thepasty Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) knickers twisted alert! One stop shop for thieves? Just like all the other gun shops around the country. I've said why I think the way I do already. and I'd love one... awesome things... Edited January 28, 2014 by thepasty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westward Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 Given his track record of vote rigging in Leicester, I'm not sure why Keith Vaz is always chosen as an appropriate person to lecture us on matters of honesty and integrity. Sadly though, his comments show the extent to which people can be conditioned to believe that guns - and specifically handguns - are inherently dangerous and that their very existence is a threat to society. And, as always, this is reinforced by the dark hints about their imagined connections between legal gun ownership and gun crime. We need a voice, a real voice, rather like the NRA in America which gets listened to by the politicians, because the CPSA don't care and the BASC has such a low profile that no one outside shooting has ever heard of them. Right now I have no desire to own handguns but I do have a great desire to live without muppets like Vaz and articles in 'serious' newspapers trying to control my freedom to have such things by telling me that the choice isn't mine to make because they're 'dangerous'. So I voted 'Yes'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 Given his track record of vote rigging in Leicester, I'm not sure why Keith Vaz is always chosen as an appropriate person to lecture us on matters of honesty and integrity. Sadly though, his comments show the extent to which people can be conditioned to believe that guns - and specifically handguns - are inherently dangerous and that their very existence is a threat to society. And, as always, this is reinforced by the dark hints about their imagined connections between legal gun ownership and gun crime. We need a voice, a real voice, rather like the NRA in America which gets listened to by the politicians, because the CPSA don't care and the BASC has such a low profile that no one outside shooting has ever heard of them. Right now I have no desire to own handguns but I do have a great desire to live without muppets like Vaz and articles in 'serious' newspapers trying to control my freedom to have such things by telling me that the choice isn't mine to make because they're 'dangerous'. So I voted 'Yes'. I wonder if BASC or CA, SACS or anyone responded, or do they 'avoid' issues deemed 'unwinnable', irrespective? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westward Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 I wonder if BASC or CA, SACS or anyone responded, or do they 'avoid' issues deemed 'unwinnable', irrespective? Almost certainly they'd wish to distance themselves from something arising out of comments made by Nigel Farage. The media and most of the public see Farage as a sort of quasi political Jeremy Clarkson figure who can be both amusing and sometimes present views which resonate with most of us but at the same time musn't be taken seriously. A bit like Boris but without the vast PR machine working in the background. In this case Farage stated something which a high percentage of the public agree with but, in the opinion of many, he's the wrong person to state it. What's always missed though is that the subject is much too contoversial to be raised by the lightweight, media grovelling, soft centered champagne socialists who dominate all the parties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 I dont see a need for the general public to have hand guns. Most of the general public don't see a need for ANYONE to have any kind of guns. I don't object to the general public owning handguns or any other kind of firearm so long as they meet the requirements we shooters do. Licensing should be about licensing the person NOT the gun. If somone is deemed fit to possess a shotgun or rifle then why are they unfit to own a handgun? I am deemed fit enough possess numerous shotguns and rifles but not a handgun. Mmmmm..... it's enough to make one wonder if perhaps its not about guns? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) hand guns dont turn me on,only shotguns,on the family farms in michigan there fun to use, we walk round the farms with them,out the back of the barns and fire at tin cans, over here you cant do that only at a gun club,to me why have them. Edited January 28, 2014 by mossy835 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westward Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 Most of the general public don't see a need for ANYONE to have any kind of guns. I don't object to the general public owning handguns or any other kind of firearm so long as they meet the requirements we shooters do. Licensing should be about licensing the person NOT the gun. If somone is deemed fit to possess a shotgun or rifle then why are they unfit to own a handgun? I am deemed fit enough possess numerous shotguns and rifles but not a handgun. Mmmmm..... it's enough to make one wonder if perhaps its not about guns? I don't think there's a secret agenda to make 1984 real. The Americans love to bang on about gun control = people control but it seems to me the real problem is simply that there's a widely held perception that shotguns and rifles are for a few silly toffs who like killing wildlife but are otherwise pretty harmless, whereas handguns are for killing people and are therefore BAD and shouldn't be allowed. How much of this is derived from police propaganda or media scaremongering is anyone's guess. It took the car insurance companies a generation to figure out that risk was not simply determined by the type of vehicle but much more by the type of driver. Today a 40 year old can insure a Porsche for far less than an 18 year with a diesel Micra - all else being equal of course. Like I say, we need an organisation that portrays the shooting community in a true light and which will represent us at all levels as the law abiding and upstanding citizens we are. Without that organisations like the ACPO and the national media, especially the broadcast media, will continue to present a biased and self serving image to the public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 I dont see a need for the general public to have hand guns. Possibly allow gun clubs to hold them for target practice. I agree with this.a pistol has almost no accuracy over distance so why would you need one at home.your not going to go shooting fox's or deer rabbits with it.also Ukip are in favour of almost anything they think will get them a vote just as well they will never get into power.the poll is a waste of time you can vote a hundred times if you like and it registers everytime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepasty Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) I just tried voting numerous