njc110381 Posted October 31, 2012 Report Share Posted October 31, 2012 After a bit of consideration and a gun of mine coming up for sale I recently found myself back in the world of semi auto .22lr ownership. It's a 10/22 SYSS custom which I had made about four years ago then quite quickly sold on due to me newbie fear of the dreaded ricochet! Now I'm a bit more experienced and confident I've been using the LR a bit and wanted another semi. When my old one came up for sale I had to buy it as it was quite a saving on having one built now. I took it to the range to play with it and all the memories came flooding back... Great fun, a big waxy mess and jams! Why the hell do they do it? I just can't get my head around it. I started off with Winchester subs. It will quite literally jam after every other shot which is a pain as I've got a new brick of 500 in the safe. Eleys on the other hand are fine. Mag after mag went through with little trouble until the wax built up enough to clog the mag and stopped it feeding. I used to use CCI subs and they worked well but how come it matters so much? Surely they're almost identical in powder charge, bullet weight and case size? I need to go out and get a load of Eley's or CCI's now - I'll leave it up to which of those work best in my CZ to decide which ones I buy. I expected the Eleys to be pretty bad with all that wax but actually they're not too bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stet Posted October 31, 2012 Report Share Posted October 31, 2012 (edited) Mine was jamming for the first time on winchesters, ended up being the mags stripped them cleaned them now it's fine. Edited October 31, 2012 by stet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted October 31, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2012 I did wonder about that, but the Eley rounds cycled fine even after the Winchester had jammed. What did you use to clean out the mags? Did you rinse them with cleaner or take them apart? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beretta28g Posted October 31, 2012 Report Share Posted October 31, 2012 Can you not slow the bolt down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted October 31, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2012 How would you go about doing that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beretta28g Posted October 31, 2012 Report Share Posted October 31, 2012 I dont know on a 10/22 but on other semis you can just vari the amount of gas going back through the ports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casts_by_fly Posted October 31, 2012 Report Share Posted October 31, 2012 Different powder and pressure curve. The 0-700 velocity is faster than other rounds that don't cycle, but the pressure drops off faster. Could also be friction from the cartridge casings being different. I would measure the outer diameter of a dozen of the winnie subs cases to see if they are thicker in the wall by a half a thou or so. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr smith Posted October 31, 2012 Report Share Posted October 31, 2012 I dont know on a 10/22 but on other semis you can just vari the amount of gas going back through the ports. I'm not aware of a .22 lr that uses a gas system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beretta28g Posted October 31, 2012 Report Share Posted October 31, 2012 http://www.impactguns.com/uma-hk-416-22lr-161-20rd-2245200-723364452000.aspx You can certainly adjust the bolt speed on this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted November 1, 2012 Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 One of my 10/22s won't fire eley and love winchesters the other loves winny and not eley they both fire CCI well and the segmenting ones group brilliantly in both. It must be a chamber or headspace thing but the Amos cheap enough to find one for the gun then just use that. Spoke to my local RFD a he gave me a mix match to try out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweazle Posted November 1, 2012 Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 The Lapua subsonics have a more fluid wax coat, more like a grease than a wax, perhaps they would work better for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stet Posted November 1, 2012 Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 Look on YouTube about stripping the mag I used a dry tooth brush and kitchen roll no liquid or oil keep it dry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepasty Posted November 1, 2012 Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 I have a CZ 511, when I got it (cheap used) it wouldnt cycle very well at all, i found the mag lips to be slightly out of wack, after a a little twaeaking and some trials I've now got it cycling anything I stick in it.... I might get one jam in 100 shots. The rugers plastic mags but could it be worn? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperfection Posted November 1, 2012 Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 I have a CZ 511, when I got it (cheap used) it wouldnt cycle very well at all, i found the mag lips to be slightly out of wack, after a a little twaeaking and some trials I've now got it cycling anything I stick in it.... I might get one jam in 100 shots. Mine wont entertain CCI subs at all,but Winchesters work perfect. The Winchesters subs are absolutely faultless and without tempting fate will happily cycle 500 rounds with no problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1066 Posted November 1, 2012 Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 http://www.impactgun...3364452000.aspx You can certainly adjust the bolt speed on this I think you might have the wrong end of the stick there mate - "Blowback system" is the standard type of action for semi-auto .22 rimfire and some low powered centrefire pistol cartridges such as something like a .32 S&W, as opposed to something like a 9mm or .45ACP that uses some sort of locked breech system. I've never come across gas operated semi-auto .22 rimfire action and there is no practical way of slowing down the bolt recycling time without changing the recoil/firing pin springs. There are a few odd types like the Voere .22 semi-auto that you can lock the breech and basically use as a bolt action or as a semi-auto but not many. