Confirmed WH Smith have believed Animal Aid and implemented ban

[Highbird70]

I had that generic email too, and responded directly to it with a politely worded request to listen to my points and not send me a catch-all email. I then got this reply from their head of customer services:

 

She sent me ot it.....same e-mail.....

 

 

Dear Mark

 

 

 

 

Thank you for your further e mail which has been passed to me as Head of Customer Services for investigation and response.

 

 

 

I apologise if you feel that our initial reply did not sufficiently address all of your previous concerns.

 

 

 

I would like to assure you that WHSmith respects the views expressed by all customers. We are therefore now in the process of assimilating all of this further feedback, to assist us in looking into this issue.

 

 

 

If I can be of any further assistance at any point , please do not hesitate to contact me.

 

 

 

 

 

Juliette Cavilla

 

Head of Customer Services

 

 

 

 

 

From: Mark

Sent: 15 October 2012 15:08

To: Tyler, Joanne

Subject: RE:

 

 

 

So What you saying...its that the kids that would like to purchase a shooting magazine....that by the way, by law there is no age restriction, will have to go and choose them on the top shelve where you keeping porn....wow well done...your very best of ex customer

 

 

________________________________

 

Subject:

Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:32:17 +0100

From: joanne.tyler@whsmith.co.uk

To: Mark

Dear Customer

 

 

 

Thank you for your email.

 

 

 

WHSmith aims to offer our customers choice, whilst striking the right balance and not acting as a censor. WHSmith seeks to do its best to satisfy all of its customers who often have strongly opposing views. We aim to display all of our magazines in locations where they are accessible to those who want to buy them, but do not offend those who do not. The till prompt system has been in place for many years on a range of different products and this has not previously been an issue for customers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

***********************************************************************

The information contained within this e-mail is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee only. If you have received the e-mail in error, please inform the sender or contact the WHSmith IT Security Manager, on +44 (0) 1793 562175, and delete it from your system. The contents of this e-mail must not be disclosed to anyone else or copied without the sender's consent.

 

Any views and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of WHSmith. WHSmith does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. No WHSmith employees are authorised to conclude contracts on behalf of WHSmith by means of e-mail communications. Please note that neither WHSmith nor the sender accepts any responsibility for viruses and it is your responsibility to scan the e-mail and attachments (if any). WHSmith may monitor any communication entering or leaving its systems for any authorised business purpose.

 

WHSmith is the trading style of two separate companies: WHSmith High Street Limited (Registered Number 6560339) and WHSmith Travel Limited (Registered Number 6560378) both of which are registered in England and Wales and sharing a Registered Office at Greenbridge Road, Swindon, Wiltshire, SN3 3RX and VAT Registration Number GB238 5548 36.

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______________________________________________________________________

 

 

______________________________________________________________________

This email has been scanned by the Symantec Email Security.cloud service.

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***********************************************************************

The information contained within this e-mail is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee only. If you have received the e-mail in error, please inform the sender or contact the WHSmith IT Security Manager, on +44 (0) 1793 562175, and delete it from your system. The contents of this e-mail must not be disclosed to anyone else or copied without the sender's consent.

 

 

Any views and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of WHSmith. WHSmith does not take any responsibility for the views of the author. No WHSmith employees are authorised to conclude contracts on behalf of WHSmith by means of e-mail communications. Please note that neither WHSmith nor the sender accepts any responsibility for viruses and it is your responsibility to scan the e-mail and attachments (if any). WHSmith may monitor any communication entering or leaving its systems for any authorised business purpose.

 

WHSmith is the trading style of two separate companies: WHSmith High Street Limited (Registered Number 6560339) and WHSmith Travel Limited (Registered Number 6560378) both of which are registered in England and Wales and sharing a Registered Office at Greenbridge Road, Swindon, Wiltshire, SN3 3RX and VAT Registration Number GB238 5548 36.

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This email has been scanned by the Symantec Email Security.cloud service.

