BASC says don’t pay medical fee

[bornfree]

just got an invoice from my doctor for £62

[mossy835]

so will you pay or not,did the police need any further.

Edited July 16, 2016 by mossy835

[bornfree]

Not sure what to do. If I don't are they going to put something down on my file to get back at me?

[rbrowning2]

So as i think I said before this has quickly got out of control the shooter is being made to pay a fee the fee can be anything the doctor wants it to be and we got the ten year certificate oh but we did not we got done over as normal.

[mct94]

I was asked to provide a medical report, I asked my doctor and they said there may be a fee, they didn't say how much, fast forward 3 weeks and my SGC came through the door this Thursday morning never ended up paying for it?

[mossy835]

this is the trouble do you pay the doctor,or tell him to take a hike.so then you and your doctor fall out.

Not sure what to do. If I don't are they going to put something down on my file to get back at me?

 

 

this could happen.

[bornfree]

I suppose £62 over 5 years is not too bad but I have no medical history I've seen the doctor once in 6 years ( for a skin condition) so how can they charge £62 when others are doing it for free or £25.

[David BASC]

It was clearly agreed that no fee would be charged for completing the form from the police and putting a marker on the record. it is also clear from the BMA that doctors should not change for additional work unless this has been agreed between them and the person concerned.

 

If shooters simply sit back and take this without saying or doing anything, hten , well you know exactly what will happen. Please lets work together to stand up for what has been agreed by all parties

[southman1]

In my earlier thread I have stayted that I have refused to pay the ,the police and Drs .i have still not here'd from ,both parties ,if everyone says no ,and stick to gether, for our rights.

[McSpredder]

It was clearly agreed that no fee would be charged for completing the form from the police and putting a marker on the record. it is also clear from the BMA that doctors should not change for additional work unless this has been agreed between them and the person concerned.

 

If shooters simply sit back and take this without saying or doing anything, hten , well you know exactly what will happen. Please lets work together to stand up for what has been agreed by all parties

Two questions about these invoices that people have apparently received out of the blue:

 

 

1. Is a business entitled to issue an invoice for a service that the customer has never requested, and when was never any prior discussion or agreement about either the work or the fees to be charged? There have been lots of well known scams of this type, but I have never heard of any reputable organisation getting involved in such practices

 

 

2. When anyone receives an unexpected invoice from a GP, would it be appropriate to send a letter saying something on the following lines? It seems more diplomatic to enquire whether there has been an error, rather than directly accuse somebody of attempted extortion (even if that is what it feels like).

 

 

*************************

 

Dear Dr xxxx

 

With reference to the invoice that has been sent to me, I am wondering whether there may have been some administrative error.

 

 

I know that police procedure is to send a standard letter to a GP, enquiring whether there is any medical condition that might affect a person’s suitability to possess a firearm or shotgun. The official Home Office Guide on Firearms Licensing Law (published April 2016) states explicitly: “Initial check of the patient record in response to the standard police letter – there is no expectation of a fee.”

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/518193/Guidance_on_Firearms_Licensing_Law_April_2016_v20.pdf

 

 

I have also seen the guidance on the British Medical Association website (updated 30 June 2016) saying that “The work involved in responding to the letter is minimal and therefore can be undertaken easily without delay and without a fee.”

 

https://www.bma.org.uk/advice/employment/ethics/ethics-a-to-z/firearms

 

 

To quote again from the Home Office Guide: “Where a medical report is required due to the GP raising concerns or because the police require sight of a medical report for another reason – the police will pay the fee“

 

 

The Home Office Guide also states that “Medical information provided by the GP to the police will be copied to the applicant or certificate holder unless there is a strong reason not to do so”. I have not received any such copy, therefore I am assuming that no medical report has been supplied.

 

 

The invoice sent to me does seem to be in direct conflict with information published by the Home Office and the BMA, and that is the reason why I am enquiring whether it might have been issued in error.

 

 

Yours etc

 

*************************

 

[bluesj]

Two questions about these invoices that people have apparently received out of the blue:

 

 

 

1. Is a business entitled to issue an invoice for a service that the customer has never requested, and when was never any prior discussion or agreement about either the work or the fees to be charged? There have been lots of well known scams of this type, but I have never heard of any reputable organisation getting involved in such practices

 

 

 

2. When anyone receives an unexpected invoice from a GP, would it be appropriate to send a letter saying something on the following lines? It seems more diplomatic to enquire whether there has been an error, rather than directly accuse somebody of attempted extortion (even if that is what it feels like).