times and the figure didnt change. So it seems the issue here isnt really whether anyone NEEDS a handgun its more to do with rights of ownership or the like, theres no reason why a well vetted person shouldnt have one? Going on that thought you could say the same for flame throwers, RPG's, etc etc I do NEED a flame thrower, would be great for clearing brambles in the garden.... So unfair I'm not allowed one. Edited January 28, 2014 by thepasty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rst1990 Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 I dont see a need for the general public to have hand guns. Possibly allow gun clubs to hold them for target practice. Absolutley agree with you, best of both worlds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 I just tried voting numerous times and the figure didnt change. So it seems the issue here isnt really whether anyone NEEDS a handgun its more to do with rights of ownership or the like, theres no reason why a well vetted person shouldnt have one? Going on that thought you could say the same for flame throwers, RPG's, etc etc I do NEED a flame thrower, would be great for clearing brambles in the garden.... So unfair I'm not allowed one. Exactly. It's nothing to do with NEED but all to do with freedom of choice. I don't NEED any of my rifles or shotguns and I didn't need my handguns, but I resented having to hand in my property for a crime I wasn't responsible for, and still do to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIGHT SEARCHER Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) I just voted yes and it worked. 43% yes to 57% no. I can still remember the amount of gun clubs that there was. Most closed down after the pistol ban. It was good fun and very sociable way of meeting like minded people. So we were shooting paper targets but it was Challenging to improve your marksmanship. I used to shoot at loads of clubs. Bolton. 2x clubs in Bury. Oldham. Sale. Warrington. Rochdale. Manchester. Stockport. Failsworth. Loads of gun clubs and they were all busy. We had inter club compertitions it was great never any trouble and nobody got shot. Edited January 28, 2014 by NIGHT SEARCHER Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 I agree with this.a pistol has almost no accuracy over distance so why would you need one at home.your not going to go shooting fox's or deer rabbits with it.also Ukip are in favour of almost anything they think will get them a vote just as well they will never get into power.the poll is a waste of time you can vote a hundred times if you like and it registers everytime. I have a 3.0l v6 156mph car at home on my drive i don't need one after all the speed limit in the uk is 70mph.Does that mean that i should get rid of it and buy a 900cc car that is limited to 70mph,after all why would i need a 156mph car at home Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 You answered your own question there why do you need a car that does twice the speed limit.and also how do you know it will do that speed.if you apply that to all things in life I have three houses 900 acres four cars two excavators three tractors yet none of which are banned.at the time handguns were banned and I agree it was a kneejerk reaction however the shooting organizations could not between them come up with a decent reason why anybody needed a magnum in the home.you want one because they are banned.simple Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) I don't think there's a secret agenda to make 1984 real. . Neither do I, I was referring to politics. Lord Cullen stated a ban would be of no benefit but the two mainstream parties of the day were vying for votes; the Tories were riddled with accusations of sleaze, and a hungry for power Labour Party would do anything to seize it. As a result neither party waited for he conclusion of the Cullen report but pre-empted it with policy. The Tory one didn't go far enough as far as labour and the media were concerned so labour stated policy of a complete ban to garner votes, and lest their message wasn't clear they cuddled up to the snowdrop appeal lobby. Sorted. Edited January 28, 2014 by Scully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpentermark Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) It doesn't matter whether you own a legal handgun or not. After all its not the gun that decides to kill its the person holding it! So if I'm that person and want to kill someone, i will find a way! Knife, car, poison, electrocution, hanging, acid, baseball bat, length of 3x2, WICKER MAN, push in front of bus, drown, set fire to their house etc etc etc. If anything, for those who want to own handguns i think it would make them think twice about committing any type of crime because of possibly losing their license. Since i got my SGC I've slowed down driving, don't drink as much when i go out, don't use the phone whilst driving..... In other words i now go out of my way to keep my certificate! So if anything, i think owning a shotgun has made me less likely to commit crime and in the majority would probably be the same for legal handgun owners?! Edited January 28, 2014 by carpentermark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 You answered your own question there why do you need a car that does twice the speed limit.and also how do you know it will do that speed.if you apply that to all things in life I have three houses 900 acres four cars two excavators three tractors yet none of which are banned.at the time handguns were banned and I agree it was a kneejerk reaction however the shooting organizations could not between them come up with a decent reason why anybody needed a magnum in the home.you want one because they are banned.simple I wasn't asking a question i was showing the futility of your post,most of the things we own we do not need, but we have them for various reasons,sometimes it is aesthetics sometimes because it is a marvel of engineering,and i have never said i want a handgun,but for those that do why should the wrongs of the few prevent the want of the many. There are many people out there who have handguns quite legally and they are used for specific jobs,so not quite a ban,but a selective decision making process. And i know it will do 156mph because it says so in the manual,and just to test that i blasted it a few times down the autobahn and can confirm the limiter kicks in at 156mph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 I'm on the fence on this one. Personally I find shooting handguns a bit boring (in fact target shooting generally) but I do respect those for whom it's a sport or an interest. The things is, if there's one type of gun that will attract walts/weirdos/psychos more than any other then surely it's the handgun. That's not suggesting that all who want them are such, only the likelihood is that with the ban repealed it's a statistical probability that we will one day see another Dunblane