Pigeons with a 410

[Liam-1990]

Hi all,

 

Ive been having a pop at some pigeons with my suppressed .410 using No 6, 2 and 2 1/2 inch shells,

got a low pigeon at about 40 yrds with a 2 inch shell I must have been very lucky with that shot.

but I cant seem to get any more,

I know Im going to get replies saying use a 12G but I like the 410 because its quiet,

Has anyone got any tips for shooting pigeons it flight with a .410

the choke in the gun is fixed and I think is improved choke

Thanks

[M.I.A]

You must have been very very lucky to bring down a 40 yarder with a 2" 410 cart

 

Perhaps try reducing you range to say 25 yards tops with 2 1/2" carts ?

[Liam-1990]

I was it was only about 15ft off the ground and flying away from me so it made it abit easier but, I cant hit anything else I had a few feathers off a high ish one but it didnt drop,

Im even missing the closer birds now cant understand it, getting frustrated with myself and the gun.

[tomhw100]

Sounds to me like your expecting to much from that gun my friend......an experienced and skill full shot can take relatively long shots with a 410'but I'd still say for most of us 40 yards is well well out of range especially with a 2" cartridge!! It also shows disregard to your quarry if your not able to dispatch them humanely. I'd practice on clays with the 410 before using it on live quarry again,to grasp the guns limits and maximum effective range.

Edited August 7, 2012 by tomhw100

[bruno22rf]

Doesn't really matter how good you are with the gun-a .410 simply does not throw enough lead to enable humane shots to be taken at anywhere near 40 yards-stop doing it.

[Liam-1990]

To be fair the 40yrd shot went down clean, it was dead before it hit the floor, but Im missing the closer shots now maybe I am expecting too much from the gun, will be taking 12 bore out for pigeons soon now crops are being cut, il take it with me for some practice.

thanks for the replies.

[humperdingle]

What .410 load are you using? Assuming a 3" cart containing 18 grams of shot, that isn't many balls of shot. Particularly if it's a game cart of size 6 shot.

 

That being the case, 40 yards is a looooooong way for such a small amount of shot to give a decent pattern.

 

As mentioned already, stick to clays until you're consistently breaking them, and even then, under 25 yards.

[Hamster]

Suppressed 410's are very hard to shoot anyway owing to poor dynamics of weight/balance etc coupled to an awkward and unfamiliar sight picture at the barrel end. Also as others have mentioned the problem is simply one of inadequate amounts of lead being thrown too, the only way around it to familiarise yourself with the POI and keep ranges very short.

[silver pigeon 3]

I had a .410 for a while and it was very difficult to shoot well. As an example i shot a round of 50 sporting with my normal 12g clay gun and scored a decent 43, changed to the .410 for the 2nd round (which my score usually improves) and shot 27!! On some of the more tricky targets you could hear a few pellets hit the clay, but it flew on without damage.

I think .410's are great for the right situation, but they are very limited in what they can do consistently.

[kent]

Hi all,

 

Ive been having a pop at some pigeons with my suppressed .410 using No 6, 2 and 2 1/2 inch shells,

got a low pigeon at about 40 yrds with a 2 inch shell I must have been very lucky with that shot.

but I cant seem to get any more,

I know Im going to get replies saying use a 12G but I like the 410 because its quiet,

Has anyone got any tips for shooting pigeons it flight with a .410

the choke in the gun is fixed and I think is improved choke

Thanks

 

I have a little .410 here with full choke and pattern fails at 25 yds with 3" shells. individual pellets can kill at the same range as any other shotgun if it stikes the correct spot but the frequency will be rare. Reduce your ranges

[EdSolomons]

as above- the 40 yarder wasa fluke, particularly if flying away from you. Limit to 25 yards absolute max. Shoot at a cardboard box at 40 yards and see the gaps in the pattern, that should show you why 40 yards is way too far.

[Dangerous Brian]

As you are using a hushpower I assume you are using using Eley fibre wads (could well be wrong on that though). That gives you 12.5g of shot in 2 .5 inch or 18g in 3 inch flavour. The smallest shot size i have ever found in those is an English 6 which through my gun gives some amazing holes in the pattern at 30yds, even with the 3 inch. If you want consistency at range you need to get the number of pellets up by either going down on the shotsize and/ or increasing the payload. The only options you have are going for something like a Fiocchi shell with 19.5g of something like 2.3mm shot (problem being it uses a full length shot cup) or load your own (much more fun). There will be a split in opinion as to whether #7.5 shot is big enough for pigeon but I think if you stick to sensible .410 ranges there is plenty of knock down power with the advantage of (the chance of) more pellet strikes over say #6. The .410 will never be a 40 yard gun but can be made into an effective little hunter at decoying ranges.

[Hamster]

If there was ever a gun that talks a good game..................................

[sitsinhedges]

I'm always amazed at how that chap in Sporting Gun, Richard Brigham I think, always seems to fill his bag with a pump action moderated .410. He must be a remarkable shot and be able to bring them in very close.