 

 

 

*************************

 

Dear Dr xxxx

 

With reference to the invoice that has been sent to me, I am wondering whether there may have been some administrative error.

 

 

 

I know that police procedure is to send a standard letter to a GP, enquiring whether there is any medical condition that might affect a person’s suitability to possess a firearm or shotgun. The official Home Office Guide on Firearms Licensing Law (published April 2016) states explicitly: “Initial check of the patient record in response to the standard police letter – there is no expectation of a fee.”

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/518193/Guidance_on_Firearms_Licensing_Law_April_2016_v20.pdf

 

 

 

I have also seen the guidance on the British Medical Association website (updated 30 June 2016) saying that “The work involved in responding to the letter is minimal and therefore can be undertaken easily without delay and without a fee.”

 

https://www.bma.org.uk/advice/employment/ethics/ethics-a-to-z/firearms

 

 

 

To quote again from the Home Office Guide: “Where a medical report is required due to the GP raising concerns or because the police require sight of a medical report for another reason – the police will pay the fee“

 

 

 

The Home Office Guide also states that “Medical information provided by the GP to the police will be copied to the applicant or certificate holder unless there is a strong reason not to do so”. I have not received any such copy, therefore I am assuming that no medical report has been supplied.

 

 

 

The invoice sent to me does seem to be in direct conflict with information published by the Home Office and the BMA, and that is the reason why I am enquiring whether it might have been issued in error.

 

 

 

Yours etc

 

*************************

 

That looks like a good way to deal with it for those that are in the process of renewal or grant at the moment, for use that haven't got a renewal coming up hopefully it will get sorted before then. Maybe this letter should be a sticky for everyone to use.

[Scully]

Two questions about these invoices that people have apparently received out of the blue:

 

 

 

1. Is a business entitled to issue an invoice for a service that the customer has never requested, and when was never any prior discussion or agreement about either the work or the fees to be charged? There have been lots of well known scams of this type, but I have never heard of any reputable organisation getting involved in such practices

 

 

 

2. When anyone receives an unexpected invoice from a GP, would it be appropriate to send a letter saying something on the following lines? It seems more diplomatic to enquire whether there has been an error, rather than directly accuse somebody of attempted extortion (even if that is what it feels like).

 

 

 

*************************

 

Dear Dr xxxx

 

With reference to the invoice that has been sent to me, I am wondering whether there may have been some administrative error.

 

 

 

I know that police procedure is to send a standard letter to a GP, enquiring whether there is any medical condition that might affect a person’s suitability to possess a firearm or shotgun. The official Home Office Guide on Firearms Licensing Law (published April 2016) states explicitly: “Initial check of the patient record in response to the standard police letter – there is no expectation of a fee.”

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/518193/Guidance_on_Firearms_Licensing_Law_April_2016_v20.pdf

 

 

 

I have also seen the guidance on the British Medical Association website (updated 30 June 2016) saying that “The work involved in responding to the letter is minimal and therefore can be undertaken easily without delay and without a fee.”

 

https://www.bma.org.uk/advice/employment/ethics/ethics-a-to-z/firearms

 

 

 

To quote again from the Home Office Guide: “Where a medical report is required due to the GP raising concerns or because the police require sight of a medical report for another reason – the police will pay the fee“

 

 

 

The Home Office Guide also states that “Medical information provided by the GP to the police will be copied to the applicant or certificate holder unless there is a strong reason not to do so”. I have not received any such copy, therefore I am assuming that no medical report has been supplied.

 

 

 

The invoice sent to me does seem to be in direct conflict with information published by the Home Office and the BMA, and that is the reason why I am enquiring whether it might have been issued in error.

 

 

 

Yours etc

 

*************************

 

 

Good work McSpredder, as usual.

[McSpredder]

this is the trouble do you pay the doctor,or tell him to take a hike.so then you and your doctor fall out.

 

this could happen.

This might be a small risk, but it is certainly a very real risk.

In general, I prefer to sort out disagreements in face-to-face discussion rather than through formal correspondence, but in the matter of certificates it probably wise to put things in writing. Simply ignoring the invoice might not be a good idea. You do not want to find out at some future date that a GP has told police “I have proof that this person fails to pay invoices for services provided, therefore I consider him to be dishonest, and not a suitable person to be in possession of firearms.”

[Rimfireboy]

Recently got my new certificates through. Nothing from doctors, yet, but thanks for the information, just in case.

[ehb102]

I think I might send our practice manager the BASC information before renewal time next year.