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Edited October 17, 2012 by Highbird70

[Scully]

I'm pretty sure I posted on this,but there's so many threads re' WHSmith at the moment I can't be bothered to look for it!Anyhow,e-mailed Ms Swann and said I would rather I was sent no reply than the insult of a stock reply.Was e-mailed by a Denise Hughes with a stock reply!

[David BASC]

If you have just had a 'standard' reply, then get back to them telling them that’s not good enough, we want a real answer and we want them to tell us what they are going to do and by when- keep the pressure up!

 

David

[BerettaSV10]

Just emailed a reply back to them, saying not happy with their stock answer, especially as I copied the stock answer into my orig email. I sent the reply to c/s and walker.boyd, within seconds had a reply from c/s giving the answer "sorry you are not happy etc" . Its as if they have a auto email acknowledgement to our emails sent to c/s with another stock answer.

[wymberley]

I see that Shooting Times (ST) says that WH Smith "faces a backlash from shooters". What it doesn't say is what the retailer faces from ST and the other IPC Media titles. I sincerely hope that the answer is not nothing and that these magazines that we all support are simply going to rely on our efforts to ensure their ongong sales and profits.

 

Has anyone heard anything?

[al4x]

There isn't much IPC can do as withdrawing its titles from smiths isn't a good business decision. However it should be an incentive to shooters to take up the opportunity of subscribing and getting them at a reduced cost. Personally i won't shop in smiths again and everyone that takes the same approach hits them that little bit a few hundred thousand people not spending a few hundred a year will have an impact.

[del.gue]

Had my cut and paste reply a few hours ago. A few days ago I was in a local butchers and saw a trade magazine for retailers on his counter. There was a headline about this issue and how retailers where annoyed about the age restriction. I will try to get a copy and post it.

[wymberley]

There isn't much IPC can do as withdrawing its titles from smiths isn't a good business decision. However it should be an incentive to shooters to take up the opportunity of subscribing and getting them at a reduced cost. Personally i won't shop in smiths again and everyone that takes the same approach hits them that little bit a few hundred thousand people not spending a few hundred a year will have an impact.

 

Take your point but disagree to an extent that in as much as that if IPC did threaten to withdraw their titles, WH Smiths' racks would be virtually empty and there's loads of other news vendors that would be delighted with an increase in trade and therefore such action may just have the desired effect.

 

However, I thought my point was fair so have already e-mailed the marketing people at IPC asking if we, their customers/supporters, can possibly be made aware of their intentions - obviously I do not expect any business confidentiality to be breached. Let's see what happens.

[VikingRebel]

This is my email, i sent it to the customer relations department (Customer.Relations@WHSmith.co.uk). I will also send it to the CEO. Hopefully somebody of some importance will read it and reply.

 

 

 

 

To whom it may concern.

 

I have been a loyal customer to your company for the best part of my life, and I have generally been highly satisfied with the services you offer. Therefore I was extremely disappointed to learn that you have recently made the decision to ban the sale of shooting magazines to those under the age of 14. I think this is a foolish move on your behalf that has very little grounding in logic and rationality.

 

There is no upward age limit for involvement any shooting disciplines in this country, youths under the age of 14 are perfectly within their rights to take part in any legitimate shooting activities they wish, provided they are taught safe usage and handling of firearms and are supervised at all times by a responsible adult over the age of 21. Why then do you believe they should be denied the right to buy magazines about an activity that is perfectly legal for them to take part in? I personally have been shooting since i was 10 years old, and naturally i have bought and read many shooting magazines over the years. I can say with some conviction that there is nothing within shooting magazines that should be regarded as harmful or damaging to youths. Quite the opposite is true actually. Shooting magazines rigorously promote and teach safe shooting practices and the proper and responsible handling of firearms. They frequently promote important values that are unfortunately all too often lost on much of today's society such as, discipline, personal responsibility, self-reliance and respect for the natural environment.

 

I strongly urge you to reconsider your decision, and I must inform you that for as long as this ban stands, I will be boycotting all WHSmith stores and products. I know that I as one person won't make a difference, but as you may or may not be aware, there are well over a million shooters in this country, many of whom share the same sentiments as I do and are not prepared to simply lay down and take yet another, unfounded, knee jerk assault on our lifestyle.

