80 % of Britons want our police to be armed

[TONY R]

BIG NO we dont need the right to be armed

 

funny but to near the truth.

Agree but the police need to stay as they are too in that instance.

Edited May 17, 2016 by TONY R

[WinchesterDave]

Would you suggest a tree surgeon goes without chainsaw trousers and boots because 20 years ago they wore ties and tweed?

How about a lifeboatman going back to oilskins and a capok life jacket.

Or an engineer without safety glasses because they look silly

Perhaps the doctor could reuse his syringe like they used to because glass is much better.

 

The uniform has been developed with modern materials to be safe and comfortable to wear...

Body armour is dual purpose... Ballistic and knife protection... And as an aside it takes a punch

 

There are a tiny numbers of firearms officers... They are well trained but surprisingly not interested in the main in your hobby!

I would support an expansion of armed officers.

As for taser it's a matter of cost

 

I agree with this...

 

Having been a Special Con since October 2015, I have seen things and dealt with people I had no idea existed. I enjoy what I do, and it has already changed me as a person both in confidence and knowledge of life in general. I appreciate my back ground a lot, lot more. I'm 21 next month, and I feel much safer going out with my body armour on. Body armour is mandatory for obvious reasons; some people don't like the police, you can go to a normal job which can escalate in to something much more. At the end of the day, the main role of the police is to protect and serve the public, if an officer gets injured through not wearing correct PPE, then he can not perform his duty.

 

Items of equipment are issued and made mandatory for reasons; past experience has shown it is needed.

 

If I was told that we were to be armed (never going to happen) I wouldn't question it. As has been said about para military style of uniforms that forces now seem to be wearing; a Police Constable should be there to make the public feel safe, and has the power to use necessary force when it is needed by means of prescribed methods. They are not there to enforce fear in to their communities. We have dedicated specialist officers if more is needed in terms of force application and deterrence.

[Fuddster]

For a young man with six months special constable experience, thats a balanced view.

No doubt your maturity will stand you in good stead when performing your duties.

 

Good man.

 

f.

[oowee]

Would you suggest a tree surgeon goes without chainsaw trousers and boots because 20 years ago they wore ties and tweed?

How about a lifeboatman going back to oilskins and a capok life jacket.

Or an engineer without safety glasses because they look silly

Perhaps the doctor could reuse his syringe like they used to because glass is much better.

 

The uniform has been developed with modern materials to be safe and comfortable to wear...

Body armour is dual purpose... Ballistic and knife protection... And as an aside it takes a punch

 

There are a tiny numbers of firearms officers... They are well trained but surprisingly not interested in the main in your hobby!

I would support an expansion of armed officers.

As for taser it's a matter of cost

No. Not sure you read my post? The point I was making was that in rural areas with perceived crime being low the reality is often very different. Officers should of course have all the gear.

[Scully]

Tragicaly there is no guarantee the out come would have been any different had they been armed.

On average 30 people a year die in construction in the uk, not one of those people thought about dieing the morning they set off for work, and those poor lasses will have been the same. Crushed death by falling or shot dead is dead and arming them would not guarantee they lived anymore than the health and safety rules saved any building workers.

Death is what happens to us all, Builders and police motorcyclists lolipop ladies all know the risks but life goes on and they do thir job some get killed kids and family cry just the same for buoilders you know even if they were not shot.

 

That is an abysmally flippant post!

You can't compare deaths in the construction industry with deaths in the line of duty! Construction site workers wear PPE to reduce the risk of injury or death by accident; police wear PPE to reduce the risk of injury or death by deliberate intent.

Many many people could be alive today ( not just police but civilians also ) if they had the means to defend themselves. Although shootings are rare in comparison, stabbings occur on a frequent and daily basis in this country; the police are better equipped to deal with this as they are often placed in high risk situations, the general public are not. The general public in mainland UK are left defenceless by law...our politicians have deliberately made it against the law for any of its law abiding citizens to carry anything as a means of self defence. What does that say about our politicians?