[Paul223]

Two questions about these invoices that people have apparently received out of the blue:

 

1. Is a business entitled to issue an invoice for a service that the customer has never requested, and when was never any prior discussion or agreement about either the work or the fees to be charged? There have been lots of well known scams of this type, but I have never heard of any reputable organisation getting involved in such practices

 

2. When anyone receives an unexpected invoice from a GP, would it be appropriate to send a letter saying something on the following lines? It seems more diplomatic to enquire whether there has been an error, rather than directly accuse somebody of attempted extortion (even if that is what it feels like).

 

*************************

Dear Dr xxxx

With reference to the invoice that has been sent to me, I am wondering whether there may have been some administrative error.

 

I know that police procedure is to send a standard letter to a GP, enquiring whether there is any medical condition that might affect a persons suitability to possess a firearm or shotgun. The official Home Office Guide on Firearms Licensing Law (published April 2016) states explicitly: Initial check of the patient record in response to the standard police letter there is no expectation of a fee.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/518193/Guidance_on_Firearms_Licensing_Law_April_2016_v20.pdf

 

I have also seen the guidance on the British Medical Association website (updated 30 June 2016) saying that The work involved in responding to the letter is minimal and therefore can be undertaken easily without delay and without a fee.

https://www.bma.org.uk/advice/employment/ethics/ethics-a-to-z/firearms

 

To quote again from the Home Office Guide: Where a medical report is required due to the GP raising concerns or because the police require sight of a medical report for another reason the police will pay the fee

 

The Home Office Guide also states that Medical information provided by the GP to the police will be copied to the applicant or certificate holder unless there is a strong reason not to do so. I have not received any such copy, therefore I am assuming that no medical report has been supplied.

 

The invoice sent to me does seem to be in direct conflict with information published by the Home Office and the BMA, and that is the reason why I am enquiring whether it might have been issued in error.

 

Yours etc

*************************

Very nice, may be a revised version to send to the GP at the same time as posting a renewal off to prevent any such invoice occurring in the first place!

[sportsbob]

Very nice, may be a revised version to send to the GP at the same time as posting a renewal off to prevent any such invoice occurring in the first place!

No , let them make a fool of themselves that way they might learn the lesson.

[sportsbob]

This

 

"During the application process •

 

Where a medical report is needed because the applicant has declared a medical condition on the application form – the applicant will pay the fee."

 

So in reality a very small percentage I would guess.

[BrowningB525]

This

 

"During the application process

 

Where a medical report is needed because the applicant has declared a medical condition on the application form the applicant will pay the fee."

 

So in reality a very small percentage I would guess.

In this instance it is fair to pay the fee.

 

Fir the gp putting a marker on your file and responding to the police. Not so much.

[Scully]

I am one of the few who needs to add further details due to a past medical issue over 20 years ago. I have since declared it and it is known to licensing, but since it was declared before the licensing BMA agreement and I have had no further incidences of the condition since, I don't intend to pay either. I simply write on my application what the condition was, when it occurred and there have been no repeat issues since, as I did at previous renewals.

Co-terminous tickets are due to expire in October so we'll see how it pans out.

[mr smith]

I am one of the few who needs to add further details due to a past medical issue over 20 years ago. I have since declared it and it is known to licensing, but since it was declared before the licensing BMA agreement and I have had no further incidences of the condition since, I don't intend to pay either. I simply write on my application what the condition was, when it occurred and there have been no repeat issues since, as I did at previous renewals.

Co-terminous tickets are due to expire in October so we'll see how it pans out.

[/quo3te]

 

Would be interested in the outcome,in similar postion though not as far back but declared several times during renewals and variation's.

[Scully]

 

Would be interested in the outcome,in similar postion though not as far back but declared several times during renewals and variation's.

 

Then if they already have your info' you shouldn't need to pay either. I'm basing my stance on the fact that licensing have already read my medical history as it pertains to my suitability to possess firearms, and as it hasn't changed since initial declaration I see no reason why I should pay for a GP's report when it will only contain information they already have.

Licensing may see it differently of course, but as I've said, we'll see how it pans out, and will let you and PW know.

[Penelope]

From Essex Polices application.

 

For me the important parts are DO YOU SUFFER... Not have you suffered from in the past, as was. I had a bout of depression 20 odd years ago, which has been disclosed previously during applications. I do not suffer anymore, so will not be disclosing, the form does not ask me to.

 

The question is below.

 

PART B: Personal health & medical declaration

If necessary, continue on page 6

10.

Do you suffer from any

relevant

medical conditions?