 

 

Yours Faithfully

 

*******************

Edited October 17, 2012 by VikingRebel

[Reece]

I see that Shooting Times (ST) says that WH Smith "faces a backlash from shooters". What it doesn't say is what the retailer faces from ST and the other IPC Media titles. I sincerely hope that the answer is not nothing and that these magazines that we all support are simply going to rely on our efforts to ensure their ongong sales and profits.

 

Has anyone heard anything?

 

Withdrawing IPC titles from WHSmith's shelves would not make good business sense. This is not down to ST staff, but to those at IPC.

 

However, if shooters boycotted WHSmith's for everything, then no one would buy shooting mags from Smith's, and WHSmith would still lose money.

[Scully]

Cracking letter VikingRebel.

Edited October 17, 2012 by Scully

[Reece]

Also, Animal Aid have not said anything about this. Considering their hate campaign was what started this, it is weird that they seem to have missed this story.

[Blunderbuss]

Also, Animal Aid have not said anything about this. Considering their hate campaign was what started this, it is weird that they seem to have missed this story.

 

I reckon they are keeping their heads down so they are not linked to it when Smith's do a u-turn after a backlash from shooters. Collectively we are a bit placid and lethargic sometimes, but this issue seems to have united us and got us up off our a...s like nothing else recently. About time too!

Edited October 17, 2012 by Blunderbuss

[gibspoon]

Just e-mailed the CEO, and mentioned to her that if you google 'whsmith campaign gun magazines', there is no praise for the ban apparent until page three!

 

http://worldnewsforlife.wordpress.com/2012/10/16/the-league-welcomes-w-h-smith-age-restriction-on-shooting-titles/#comment-4885

 

I left a comment, but no doubt it will fail to appear......

[Reece]

An organisation called "pass it on young sports" has a video of this policy in action:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2wH9T7s2Dcs

[Muddy Funker]

Well from now on I won't be buying anything from that store.

 

I've told them also.

[CharlieT]

If you have just had a 'standard' reply, then get back to them telling them that’s not good enough, we want a real answer and we want them to tell us what they are going to do and by when- keep the pressure up!

 

David

 

Quite unbelievable............I receive the stock reply from WHS so fired off another email requesting a proper reply and answers to my questions.

 

What was my reply....Dear Customer

 

Thank you for your email.

 

WHSmith aims to offer our customers choice, whilst striking the right balance and not acting as a censor. WHSmith seeks to do its best to satisfy all of its customers who often have strongly opposing views. We aim to display all of our magazines in locations where they are accessible to those who want to buy them, but do not offend those who do not.

 

 

Joanne Tyler

Customer Service Team Manager

[sitsinhedges]

Quite unbelievable............I receive the stock reply from WHS so fired off another email requesting a proper reply and answers to my questions.

 

What was my reply....Dear Customer

 

Thank you for your email.

 

WHSmith aims to offer our customers choice, whilst striking the right balance and not acting as a censor. WHSmith seeks to do its best to satisfy all of its customers who often have strongly opposing views. We aim to display all of our magazines in locations where they are accessible to those who want to buy them, but do not offend those who do not.

 

 

Joanne Tyler

Customer Service Team Manager

 

It's not a question of accessibility, they're at waist height in my local shop, it's the fact that they can't actually buy one.

[BerettaSV10]

Same here drafting this reply, in a rough format at the moment. (typos to be sorted out)

 

Dear Sir / Madem

 

Yet again I have received the same stock answers, (copy and paste jobs by the look of it). It appears you are not addressing the questions that have been put to you and are just bowing down to the anti's.

 

Further to my questions below there are now additional questions that need addressing by WHS, you banned the selling of the shooting magazines to under 14's because you mistakenly thought it was illegal to have a shotgun certificate under this age.