[Vince Green]

The cost, in terms of time alone, to book in and then book back a firearm to every police officer every shift would be a massive waste of resources for no real purpose. Then you have all that training and maintaining that training year in year out to take into account. Its all taking police away from what they should be doing.

 

For what? is there a real need that exists? Of course it would be nice but it it would probably clip a half an hour of productive time off each officers shift while they queue up to book in and book back every day, check and load etc. That half hour multiplied thousands of times over across the length and breadth of the country would be better spent on the streets.

 

How long before police officers start getting their guns taken off them? Police officers getting shot with their own guns is not that uncommon in other parts of the world. The gun can be a massive liability at times and requires different policing techniques to keep yourself apart from the public so it can't get snatched. No more up close and friendly community policing

 

Its easy to say arm the police without really considering what it would entail

[TONY R]

Rather than arm the police, we need to start with the courts they are whats wrong with our legal system, and its sending out the wrong messages to criminals. But like arming the police it will never happen.

Edited May 18, 2016 by TONY R

[bazzab]

Well some very interesting comments on here... nice to see people have an idea of reality...

 

BUT..

 

 

Some total brain dead ignorant clueless half wits as well....

 

 

Some people do worry me....

 

 

From a serving member of the police family....

Edited May 18, 2016 by bazzab

[happypig]

No. Not sure you read my post? The point I was making was that in rural areas with perceived crime being low the reality is often very different. Officers should of course have all the gear.

Sorry I agree with you on that. Recent budget cuts have caused a wholesale surrender of the countryside as response officers are drawn into hubs in the large towns and cities...

[Salop Matt]

 

Surely a shotgun wouldn't be viable, multiple projectiles = high risk of other party's being hurt. Issue slug and you have a massive over penetration issue and god knows where that slug could end up.

 

The only way I would welcome more armed police would be if there was a far higher qualification rate and far more regular training for them. The lot I work with I wouldn't give most a super soaker to, one has tasered himself buy accident and a few have had it pointed out to them there safety catch wasn't applied, I have also seen the armed officers asked to stand away from the civi security staff because there safety standards have left the staff concerned over there safety. They aren't even trusted to apply lights to the weapons and only shoot to 50 meters.

 

Popper full time police officers appropriately trained and equipped is what we need.

 

ATB

 

Matt

 

Matt,

 

I suspect you are confusing armed MOD security 'Police' with little operational firearms experience to their home office colleagues.

Chalk and cheese on this subject.

 

atb

 

fudds

 

 

 

MDP & MPGS, Both equally terrible and MDP here are about a third ex regular police who were armed too. Also until about 15 years ago the MDP were used by two local forces to assist with motorway stops when they wanted police firearms as there was an agreement in place and they had scoobys to race around in. Those times are long gone now and they have defenders, shoguns and focus estates.

[old man]

Personally I have no wish to see our Police armed.

 

I would however like to see a Government fit for purpose to create clear, effective, meaningful, workable law for the benefit of the population?

One that does not suspect the populace at large to be of criminal intent and seemingly just applying more law to the law abiding as an unworkable solution?

It seems that now the assumption is of guilt and having to prove innocence instead of the other way round?

 

I would also like to see a Judicial system fit for purpose?

One that is open, transparent, balanced and does not appear to give favour on occasion?

 

It's a good job that a few people in all professions continue to act in an honourable way, performing to the best of their ability as a large proportion seem to be seeing time out to the golden handshake?

 

I am not holding my breath waiting for a change.

[WinchesterDave]

For a young man with six months special constable experience, thats a balanced view.

No doubt your maturity will stand you in good stead when performing your duties.

 

Good man.

 

f.

Thank you Fuddster.

For a young man with six months special constable experience, thats a balanced view.

No doubt your maturity will stand you in good stead when performing your duties.

 

Good man.

 

f.

Thank you Fuddster.

[Bluebarrels]

MDP & MPGS, Both equally terrible and MDP here are about a third ex regular police who were armed too. Also until about 15 years ago the MDP were used by two local forces to assist with motorway stops when they wanted police firearms as there was an agreement in place and they had scoobys to race around in. Those times are long gone now and they have defenders, shoguns and focus estates.

