ditchman Posted February 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 3 hours ago, Walker570 said: Old 16 gauge barrel cut and flattened at the chamber end produce this knife. Sharp as a razor. Laying such either side of a piece of tool steel as you suggest is an interesting idea. Worth a try. Don't the Japs do that sort of thing ? like that thanks for putting it up................lots of info being put around now.... good stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old farrier Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 3 hours ago, Walker570 said: A great youtube video The Secret World of the Japanese Swordmakers, shows how they wrap a harder centre with a softer multi layered steel. Well worth a watch. Very good not being fesieshus here bet was utube about 300 years ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old farrier Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 4 hours ago, TIGHTCHOKE said: Oh there is a fair amount of folding, but in traditional Japanese sword making, the low-carbon iron is folded several times by itself, to purify it. This produces the soft metal to be used for the core of the blade. The high-carbon steel and the higher-carbon cast-iron are then forged in alternating layers. The cast-iron is heated, quenched in water, and then broken into small pieces to help free it from slag. The steel is then forged into a single plate, and the pieces of cast-iron are piled on top, and the whole thing is forge welded into a single billet, which is called the age-kitae process. The billet is then elongated, cut, folded, and forge welded again. The steel can be folded transversely, (from front to back), or longitudinally, (from side to side). Often both folding directions are used to produce the desired grain pattern. This process, called the ****a-kitae, is repeated from 8 to as many as 16 times. After 20 foldings, (220, or about a million individual layers), there is too much diffusion in the carbon content. The steel becomes almost homogeneous in this respect, and the act of folding no longer gives any benefit to the steel. Depending on the amount of carbon introduced, this process forms either the very hard steel for the edge (hagane), or the slightly less hardenable spring steel (kawagane) which is often used for the sides and the back.[7] Straight from Wikipedia ??? So where did they get the high carbon steel from? Or maybe the process of folding and welding introducing carbon with the flux created it all the best of Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainBeaky Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 (edited) 6 hours ago, Old farrier said: Straight from Wikipedia ??? So where did they get the high carbon steel from? Or maybe the process of folding and welding introducing carbon with the flux created it all the best of ^^ This... Sandwiching a layer of hard steel between two softer layers is called san-mai, and is quite a common technique - gives a very hard edge, supported by softer, tougher sides. Japanese swords achieve the same effect by differential hardening: the spine of the blade is coated with clay to make it retain the heat longer. The blade is quenched edge-first into water, which makes the edge extremely hard, but the heat retained in the spine allows the quench, resulting in a softer, tougher temper. The difference in the crystal structure of the steel across it's width is what makes the blade curve - they are originally forged straight! This also makes them prone to breakage in the quench... I have some photos of a tanto I made which show this quite well - LINK Edited February 7, 2018 by CaptainBeaky Spelling and link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted February 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 Painting all done now ...got a call from the bearing folk to say the new rollers were in...so i will pick them up tomorrow morning £4.00 each....i will make a press to fit them as i dont want to bang 'em in...so will post those pics up tomorrow....... if it is not tooo damn cold.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainBeaky Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 Looking good, dm. (Not jealous at all, honest... ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amateur Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 3 hours ago, ditchman said: ...got a call from the bearing folk to say the new rollers were in...so i will pick them up tomorrow morning £4.00 each... Well, that's a bit cheaper than £8.50! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted February 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 4 minutes ago, amateur said: Well, that's a bit cheaper than £8.50! there were some e-bay @ £1.99 each..................but i wernt sure of their size as these are for 3/4" shaft and 24mm ODia...........so i thought i would be safe and get them from my welding supplies place in Norwich which i use... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amateur Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 1 minute ago, ditchman said: there were some e-bay @ £1.99 each..................but i wernt sure of their size as these are for 3/4" shaft and 24mm ODia...........so i thought i would be safe and get them from my welding supplies place in Norwich which i use... Always better if you can easily return them if they are wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 16 hours ago, mel b3 said: absolutely excellent . ive been intending to built myself a forge , and make a few knives for a while now , the colour chart is just what ive been waiting to find Mel, for your blade steel GFS, you could try Cromwell tools (West Brom) or Metal super markets (Tipton) price around £10-£15 for a 5x25x500 piece, unless of course you can get it from someone you know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted February 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 (edited) right ...just to finish off today.............instead of putting rivets back in the guide roller i found some high tensile set screws (allen)...drilled the linkage out and they are interferance fit..couple of locknuts .. jobs a gooden...pick bearings up tomorrow for next installment.. just had a look at this post..................its starting to look like a bloody steam engine... Edited February 7, 2018 by ditchman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 4 minutes ago, ditchman said: right ...just to finish off today.............instead of putting rivets back in the guide roller i found some high tensile set screws (allen)...drilled the linkage out and they are interferance fit..couple of locknuts .. jobs a gooden...pick bearings up tomorrow for next installment.. just had a look at this post..................its starting to look like a bloody steam engine... That looks really good, do you have a stand for