 

Important: Read notes 4-12 before completion.

 

 

Back up information from the guidance notes.

 

Medical information

 

4.

 

You must disclose any physical or mental health condition that may affect your ability to safely possess and use a firearm (including a shotgun). Sections 27 and 28 of the Firearms Act 1968 (as amended) specify that in order to issue a firearm or shotgun certificate the chief officer of police must be satisfied that an applicant can be permitted to possess a gun ‘without danger to the public safety or the peace’. Medical fitness is one of the factors police must consider when assessing a person’s suitability

 

5. Relevant medical conditions which must be disclosed include, for example:

 Acute Stress Reaction or an acute reaction to the stress caused by a trauma

 Suicidal thoughts or self harm

 Depression or anxiety

 Dementia

 Mania, bipolar disorder or a psychotic illness

 A personality disorder

 A neurological condition: for example, Multiple Sclerosis, Parkinson’s or Huntington’s diseases, or epilepsy

 Alcohol or drug related abuse

Or any other condition, mental or physical, which might affect your safe possession of firearms. If in any doubt, consult your GP.

 

6. If you have disclosed a relevant medical condition the police may ask you to obtain a medical report from your GP/specialist. You are expected to meet the cost if a fee is charged for this. If further information is required the police may request and pay for a further report.

 

7. Where no relevant medical conditions are disclosed the police will contact your GP asking if they are aware of any relevant medical conditions or have any concerns about the issue of the firearm or shotgun certificate. Depending on the reply, the police may ask you to obtain a medical report from your GP/specialist. You are expected to meet the cost if a fee is charged for this. If further information is required the police may request and pay for a further report.

 

8. The police will ask your GP to place an encoded reminder on your patient record to indicate that you have been issued with a firearm or shotgun certificate. The GP is asked to notify the police if, following issue of the certificate, you begin to suffer from a relevant medical condition, or if the GP has other concerns about your possession of a certificate that might affect your safe possession of firearms. Following contact from your GP there may be a need for a medical report to be obtained to assist with assessment of your continued suitability to possess a firearm

[bornfree]

Two questions about these invoices that people have apparently received out of the blue:

 

1. Is a business entitled to issue an invoice for a service that the customer has never requested, and when was never any prior discussion or agreement about either the work or the fees to be charged? There have been lots of well known scams of this type, but I have never heard of any reputable organisation getting involved in such practices

 

2. When anyone receives an unexpected invoice from a GP, would it be appropriate to send a letter saying something on the following lines? It seems more diplomatic to enquire whether there has been an error, rather than directly accuse somebody of attempted extortion (even if that is what it feels like).

 

*************************

Dear Dr xxxx

With reference to the invoice that has been sent to me, I am wondering whether there may have been some administrative error.

 

I know that police procedure is to send a standard letter to a GP, enquiring whether there is any medical condition that might affect a person’s suitability to possess a firearm or shotgun. The official Home Office Guide on Firearms Licensing Law (published April 2016) states explicitly: “Initial check of the patient record in response to the standard police letter – there is no expectation of a fee.”

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/518193/Guidance_on_Firearms_Licensing_Law_April_2016_v20.pdf

 

I have also seen the guidance on the British Medical Association website (updated 30 June 2016) saying that “The work involved in responding to the letter is minimal and therefore can be undertaken easily without delay and without a fee.”

https://www.bma.org.uk/advice/employment/ethics/ethics-a-to-z/firearms

 

To quote again from the Home Office Guide: “Where a medical report is required due to the GP raising concerns or because the police require sight of a medical report for another reason – the police will pay the fee“

 

The Home Office Guide also states that “Medical information provided by the GP to the police will be copied to the applicant or certificate holder unless there is a strong reason not to do so”. I have not received any such copy, therefore I am assuming that no medical report has been supplied.

 

The invoice sent to me does seem to be in direct conflict with information published by the Home Office and the BMA, and that is the reason why I am enquiring whether it might have been issued in error.

 

Yours etc

*************************

 

Thanks for that I will send it off and let you know the outcome. If my next post is in Guns for sale you will know it went badly

Edited July 18, 2016 by bornfree

[McSpredder]

Thanks for that I will send it off and let you know the outcome. If my next post is in Guns for sale you will it went badly

If you are a member of BASC or one of the other organisations, it might be a good idea to run it past them first, in case they can suggest improvements to the wording. They have lots of experience in helping members to deal with "difficult" officialdom.

Also, try to keep updating David et al about the outcome, because BASC will probably revise their guidance from time to time.