or similar. I doubt it ever will be repealed in fact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 I wasn't asking a question i was showing the futility of your post,most of the things we own we do not need, but we have them for various reasons,sometimes it is aesthetics sometimes because it is a marvel of engineering,and i have never said i want a handgun,but for those that do why should the wrongs of the few prevent the want of the many. There are many people out there who have handguns quite legally and they are used for specific jobs,so not quite a ban,but a selective decision making process. And i know it will do 156mph because it says so in the manual,and just to test that i blasted it a few times down the autobahn and can confirm the limiter kicks in at 156mph no posts are futile these forums are designed for different opinions and I have one that differs from yours but not some others,i have no problem with people having handguns however I don't think it is necessary to have them in the home after all people who are seriopus about pistol shooting do it at a range and almost all are indoors,so it would make more sense to store them there of course this would add expense but worth it if you want to do the sport.the wrongs of a few meant that some never had the chance to be wrong again.i myself have no interest in handguns and do not care either way if they come back or not.also the dealer told me I would get around 20mpg out of my xjr but I have never achieved it yet the paperwork says it is limited to 156 but I am not interested in putting it to the test.serious cars are always v8's.just my opinion you understand.anyway I have put my view and yo yours its not an argument so now some of the others can air their views now either way.atb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mereside Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) I agree with this.a pistol has almost no accuracy over distance so why would you need one at home.your not going to go shooting fox's or deer rabbits with it.also Ukip are in favour of almost anything they think will get them a vote just as well they will never get into power.the poll is a waste of time you can vote a hundred times if you like and it registers everytime. absolute rubbish handguns are accurate and to say they are not is just a load of **** spouted by the police to misinform if you have used one then you know how accurate they are with the right training. I could have passed dsc1 with my handgun and use it for dispatch and has been invaluable in certain situations. you only have to look abroad to see guys hunting with them. funnily enough i have just come back from sweden where handguns are legal and spent three days working dogs on boar and moose and using a knife on an injured boar really gets hairy i asked about hanguns and everybody i spoke to working hounds would rather use a handgun as some situations it is the only safe option. after reading some of these coments its clear to me why hanguns got restricted in the first place and they are difinately not banned. It is also clear that reading some comments that people have not had any experience at all, atb wayne Edited January 28, 2014 by mereside Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) absolute rubbish handguns are accurate and to say they are not is just a load of **** spouted by the police to misinform if you have used one then you know how accurate they are with the right training. I could have passed dsc1 with my handgun and use it for dispatch and has been invaluable in certain situations. you only have to look abroad to see guys hunting with them. funnily enough i have just come back from sweden where handguns are legal and spent three days working dogs on boar and moose and using a knife on an injured boar really gets hairy i asked about hanguns and everybody i spoke to working hounds would rather use a handgun as some situations it is the only safe option. after reading some of these coments its clear to me why hanguns got restricted in the first place and they are difinately not banned. It is also clear that reading some comments that people have not had any experience at all, atb wayne I am sure examples of people doing all sorts with different types of guns and archery but in the real world how many of the would be owners could achieve such things.look at George digweed he hit clays at 130 yards and has won 22 world titles but how many others can equal this none that's how many.private ownership of handguns was banned except for a few exceptions and not many could claim them also the calibre is restricted you cant ask for whatever you fancy.i myself am a traditionalist as far as guns are concerned I favour o/u sxs and tolerate semi autos cant see the point of pumps but that's me others have their own preferences.also I would not hold the americans up as paragons in the world of guns.in fact the rate of deaths by gunshotover there only enforces the view of those who wanted to ban them.atb Edited January 28, 2014 by bostonmick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mereside Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) you can use whatever handgun you like, home office guidance states that for smaller animals then 32 cal is the normal but if you are dealing with larger animals then you can use bigger, also 2 shot is again guidance and its down to you to put a good case for using whatever calibre you put the variation down including glocks sigs or whatever floats your boat. I used those vids to show it is possible but the standard range is 25 yrds and from the standards i have seen small groupes are the normal, atb wayne just to add mick since you edited your last post why would a legally held pistol be more of a threat than any other calibre that is plain stupid as being granted a firearm you have proven yourself trustworthy to use and a pistol/handgun is by far a lesser power than any rifle Edited January 28, 2014 by mereside Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkfire88 Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 You don't need hand guns lets not turn the uk into the USA rifles and shot guns only Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mereside Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 You don't need hand guns lets not turn the uk into the USA rifles and shot guns only you might not have a need but there are others who use them for a reason so why comment without actually understanding, wayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted January 28, 2014 Report Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) You don't need hand guns lets not turn the uk into the USA rifles and shot guns only There are handguns issued and being used everyday in the uk,so your statement is way off the mark. Beaten to it Edited January 28, 2014 by welsh1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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