Personally I use a moderated 20gauge for most of my decoying and that is very capable, killing pretty much anything that a normal gun would but I do use 30grams of 5 in my homeloads and they are proving to be devastating to the birds. The farmers rarely hear it popping away so I can use it in places I wouldn't use a normal shottie without upsetting anyones weekend.

[Hamster]

I think he uses it in the right situations and as you say brings them in close. He probably has more pigeon permission than most of us too so can pick and choose. I really fancy getting hold of one of those 20 bores though.

[Full Pelt]

I can see the attraction of using a moderated .410 in terms of it's weight, length and handling ; the rub is that range really comes down to load and there is little choice.

 

A 20g Hushpuppy that wasn't the length of a broomstick and the width of a drainpipe will be worth waiting for, here's hoping as there's a good choice of ammo, they are not loud and they are increasing in popularity.

[bicykillgaz]

I've had a few real good days decoying crows with a .410 but that was using 3" fiocchi magnums 19g no6 at 25 yards max also used some 14g no6 for roosting.

 

I think there a very capable gun so long as you know there limits and stick within them, I love them my next gun is gonna be an o/u .410 to go with the bolt action I've got.

[turbo33]

I've had a few real good days decoying crows with a .410 but that was using 3" fiocchi magnums 19g no6 at 25 yards max also used some 14g no6 for roosting.

 

I think there a very capable gun so long as you know there limits and stick within them, I love them my next gun is gonna be an o/u .410 to go with the bolt action I've got.

 

Me too!! My 410's are keepers. I've had some cracking days with them. I have full and 3/4 choke in mine and concentrate on getting the birds to decoy into the 25-30 yard kill zone. Happy days!!

[bedwards1966]

I'm sorry to say it, but you probably need to limit your range. As already said, pattern can fail at distance, and although in theory they do have the same killing power/energy as a 12, the difficulty is getting the shot on target.

Moderators make it even harder, I suggest having a go at some pattern boards to give you an idea of where it shoots (I think many find them to shoot quite low), and also to see how far out you can go without losing pattern.

 

A brilliant gun, I think .410's are fantastic (pity about the absurd cartridge prices), but with so few pellets through what is normally full choke, your aim has to be perfect.

[Tod]

ive shot pigeons with my bolt action .410 at 35 yards and maybe a little further but thats with 3" shells, wouldnt dream of shooting a moderated using 2" shells at pigeons past 20 yards

[Liam-1990]

The cartridges I have been using are Lyalvale No 6. 2 and 2-1/2 cartridges have also had ago with some old winchester No7-1/2. 2-1/2 inchs had a magpie out a tree clean kill with the winchesters but was only 15yrds max,

I have done a little pattern testing at 10 and 30 yrds, at 10 yards the pattern was aroung 8-10 inchs and at 30 was around 2 feet with the odd pellet out the pattern,

will be getting some 3inch cartridges to give me a little more chance but will keep the range to about 25yrds goin to have ago at decoying a few pigeons with it saturday so will let you know how I get on

[sterling]

I've gone from consistently missing roosting pigeons with my full choke 410 mossberg hushpower, to preferring it to my 12gauge. It's taken a year, but here's what I've found:

 

As others have already said; pluck up the courage to take your 410 around the sporting clays. Forget about scores, swallow your pride and persevere with it. Load your own or track down a decent 14 or 16gram #7 load. Don't cheat and go any smaller with shot size on clays, because with your 410 you need to practise with the shells you plan to shoot. From extensive patterning, I've found you get diminishing returns going over 16 gram. The magnum shot string is loooooong, pellet deformation is high and patterns can be worse than lighter loads. i.e. don't bother with eley extralong subsonics. On that note, also don't bother using subsonics in 410, they're not quieter. It defies physics, but thems the facts.

 

As to using plastic wads through your hushpower; there are several threads about that which you should read. I personally now feel safe(ish) using short plastic wads (up to 14gram). I wouldn't shoot a heavy 3" plastic through the moderator and saddlery and gun room will tell you the same thing.

 

With full choke and 16gram #7, I don't take shots at any game over 30 yards. The exception is sitting rabbits with 16 gram #5 out to 35 yards. I take a field tape measure and put a marker in the ground at 30 yards. Anything beyond that stick doesn't get shot at. You have to start being accurate with the 410, both with your shooting and estimating range. If you want to take a 40 yard bird on the wing again, get a 20 gauge.

[Liam-1990]

Sterling you've restored my faith I will stick at it and try and learn the patterns abit better, thanks

[brentus]

use maintained lead instead of swinging through,works for me when using my baikal hushpower

[bicykillgaz]

 

A brilliant gun, I think .410's are fantastic (pity about the absurd cartridge prices), but with so few pellets through what is normally full choke, your aim has to be perfect.

 

 

I don't think there that dear I was paying £65 a slab for fiocchi magnums 19g when I had my little anschutz bot action, if you look at the lead per round yeah it's dear but ive paid that sort of money for 250 12g cartridges, I try to just think of it as I'm getting 250 shots for a certain price rather than x-amount of grams of lead for a certain price.

 

I wish I still had my anschutz it was a cracking gun it was choked 1/4 which seemed to suit the fiocchi as they patterned great at 25yards which was what I tried to keep within when decoying.