Scully Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 prove it I don't need to, there are more than 500,000 in circulation in Scotland. None licensed. Let's see how many licenses are applied for and issued. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjh Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 I don't need to, there are more than 500,000 in circulation in Scotland. None licensed. Let's see how many licenses are applied for and issued. "I don't need to" really if you had those facts to hand you wouldn't be posting them, no obviously you cant because you made it up, i ask again prove it 500,000 in circulation where is this fact from prove it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laird Lugton Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 What is interesting is that you now need more reason to own an air rifle than you do for a shotgun since the air gun requires a FAC….. How long before a FAC is required for a shotgun? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 "I don't need to" really if you had those facts to hand you wouldn't be posting them, no obviously you cant because you made it up, i ask again prove it 500,000 in circulation where is this fact from prove it http://www.scotsman.com/news/macaskill-vows-to-raise-concerns-over-scotland-s-500-000-air-weapons-1-1167239 This isn't the only reference to the number it is estimated is in circulation, so there's plenty more to look at if you choose to. Some say 'up to' 500,000, others say 'more than 500,000'. Like I said, I don't need to prove anything, the figures are there for all to see. For arguments sake, let's say even if there are 100,000 air guns licensed as S1, and another 100,000 owned by law abiding shotgun and firearms owners not on ticket, that still leaves 300,000 in the hands of....who? Some will no doubt be owned by law abiding people and others by those who like to take pot shots at pets, people etc. So, despite claims that there is a need 'to ensure that those who misuse guns do not have access to them' I would suggest it is a little late for that, as those who do misuse them clearly already do have them. If there is no 'misuse' then what are Scottish ministers basing the need for legislation on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeadWasp Posted June 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 (edited) Yes I'd be up for that (flood of applications for a license) - show the lunacy for what it is. There is nothing worse than poor legislation, or even worse, poor legislation with no logical basis. I bet you the Nats set the price stupidly high to force a lot of people to hand them in!! Edited June 28, 2015 by LeadWasp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 (edited) Yes I'd be up for that (flood of applications for a license) - show the lunacy for what it is. There is nothing worse than poor legislation, or even worse, poor legislation with no logical basis. I bet you the Nats set the price stupidly high to force a lot of people to hand them in!! The stuff i have seen suggests similar pricing to the current licence cost for a SGC/FAC ticket, no doubt that it will be the higher price for a FAC. Visitors will need a 12 month permit. The cost of the ticket will be higher than the value of many guns, expect a glut of cheap springers. I'm not sure, but suspect the license will also cover all the airsoft guns as well. Edited June 28, 2015 by grrclark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laird Lugton Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 Conservative MSP Alex Fergusson said: "For us this is a red line issue that also involves an important point of democratic principle which is that we believe that part one of this Bill should always have been a separate piece of legislation. "We are forced on these benches into a position of being unable to support this Bill despite being very much in agreement with a large part of it." He cited statistics showing that air weapon offences are at their second lowest level in the last decade, representing 0.06% of all reported crime in Scotland. Mr Fergusson said: "I'm afraid I do not believe and I do not accept that this new regime will have any impact on crime statistics whatsoever. "What we are left with is a Bill that will create a whole new layer of bureaucracy and expense, that will take up countless hours of police officers' time to bring in a licensing regime that will do nothing to reduce the minute amount of crime that a minuscule number of airgun owners or possessors currently commit. "This seems to me to be the perfect example of taking a sledgehammer to crack a nut. "All it will do is place an unnecessary increased burden on thousands of perfectly law abiding citizens, and that is not something that we on these benches can support." http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/home-news/every-airgun-owner-in-scotland-must-have-a-licence-10-years-after-toddlers-death.1435251728 Thought the Conservative response was spot on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big bad lindz Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 prove it If any proof was needed it was unfortunately at the start of all this legislation being put toward the MSP`s. Scum with an air loaded rifle in a house with not just young children but baby's and the trigger was pulled and a tragic result. This legislation wont stop this from happening again and it certainly wont stop scum or anyone else for that matter obtaining an air gun or for that matter a shotgun or firearm but it will effect all of the responsible air gun owners who use the guns both for business and pleasure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bewsher500 Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 gives me a bloody good reason to crank up the PCP to FAC levels and add it to my certificate that way then what a waste of