it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 Great stuff but you are going too fast. At this rate you will be finished next week and the first of your knives will be rolled out the following week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mightymariner Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 ...and if it doesn't work out, scrap metal is fetching £900 a tonne round these parts as I discovered when I got rid of some old wheels in my cellar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted February 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 38 minutes ago, old'un said: That looks really good, do you have a stand for it? im not sure wether to have it at 45deg's or flat on the bench yet............. 37 minutes ago, JDog said: Great stuff but you are going too fast. At this rate you will be finished next week and the first of your knives will be rolled out the following week. no way ...wont pick the raiser plate up till next week...then there will be installments on the building of the guide table....then got to get the motor sorted....some mild steel billetsto practice on.....then i have got to get hold of bits of antler.......then i need to buy in some copper round bar.....flat brass bar....then by in some o1 tool steel round bar for the riveting tools i will make dont worry lots of stuff to do yet before i even try and make something to cut myself on.. 2 minutes ago, Mightymariner said: ...and if it doesn't work out, scrap metal is fetching £900 a tonne round these parts as I discovered when I got rid of some old wheels in my cellar. FAILURE IS NOT AN OPTION Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mightymariner Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 I admire your determination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 2 hours ago, old'un said: Mel, for your blade steel GFS, you could try Cromwell tools (West Brom) or Metal super markets (Tipton) price around £10-£15 for a 5x25x500 piece, unless of course you can get it from someone you know. im very fortunate with the steel dave , ive been given a couple of pieces of o1 tool steel by a pw member/customer/friend , he gets quite a few scrap offcuts and has very generously offered to save the suitable ones for me. ive been meaning to build a gas bottle forge for ages , i just have a thousand other jobs that keep jumping to the top of the list.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 2 hours ago, ditchman said: right ...just to finish off today.............instead of putting rivets back in the guide roller i found some high tensile set screws (allen)...drilled the linkage out and they are interferance fit..couple of locknuts .. jobs a gooden...pick bearings up tomorrow for next installment.. just had a look at this post..................its starting to look like a bloody steam engine... is it wrong that i just had a twitch ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 21 minutes ago, mel b3 said: im very fortunate with the steel dave , ive been given a couple of pieces of o1 tool steel by a pw member/customer/friend , he gets quite a few scrap offcuts and has very generously offered to save the suitable ones for me. ive been meaning to build a gas bottle forge for ages , i just have a thousand other jobs that keep jumping to the top of the list.. Yep I know what you mean mate, but just think of all the fun you could have building it, you could start a thread/topic on here called “Mel’s Melter” I will keep an eye open for it, and I guess the next thing is a belt linisher for your blades, unless you already have one?...or you could build one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted February 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 26 minutes ago, mel b3 said: is it wrong that i just had a twitch ? and what sort of twitch would that be.............could it be the one which involves the "longest" hair in your body...you know the one....its when you scratch your "nipsey" and your eye twtches.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 14 minutes ago, old'un said: Yep I know what you mean mate, but just think of all the fun you could have building it, you could start a thread/topic on here called “Mel’s Melter” I will keep an eye open for it, and I guess the next thing is a belt linisher for your blades, unless you already have one?...or you could build one! i have two belt linishers waiting for me to collect from my dads workshop, i just cant bring myself to get them , walking in there just isnt right without him sitting in his deckchair smoking a roll up. 3 minutes ago, ditchman said: and what sort of twitch would that be.............could it be the one which involves the "longest" hair in your body...you know the one....its when you scratch your "nipsey" and your eye twtches.. thats the one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted February 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 28 minutes ago, mel b3 said: i have two belt linishers waiting for me to collect from my dads workshop, i just cant bring myself to get them , walking in there just isnt right without him sitting in his deckchair smoking a roll up. thats the one could be dangerous........lifechanging..............living the dream ey ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
la bala Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 1 hour ago, mel b3 said: im very fortunate with the steel dave , ive been given a couple of pieces of o1 tool steel by a pw member/customer/friend , he gets quite a few scrap offcuts and has very generously offered to save the suitable ones for me. ive been meaning to build a gas bottle forge for ages , i just have a thousand other jobs that keep jumping to the top of the list.. Hey mel if you have any links on plans and dimensions for gas bottle forges i would be interested. PM if you have thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 12 minutes ago, la bala said: Hey mel if you have any links on plans and dimensions for gas bottle forges i would be interested. PM if you have thanks. im not techie enough to post links . i watched a couple of builds on youtube , very rough and ready stuff(just the way i like to build things). i make the odd gas bottle log burner already , ill just need to add a bit of air and ill be good to go...... i hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
la bala Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 3 minutes ago, mel b3 said: im not techie enough to post links . i watched a couple of builds on youtube , very rough and ready stuff(just the way i like to build things). i make the odd gas bottle log burner already , ill just need to add a bit of air and ill be good to go...... i hope. Thanks mel. Anyone else on here have links to plans? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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