kitchrat Posted August 20, 2013 Report Share Posted August 20, 2013 I hate being outwitted by birds with a brain the size of a pea!! Large area of rape stubble near me (mostly not my perm), over the last week they finally started to build up and as fields got cultivated the birds were funnelled towards my bit, the last three fields!! By Saturday there were several hundred on the bottom field. After my success on pea stubble the last week, I get excited and go in. Tiny, hidden hide with a roof in a ditch between the bottom 2 fields,with lots of nettles and grass as extra cover. Nice wood behind, wind on back - perfect! Magnet and a few shells go up, birds still flitting about my end. 1st bird comes in, so I shoot it. After that, it's as is they know I'm there and go up to the top field instead. Out go the flags of hi-viz jackets on sticks. All birds depart for God knows where, any that come back are very wary but as far as I know there has been no shooting locally. Three days later, still no birds (was there no lost seed??, as I certainly had not shot them off!!) and they are ripping iup the field. Have any of you seen them using scouts to check things out? Instead of coming in upwind to feed, odd birds whizz downwind at full speed and "buzz" the set up at low level. they are gone before you can get a shot at them. I've seen a group of 6 or 8 arrive in the area, 7 of them land in trees whilst number 8 does the fly-past. If he gives it the all clear, he goes back for his mates. I have also seen a young bird, heading straight in, get "buzzed" by an adult bird and almost pushed away from my set up. Some pf these birds are really magnet aware! I hate being outwitted by birds with a brain the size of a pea!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filzee Posted August 20, 2013 Report Share Posted August 20, 2013 Funny you should mention a scout pigeon. Me and my shooting buddy have been convinced for years that they do this and often if you don't spook it there will be a few more arrive shortly after. Maybe we are over thinking it but i am convinced of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted August 20, 2013 Report Share Posted August 20, 2013 Funny you should mention a scout pigeon. Me and my shooting buddy have been convinced for years that they do this and often if you don't spook it there will be a few more arrive shortly after. Maybe we are over thinking it but i am convinced of it. Pigeons do not send out a scout. Of that i am convinced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted August 20, 2013 Report Share Posted August 20, 2013 If they do send a scout, and if someone shoots it and it therefore doesn't return to the main flock, the others will know not to go there. I am not convinced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted August 20, 2013 Report Share Posted August 20, 2013 there could be some thing in that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Essex Hunter Posted August 20, 2013 Report Share Posted August 20, 2013 Shooting down the flight line will send them the other way very quickly.... Not convinced about the scout bird idea....but if it was easy then we would kill a lot more... TEH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hushpower Posted August 20, 2013 Report Share Posted August 20, 2013 Am sure i saw a video in the early 80s it could of been Archie,they were using a string operated flapper and they said dont shoot the first one or two that come in to range ,and they didnt and then the birds started coming in. I will be giving it atry i think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yickdaz Posted August 20, 2013 Report Share Posted August 20, 2013 If they do send a scout, and if someone shoots it and it therefore doesn't return to the main flock, the others will know not to go there. I am not convincedif the bird is if the theory is to be believed and I,m sceptical about to be honest if the pigeon is shot and dosn,t return could the other birds not think well he or she must of found a nice field to feed on lets join it just a thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted August 20, 2013 Report Share Posted August 20, 2013 if the theory is to be believed and I,m sceptical about to be honest if the pigeon is shot and dosn,t return could the other birds not think well he or she must of found a nice field to feed on lets join it just a thought Well thought out yickdaz. The appliance of science at it's very best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted August 21, 2013 Report Share Posted August 21, 2013 So, what happens if a field has several flightlines going to it? Does each wood/garden tree/spinney send out a scout? How long will the flock wait for the scout to return? Will a deputy scout be sent to look for the original scout? Lets not be silly, gents, THERE ARE NO SUCH SCOUTS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted August 21, 2013 Report Share Posted August 21, 2013 I think that we are agreed on that Motty. We are only having a bit of fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malkiserow Posted August 21, 2013 Report Share Posted August 21, 2013 Even if there was a scout, the others are just a short distance and ................they do have ears! so they will hear their scout get shot, if they are clever enough to organise a scout, they are clever enough to connect big bang with non return of scout and they may well be watching him/her anyway with their pigeon binoculars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitchrat Posted August 21, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2013 Funny you should mention a scout pigeon. Me and my shooting buddy have been convinced for years that they do this and often if you don't spook it there will be a few more arrive shortly after. Maybe we are over thinking it but i am convinced of it. Just sit and watch.... You might be surprised how smart my Essex birds are!! If they do send a scout, and if someone shoots it and it therefore doesn't return to the main flock, the others will know not to go there. I am not convinced. Exactly! And if you don't shoot it and he doesn't like what he sees, they don't come either!