 

Please give an example of why the Mpgs are equally terrible!

As a serving member of the Mpgs I look forward to your explanation!

[Len2016]

the men and women who who join our police are protecting us as much as they can with limited funds and the ones who become firearms officers deserve our greatest respect the man or women with a gun is more at risk because if a terrorist has started his mass destruction and he is approached by two police officers on with a tazer and one armed he will always attack the firearms first and another thing if the officer does his job and drops the armed person he gets hung out to dry by the same people who sent him to do the job in the first place so i say thankyou to the men in and women black blue or any other colour uniform .... rant over len

[achosenman]

I think the Police have a thankless task.

 

If the terrorist threat was real, then we'd see troops on the streets. It wouldn't be the first time either, so I tend to believe it's just noise from politicians and papers.

 

The trouble with subjects like arming the police is it generates hyperbole. I don't think all Police officers are trustworthy enough to carry firearms. I don't think the Police should be asked to tackle an armed terrorist attacks, that's a job for the military.

 

Having family members who serve with the Met and Thames Valley forces, I hear the unvarnished truth. Violence is encountered on a daily basis. Indeed, it seems to be the first response by some sections of society these days. Assault with a firearm is still thankfully rare in comparison to other weapons. That's not to say that the deadly intent is not there. Issuing a Taser to every serving police officer would be the way forward IMHO.

 

Let the armed Police units deal armed criminals, let the military deal with armed terrorist combatants. Under no circumstances should the public have the right to carry firearms for self-defence. Some of the opinions expressed by fellow shooters is concerning enough, without adding the more moronic elements of society to the mix.

 

Atb

[Salop Matt]

Please give an example of why the Mpgs are equally terrible!

As a serving member of the Mpgs I look forward to your explanation!

 

The poor weapons handling and the god/rambo self appointed status the staff seem to have at the location I visit, leaving weapons unattended and resting muzzles on tops of feet when sat down in front of the guard room (magizine fitted unsure if there is anything chambered), ragging vehicles around air fields messing about, general conduct to other site users. I witnessed one MPGs member bragging about how his SA80 was a bigger "gun" than anything a friend was using once he finished my friend in civi`s explained his rank and that his .243 rifle was indeed of larger calibre to the 5.56, the MPGS guy took it in good spirit and put his hands up to making a muppet of himself. But I wonder how many times before and since he has done that.

[Bluebarrels]

The poor weapons handling and the god/rambo self appointed status the staff seem to have at the location I visit, leaving weapons unattended and resting muzzles on tops of feet when sat down in front of the guard room (magizine fitted unsure if there is anything chambered), ragging vehicles around air fields messing about, general conduct to other site users. I witnessed one MPGs member bragging about how his SA80 was a bigger "gun" than anything a friend was using once he finished my friend in civi`s explained his rank and that his .243 rifle was indeed of larger calibre to the 5.56, the MPGS guy took it in good spirit and put his hands up to making a muppet of himself. But I wonder how many times before and since he has done that.

 

So you witnessed all the above I hope you reported your concerns!because if you turned a blind eye your just as guilty!

 

They need reporting as trust me this is not standard practice and unacceptable!!atb BB

Edited May 18, 2016 by Bluebarrels

[Salop Matt]

BB, I suppose I should have reported it but as I valued the ability to shoot the grounds I wanted to make friends and not upset folk.

I did how ever complain the night I was on the air field and found 2 Saudi students on there doing PT having been told by both the MGS and MPGS that the airfield was locked and there were no other users on there.

[Bluebarrels]

Ok mate no problems

 

I have also been in similar circumstances when I shot a certain range complex,booked on at the guardroom as normal and was going about my business in what I thought was a locked/secure area when someone shot towards me with a rimfire! not good

 

The explanation I got was shifts change from days to nights at 1800/1830 hrs and even though I had followed procedures and supplied all information needed,they had forgot to pass the info over to the oncoming shift BB

 

Shortly after this incident all vermin shooting was stopped due to someone trotting across the range shooting rabbits,whilst a night shoot was taking place sometimes mate you cant make this **** up BB

Edited May 18, 2016 by Bluebarrels

[ordnance]

 

Let the armed Police units deal armed criminals, let the military deal with armed terrorist combatants.