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted November 1, 2012 Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 The pressure of cartridges will vary from manufacture to manufacturer . As far as waxy bullets are concerned ,just wipe them over with a clean rag and remove the wax . Enough wax will be left behind to lube the bullets . Some manufacturers tend to use excessive amounts of wax . Find a round that suits your gun and stick with it . Harnser . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 I'm going to buy 100 CCI and try them and then judge between them and the Eley's. CCI was what I settled on last time and there must be a reason for that - I did a load of testing but have forgotten the results! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepasty Posted November 1, 2012 Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 (edited) Mine wont entertain CCI subs at all,but Winchesters work perfect. The Winchesters subs are absolutely faultless and without tempting fate will happily cycle 500 rounds with no problems. Agreed on the winchesters, cant remember the last time I had a jam with them, cci's go through ok with the rare jam. When I first got the rifle it wouldnt cycle anything but winchester, it was all in the mag lips, a little tweaking and some cycle tests got her chewing anything... even remington subs! Edited November 1, 2012 by thepasty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 So why won't mine cycle the damn things? I've got 500 of them in the safe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepasty Posted November 1, 2012 Report Share Posted November 1, 2012 my 511 is the subsonic model (dunno if they all come with that stamped on?) so cycles anything, I dont know much about 10/22 but do they prefer HV? Can you get a softer spring for the action? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2012 Apparently you can do a bit of work on them to make them better. Polishing the bolt, rounding off the part that resets the hammer and actually polishing the hammer a bit too. I'm not sure how much of this SYSS have already done, they've done the auto bolt release so could well have done other stuff? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alycidon Posted November 2, 2012 Report Share Posted November 2, 2012 Grease as others have said is teh issue. I have used Eley 36 and 40gr bullets for the last 20 years in 10/22 clones. They are clean (ish) and offer decent stopping power. I have tried the new CCI and found them to work pretty well. Winchester and magtech with that massive open nose work great in bolt actions and down range but the heavy grease on the bullets will jam a clean semi in about 20 rounds. A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepasty Posted November 2, 2012 Report Share Posted November 2, 2012 I only shoot winchester subs (the most cost effect consistant round I've used) in my cz511 semi... can go through 500 rounds without a jam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stubby Posted November 2, 2012 Report Share Posted November 2, 2012 After a bit of consideration and a gun of mine coming up for sale I recently found myself back in the world of semi auto .22lr ownership. It's a 10/22 SYSS custom which I had made about four years ago then quite quickly sold on due to me newbie fear of the dreaded ricochet! Now I'm a bit more experienced and confident I've been using the LR a bit and wanted another semi. When my old one came up for sale I had to buy it as it was quite a saving on having one built now. I took it to the range to play with it and all the memories came flooding back... Great fun, a big waxy mess and jams! Why the hell do they do it? I just can't get my head around it. I started off with Winchester subs. It will quite literally jam after every other shot which is a pain as I've got a new brick of 500 in the safe. Eleys on the other hand are fine. Mag after mag went through with little trouble until the wax built up enough to clog the mag and stopped it feeding. I used to use CCI subs and they worked well but how come it matters so much? Surely they're almost identical in powder charge, bullet weight and case size? I need to go out and get a load of Eley's or CCI's now - I'll leave it up to which of those work best in my CZ to decide which ones I buy. I expected the Eleys to be pretty bad with all that wax but actually they're not too bad. I only shoot winchester subs (the most cost effect consistant round I've used) in my cz511 semi... can go through 500 rounds without a jam. I have a CZ bolt action, and a ruger 10/22, and guess what, the cz only likes eley, and the ruger winchester, yes it will cycle eleys, but you then get jams, although keeping the action clean stops jams as well, how many winchesters did you put through it before jams? mine will fire off a 100 or so then need a strip and clean otherwise it will even jam with winneys, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night blaster Posted November 2, 2012 Report Share Posted November 2, 2012 I have had the exact same problem with my 10/22. Eley run through fine as long as I strip the mags after every 100 rounds and clear the wax, winchesters are hit and miss, haven't figured why, but the Eley seem to group well so have just stuck with them. Maybe a general 10/22 occurrence??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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