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitchrat Posted August 21, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2013 So, what happens if a field has several flightlines going to it? Does each wood/garden tree/spinney send out a scout? How long will the flock wait for the scout to return? Will a deputy scout be sent to look for the original scout? Lets not be silly, gents, THERE ARE NO SUCH SCOUTS! I've seen more scouts than I have "flightlines" in Essex - they went out with Archie Coates. In the winter we get "flock-strings" where a big flock just plays follow-my-leader (like those procession catapillars that you can make go round in circles) but in the summer, Ok they often follow a hedge or a stream valley but so few birds have to travel far to eat that flightlines don't need to happen. Well thought out yickdaz. The appliance of science at it's very best. No return = no OK = no go there! Even if there was a scout, the others are just a short distance and ................they do have ears! so they will hear their scout get shot, if they are clever enough to organise a scout, they are clever enough to connect big bang with non return of scout and they may well be watching him/her anyway with their pigeon binoculars At least YOU understand!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitey10765666 Posted August 21, 2013 Report Share Posted August 21, 2013 I've had a few scouts in my time, you gotta sneak up on em from behind and slit their throats its the only way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK Posted August 28, 2013 Report Share Posted August 28, 2013 I don't think that pigeons operate with the same "flock" mentality that corvids do. A flock of pigeons doesn't strike me as being a cohesive body but more an aggregation of individual birds for a finite period. I may be wrong. Obviously crows are different. I hid on a barley stubble about 35 years ago to see what happens when a flock of crows (probably rooks on reflection) moves from field to field. This was in Co Antrim. A team of 5 arrived on the field where I was hidden. One hovered centrally while the other 4 moved to the field corners and inspected the area. When satisfied that there were no obvious dangers, on a signal from the central crow, one by one the corner birds landed. When all 4 were on the ground and nothing untoward happened the central crow called to the flock. The scouts rose again and circled the field as the flock arrived and landed. Sentry birds were rotated for the period while the birds were on that field. This clearly demonstrated a well developed C3 system. Command, Control and Communications. Now if the corvids can develop a system of that sophistication perhaps the pigeons will eventually do so. Problem with this theory is that first they need a cohesive flock and that flock needs a leader. Just can't see it with pigeons in all honesty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitchrat Posted August 29, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2013 I don't think that pigeons operate with the same "flock" mentality that corvids do. A flock of pigeons doesn't strike me as being a cohesive body but more an aggregation of individual birds for a finite period. I may be wrong. Obviously crows are different. I hid on a barley stubble about 35 years ago to see what happens when a flock of crows (probably rooks on reflection) moves from field to field. This was in Co Antrim. A team of 5 arrived on the field where I was hidden. One hovered centrally while the other 4 moved to the field corners and inspected the area. When satisfied that there were no obvious dangers, on a signal from the central crow, one by one the corner birds landed. When all 4 were on the ground and nothing untoward happened the central crow called to the flock. The scouts rose again and circled the field as the flock arrived and landed. Sentry birds were rotated for the period while the birds were on that field. This clearly demonstrated a well developed C3 system. Command, Control and Communications. Now if the corvids can develop a system of that sophistication perhaps the pigeons will eventually do so. Problem with this theory is that first they need a cohesive flock and that flock needs a leader. Just can't see it with pigeons in all honesty. Good observations!! I don't think pigeons are that good yet, but are working on it!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dead eye alan Posted August 29, 2013 Report Share Posted August 29, 2013 Good observations!! I don't think pigeons are that good yet, but are working on it!! Yes but their all on holiday at the moment schools out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
postie Posted August 29, 2013 Report Share Posted August 29, 2013 my old grandad used to say allways make sure you shoot the first bird or they would not come back I said to him I missed the first 5 were did the other 4 come from Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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