 

When are you going to ban the sale of motoring magazines to the under 16's /17's as that is the minimim age for holding a moped / car licence. Further more following on the saimular lines when are you going to ban the sale of gaming magazines and others in a simular ilk that depict and explain war, violence etc to the youngsters as well.

 

Please do not send another stock copy and paste anwer, but answer all the questions put to you.

[wymberley]

This is going to be interesting.

 

Let's just take Shooting Times and Sporting Gun as probably the two best known shooting magazines. These two, I would imagine, are the two most supported by us lot. Now, when the chips are down, are we going to see from them just how well our support of them is valued or when we occasionally are told that it is, is it just an a editorial advertising load of bunkum.

 

These, plus other shooting 'n' fishing titles, are part of the IPC media group - google and you're probably in for a surprise. In support of our cause, a threat to remove their titles from WH Smith's shelves would leave them virtually bare - not too sure about Gay News though. Question is:

 

Will they?

 

Bunkum is starting to look like a possibility from where I'm sat. Had a quick acknowledgement of receipt of my e-mail to the CEO of IPC Media but nothing at all from the marketing dep't.

 

Unless someone like BASC or CA with their ear to the ground has heard something, it looks as though the magazines in question are doing nothing to ensure their circulation figures are maintained but are leaving it all to us.

 

Now, BASC are staring to put out a half decent mag' and with a little bit of extra effort and published monthly................

[CharlieT]

Same here drafting this reply,

 

They are unbelievable. This is my latest missive...................

 

 

Denise Hughes

 

Thank you so much for your your reply and for the effort you must have expended in sending me such a generic reply.

 

My complaint, had you bothered to read it, did not question your companies policy of displaying the likes of “mucky magazines” on the top shelf nor did it question your “till prompt” system per se.

 

My complaint is that W H Smith is refusing permit young people to purchase shooting magazines by the introduction of a till prompt. I am sure you are aware that shooting sports contributed to our countries medal tally at this years Olympic Games and that many schools have shooting clubs which have excelled in producing some of our countries accomplished sportsmen. Shooting and country sports in general teach children teach discipline, responsibility and provide a healthy outdoor environment in which to spend their free time. Far better than sitting in front of their X box.

 

Shooting sports generate in excess of:-

 

 

❖ The equivalent of 70,000 full time jobs

❖ Shooters spend £2 billion each year on goods and services

❖ Shooting is worth £1.6 billion to the UK economy

❖ Shooting is involved in the management of two-thirds of the

rural land area

❖ Two million hectares are actively managed for conservation

as a result of shooting

❖ Shooter providers spend £250 million a year on conservation

❖ Shooters spend 2.7 million work days on conservation – the

equivalent of 12,000 full-time jobs

 

 

I would be obliged if you would advise me of when you intend to withdraw your “till prompt” from shooting magazines thus allowing the young people of our country the freedom to read and learn about shooting and country sports.

[wymberley]

It seems to me that we aren't actually DOING anything apart from sending off futile (judging by the response that they get) e-mails.

 

Am going to take a leaf out of Animal Aid's book.

 

Problem is, I'm a computor dummy. Could anyone who isn't and has some time to spare, lay out and post on here a sheet of A4 with eye catching and as large lettering as is possible the following so that I can download it and copy a pile (think I may manage that) and put a couple on the window of the local shop and spread a few around inside:

 

THE BRITISH BOARD of FILM OPERATES CENSORSHIP FOR GOOD REASON

 

WH SMITH DOES IT OUT OF IGNORANCE

 

Many thanks

 

Edit: NOT REQUIRED, Son is HGV driver - just arrived out of the blue heading home from Cornwall - fingures flashed and I have 10 cracking copies ready to go.

Edited October 18, 2012 by wymberley

[David BASC]

Thank you so much - please keep up the pressure - tall anyone you know who shoots about this!

 

David

[Nikk]

Why hasn't BASC sent a mailshot to all members?

[Reece]

I was thinking, would this issue be worth contacting MPs over? Given how the league's EDM got support because of lobbying by constituents, it might be worth contacting MPs to get them to publicise the cause, and to keep it in the limelight for as long as possible.