What do you suggest, if armed police see a shooting they should decide if its criminals or terrorists, if its terrorists do nothing and call the army.

 

 

How long before police officers start getting their guns taken off them? Police officers getting shot with their own guns is not that uncommon in other parts of the world. The gun can be a massive liability at times and requires different policing techniques to keep yourself apart from the public so it can't get snatched. No more up close and friendly community policing

I caint recall any police officer shooting himself or a colleague here and they have being carrying firearms on and off duty for the last 50n years or so. As for quote. ( massive liability at times and requires different policing techniques to keep yourself apart from the public so it can't get snatched) Thats not the case come here and you will see the police acting the same as any other UK police force when doing rutine duties.

Edited May 18, 2016 by ordnance

[UKPoacher]

The cost, in terms of time alone, to book in and then book back a firearm to every police officer every shift would be a massive waste of resources for no real purpose. Then you have all that training and maintaining that training year in year out to take into account. Its all taking police away from what they should be doing.

 

For what? is there a real need that exists? Of course it would be nice but it it would probably clip a half an hour of productive time off each officers shift while they queue up to book in and book back every day, check and load etc. That half hour multiplied thousands of times over across the length and breadth of the country would be better spent on the streets.

 

How long before police officers start getting their guns taken off them? Police officers getting shot with their own guns is not that uncommon in other parts of the world. The gun can be a massive liability at times and requires different policing techniques to keep yourself apart from the public so it can't get snatched. No more up close and friendly community policing

 

Its easy to say arm the police without really considering what it would entail

 

That's my view too. Extra training, extra secure lockers, extra paperwork and the whole ethos of policing would have to be altered. No wrestling with drunks or dragging husband and wife apart at a domestic.

[kent]

Home office did extensive research on this post the riots of the 80s. Stats said they couldn't recruit enough cops to replace those that would be accidentally killed by thier own

Bad idea thier record isn't good to say the least. Won't touch on why because it gets onto police hate and I don't having good friends in serving mow and I'm the past ( some of them armed)

 

Clay pigeon? By gosh! Glad we don't have a civil defence force - the two are in no real way linked to competence

[achosenman]

What do you suggest, if armed police see a shooting they should decide if its criminals or terrorists, if its terrorists do nothing and call the army.

 

 

Being deliberately obtuse does lend itself to any meaningful discussion. You are not the only one experienced in the NIPS. I spent many tours over in your neck of the woods standing side by side with some very professional police officers. They were however, Police officers and they do a different job, rightly so.

 

The military is the right arm of the country and as such, is used to counter armed aggression, not the Police.

 

Atb

[ordnance]

 

Being deliberately obtuse does lend itself to any meaningful discussion. You are not the only one experienced in the NIPS. I spent many tours over in your neck of the woods standing side by side with some very professional police officers. They were however, Police officers and they do a different job, rightly so.

 

The military is the right arm of the country and as such, is used to counter armed aggression, not the Police.

 

Atb

What do you suggest the army patrolling the streets, i am sure there are already army units set up to help if the police can't deal with a situation. When you were here you would know that the army and RUC dealt with terrorists.

 

 

Home office did extensive research on this post the riots of the 80s. Stats said they couldn't recruit enough cops to replace those that would be accidentally killed by thier own

Rubbish. ( I caint recall any police officer shooting himself or a colleague here and they have being carrying firearms on and off duty for the last 50n years or so. )

 

 

No wrestling with drunks or dragging husband and wife apart at a domestic.

What do you think the police do with drunks etc here, just let them go because they doint want to wrestle with them.

Edited May 18, 2016 by ordnance

[Scully]

Home office did extensive research on this post the riots of the 80s. Stats said they couldn't recruit enough cops to replace those that would be accidentally killed by thier own

 

 

 

What a crock of pooh!