time and money...as usual poor plod expected to enforce the unenforceable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 I don't need to, there are more than 500,000 in circulation in Scotland. None licensed. Let's see how many licenses are applied for and issued. it wont be all of them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 gives me a bloody good reason to crank up the PCP to FAC levels and add it to my certificate that way then what a waste of time and money...as usual poor plod expected to enforce the unenforceable Yep, totally agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 How long before a FAC is required for a shotgun? You already do in this part of the UK for shotguns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordieh Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Just thick stupid politicians and even thicker people that voted them in nothing matters as long as you can beat the "Auld enemy" at something Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rst1990 Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 Is the new licence like a fac ticket? Ie land to shoot and a background check on applicant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 I don't get the stupidity of this at all, I mean are the going to set up border stops and search every vehicle? I could probably drive to France and come back with a boot full of 22, black powder and muzzleloaders. Won't the Scots that want an air gun do the same! Doh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddler Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 Is the new licence like a fac ticket? Ie land to shoot and a background check on applicant Think of it as FAC-lite Same criteria as a full FAC...but all you'll have legal ownership of is a sub-12ft/lb air rifle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 I don't get the stupidity of this at all, I mean are the going to set up border stops and search every vehicle? I could probably drive to France and come back with a boot full of 22, black powder and muzzleloaders. Won't the Scots that want an air gun do the same! Doh! That's a fair point. Where does a RFD stand selling someone with a Scottish accent an air rifle in say, Carlisle ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livefast123 Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 (edited) That's a fair point. Where does a RFD stand selling someone with a Scottish accent an air rifle in say, Carlisle ? What goes on, on tour, stays on tour ☺ I would imagine border RFDs on the English side may be seeing an increase in business. They should follow the law of the land, which for the moment will be no licence for England Edited June 30, 2015 by Livefast123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 Just how much brain material is removed to become an mp? Is it painful? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livefast123 Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 Removing the common sense stings......to combat this you get an egotistical antidote that makes you liable to proceed with your idea whatever the facts, public opinion or public freedom dictate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 How do they tame the arrogance and vindictive tendencies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livefast123 Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 (edited) What you don't realise you are suffering from, you can't cure. I would imagine most MPs are blissfully unaware of their condition, instead feeling that they direct the electorate at will..........sadly they are getting away with it. Did SACS make any waves over this? Edited June 30, 2015 by Livefast123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andra Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 (edited) Think of it as FAC-lite Same criteria as a full FAC...but all you'll have legal ownership of is a sub-12ft/lb air rifle Deary me..... this does seem to be way over the top.... You do not have to declare land to shoot over to obtain a shotgun licence seems a bit on the skewed side. Also read in the BASC magazine for July / Aug that the proposal from BASC to allow existing shotgun and firearm cert holders automatically be granted an air "weapons" (not sure I like that precise term) cert or to remove the need for an additional cert was rejected. Keen to see the facts around costs etc.... Not sure what SACS was doing but BASC seem to have been right up the middle of proceedings. PS Just checked the SG site... BASC were on the panel. http://www.gov.scot/Topics/Justice/law/Firearms/governmentaction/airweaponlicensing The calling them weapons seems a bit scare-mongery in my mind. I cannot imagine retailers would get much mileage out of calling them that!!! Edited June 30, 2015 by Andra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 Deary me..... this does seem to be way over the top.... You do not have to declare land to shoot over to obtain a shotgun licence seems a bit on the skewed side. Also read in the BASC magazine for July / Aug that the proposal from BASC to allow existing shotgun and firearm cert holders automatically be granted an air "weapons" (not sure I like that precise term) cert or to remove the need for an additional cert was rejected. Keen to see the facts around costs etc.... Not sure what SACS was doing but BASC seem to have been right up the middle of proceedings. That probably knackered it then lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rst1990 Posted July 1, 2015 Report Share Posted July 1, 2015 All the garden plinkers are knackered then if you have to have land etc I think it's a good idea to have them licenced so no idiots get hold of them. But because of the idiots everyone else suffers, that's like most things though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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