an annealing problem. The blue/red hornadys/winchesters work grand in my CZ but I wouldn't thank you for Remingtons...just pot luck I guess. Although I may have got given a duff 200 rounds but the Remingtons weren't half as explosive as the other makes. Yet some people swear by them. Just stick with what works Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hornet 6 Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 I wouldnt worry about the split cases..as has been said, it's apparently an annealing problem. I really don't understand this attitude The case provides the gas seal that contains the burning charge that sends the bullet down the range, if the case is split some of the charge is wasted, and so the bullet will be travelling slower, hence the rubbish groups. I have never had this with HMR but suffered badly with an HM2, bad enough the shop took the rifle back and refunded all the money spent including that wasted trying to find decent ammo from 3 other shops. Has anybody tried measuring the neck diameter of an unfired round, and then after firing (one that did not split) this will give you a good idea of the chamber neck dimension, nothing you can do about it, but it would tell you if it is an ammo or rifle problem. Neil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildfowler.250 Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 I really don't understand this attitude The case provides the gas seal that contains the burning charge that sends the bullet down the range, if the case is split some of the charge is wasted, and so the bullet will be travelling slower, hence the rubbish groups. I have never had this with HMR but suffered badly with an HM2, bad enough the shop took the rifle back and refunded all the money spent including that wasted trying to find decent ammo from 3 other shops. Has anybody tried measuring the neck diameter of an unfired round, and then after firing (one that did not split) this will give you a good idea of the chamber neck dimension, nothing you can do about it, but it would tell you if it is an ammo or rifle problem. Neil. Sorry i'll rephrase. I thought the cases were splitting on firing. I've seen emails to and from Hornady about this problem and they said its nothing to worry about. If they are badly cracked out of the box then I'd take them back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 yep if they are cracked before firing its an issue and one particularly so as it lets moisture in. Thats where the real problem is, if they are fine and group ok but have cracked cases after firing I'd be less worried Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hornet 6 Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 Sorry i'll rephrase. I thought the cases were splitting on firing. I assumed that too, as surely nobody who spotted one with a crack straight out of the box would actually load it in a gun ? The cases that crack on firing are still affecting the bullets performance. The old excuse that the case cannot be annealed after the priming compound is injected is just that, an excuse. No you can't do it after priming, so do it before, just means they need to adapt the machine rather than just use the same machine that primes all the .22 brass. Somebody is going to get hurt in the end, and the number of problems with hmr ammo across all the forums, and what I have seen in gun shops across the country is what prompted me to get shot of mine, before I had to start using new ammo that may or may not work as it should. Neil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deiseboy Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 I hope ye realise hornady, remington, winchester, federal and cci 17gr v-max are all made in the same factories using all the same components. the only difference is the colour of the bullet. Could have just been a bad batch. split casings would mean it was effecting the accuracy. CCI, Federal, Winchester, Remington and Hornady all loaded here at CCI in Lewiston, Idaho with a V-max bullet are identical, with the exception of tip color. Manufactured on the same equip, to the same ballistic specs, using the same components other than color of the tip of the bullets. Obviously the shellcase 'head stamp' and packaging would be different on the various products. Linda Olin CCI/Speer Technical Services 2299 Snake River Ave. Lewiston, ID 8350 The zero and quality on ammo can vary from each batch. These split casings are obviously a bad batch and you should contact them about it. I had a casing blow out its end and crack up 5mm from the end of the casing and left me deaf for about a minute on saturday, I emailed CCI and they offered to have the ammo sent back for inspection and they would cover all the costs, refund the ammo with extra ammo so their customer care is clearly good. The extra price you pay for remmy is purely for the brand name. I pay the same for each here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildfowler.250 Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 Deiseboy, they may all be from same factory ect but they definitely don't all shoot the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben 990 Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 They've got different powder in as well Remingtons smell completely different to Hornadys when you fire them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbo33 Posted June 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 They've got different powder in as well Remingtons smell completely different to Hornadys when you fire them. Yup noticed that too Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brown Sauce Posted June 19, 2012 Report Share Posted June 19, 2012 I've found the cci 20gr soft point the best in my cz452 .17hmr. Out of a 100 rounds, maybe 1 case will split very slighty at the neck. I'd give the Winchester 20gr a very wide berth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gimlet Posted June 20, 2012 Report Share Posted June 20, 2012 (edited) My rifle likes Winchester 17 grn. Hates Remingtons, tolerates hornadys but throws 1 out of 5 wild. Haven't tried Federal, though their CF ammo is excellent. They definitely don't all shoot the same in my rifle. I get a few split necks but it doesn't seem to effect accuracy. Never seen a split base though, something very wrong there. You definitely have to find the round that suits your rifle not just try and get by with what your local dealer stocks. If you have to travel get a larger allowance on your ticket to make it worth it. I have had rifles, cartridge and air-rifles, which have 'gone off' their usual rounds for no obvious reason and I've had to find something else. I've no idea why that should be. EDIT: well I do know why, its because manufacturers change something the swine, and send you make to square one. Edited June 20, 2012 by Gimlet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 20, 2012 Report Share Posted June 20, 2012 I hope ye realise hornady, remington, winchester, federal and cci 17gr v-max are all made in the same factories using all the same components. the only difference is the colour of the bullet. Could have just been a bad batch. split casings would mean it was effecting the accuracy. The zero and quality on ammo can vary from each batch. These split casings are obviously a bad batch and you should contact them about it. I had a casing blow out its end and crack up 5mm from the end of the casing and left me deaf for about a minute on saturday, I emailed CCI and they offered to have the ammo sent back for inspection and they would cover all the costs, refund the ammo with extra ammo so their customer care is clearly good. The extra price you pay for remmy is purely for the brand name. I pay the same for each here. Cracks on the shoulder are an everyday occurrence, but those on the rim don't look good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted June 20, 2012 Report Share Posted June 20, 2012 Gosh if i still owned a HMR i would deffo be selling it, this sort of think is comming up every fortnight now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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