Benthejockey Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 I fancy a bit of a change. I’ve got my HMR which I’ve had for ages now without any problems. But I fancy swapping it in for a little centrefire. A quick look on gun trader and I’ve got a couple of choices the 17 Rem or the 17 Hornet. The hornets are pricier to buy but there’s more of them to choose from. I want something to directly replace the HMR for rabbits, crows, foxes etc. A fun gun. I can reload but i will but factory ammo to begin with. So ladies and gentlemen let’s heae some opinions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetter Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 Hi Ben I have a hornet and its a nice round to use moderates well and is as cheap as chips to reload (I have had a tub of H4198 for about 8 months and am only half way through it you are looking at 11.7gn of powder per round) although it can be fiddly as small amounts of powder variation on the reloads can be critical. Cost wise you can get it down to .17HMR cost with reloading especially as .17HMR is going up a lot. On bunnies if you want to eat them it can be a bit devastating anything other than a headshot (this generally leaves no head) makes them unedible apart from for ferrets. Foxes are no issue but I dont go above 150yards with it being such a small pill as your shot placement needs to be right. Its the same ballistic trajectory as a .223 so I generally zero mine at 150 yards and its point and shoot from about 40 to 180 yards. Rifle wise there is a new HW60 variant coming out at an eyewatering costs but most tend to go for a CZ 527 which is what I have and really like it. Savage do 17 as well but they are a bit lower quality than the CZ in my opinion. .17 Rem is a bit more of a step up as there a hell of a lot more powder behind it I think people have had them running stupidly fast with the right load. Dougy on here has one I think so he would be better to advise than me but from reading what he put the .17 Rem isnt really a .17 HMR substitute its more akin to a .204 Ruger. Also its really reload only as I dont think there is a lot of factory ammo about if any. Cheers Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benthejockey Posted February 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 Cheers Neil, I try to head shoot rabbits with the HMR if I want to eat them because I got tired of skinning them and finding the chest shots had exploded and ruptured the guts. Rabbit guts stink even when they’re not perforated! I like that the hornet only uses a little bit of powder! If I want to poke at foxes further away I’ve got the bigger guns to play with so it is just going to be a direct replacement for the HMR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetter Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 If thats the case mate I would go for the Hornet personally I think the .17 Rem is a bit more of a .204 / .223 replacement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulboy1957 Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 I've had a savage. 17 hornet for 18 months, my shooting mate has the cz, both great accurate guns, cz is better build quality, savage has a better stock and accutrigger, between the two of us we had 285 foxes and hundreds of rabbits in 2017. We both have. 222s as well but really don't use them much anymore,. 17 does all the 222s do, but quieter. Reloading is a must and cheap to reload at 35p a round Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted February 7, 2018 Report Share Posted February 7, 2018 You have got to go 17 rem and have a semi custom job. You missed out on a beautiful Sako S491 action in SD. It's right out of the ballparks with the hornet and hmr. Nowhere near. You Will get 4500 with a 20 grain that's fast, and you see every bit of hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_b_wales Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 Although not what you asked, you could consider a .22 Hornet. An excellent and underestimated caliber. Cheap to reload too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benthejockey Posted February 8, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 Dougy 4500 is laser fast! Steve ideally I was looking for a 17 to directly replace the HMR. I like the frangibility of those little bullets. I know they can still zing off into the wild blue yonder but they’re more likely to just disintegrate if they hit something. And although I like the rifles being cheap as chips the bullet weights are too close to the 223. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_b_wales Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 8 hours ago, Benthejockey said: Dougy 4500 is laser fast! Steve ideally I was looking for a 17 to directly replace the HMR. I like the frangibility of those little bullets. I know they can still zing off into the wild blue yonder but they’re more likely to just disintegrate if they hit something. And although I like the rifles being cheap as chips the bullet weights are too close to the 223. (.204 is a cracker too!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 (edited) I have been shooting a 17 Remington for the last thirty years. Would never be without one. Brilliant little cartridge, just don't go blatting hundreds of rounds down range at pieces of paper et all and burning the barrel and your barrel will last as long as any other. My first one I picked up from the custom rifle maker in the US in 1987, it was a small Martini action and a very heavy Douglas Premium barrel. I killed thousands of vermin with this rifle. Over 300 foxes on 2000 acres in one year. It eventually, in 1999, started to open up the group to about 1 inch at a 100 and I decided to look for another barrel which would go on my T/C Encore frame. Purchased one from SSK Industries in the USA 16 1/2 inches and it puts them in the same hole if I do. I have used a variety of bullets over that time including some custom made 15 g FMJs. Finally gone back to 25gr Hornady, they do the job. The largest animal I have shot was a couple of javelina in Texas. Heart shots, took one jump and job done. Rabbits at 300 plus in a wind are fun. Having said that I would love to try the Hornet. Dougy is spot on. All the others are good cartridges but the 17 Ren ro me is head and shoulders above. My reloads are popping on at about 4100 but the foxes don't notice the difference. Edited February 8, 2018 by Walker570 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markm Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 (edited) I have a CZ 17 hornet and it does the job. I previous had a HW66 Jagd in 17HMR and for the difference in cost it’s like buying a Ford Mondeo for £650 or a Audi A8 for £900. Yes £250 more but you get a lot more for your bucks! I always planned on buying one in 22 hornet and getting it rebarrelled. No need to now!! Edited February 8, 2018 by markm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 If you do get a 17Rem then don't go for all out speed, get it deadly accurate. I had some 15grain hollow points and if I pushed them over 4000 which was not at all difficult they would vaporise about 30ft out of the barrel... a puff of grey smoke. Kept them down to 3800 and they marmalised crows and magpies, just bits spread about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benthejockey Posted February 8, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 Blaaaady hell boys this isn’t helping ? so the rem is an exciting laser guided pig poker but can melt barrels and vapourise bullets and the hornet is tamer and trundles along at a more sedate pace and is an all round more sensible chap but equally capable of knocking the small furries over. On gun trader the second hand rem’s are cheaper than the hornets but the ammo is cheaper/available for the hornet than the rem without reloading. But then for reloading both use the same components. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 I use a moderate load in my 17REM to get more life out the barrel. Still a tack driver that is incredibly predictable and satisfying on the occasional outing it gets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 (edited) The barrel burning issue came from the States where they just sit at a bench and blow anything and everything to pieces, then cook a burger on their barrels. As Dave-G says treat the round with common sense then you will lay thousands of furry things down before the barrel starts to show signs of wear. Mine, one shot to check it is still on and then it has to be soft and furry or feathery. If you enjoy blatting rounds down range at metal plates or such then the 17 Rem is really not for you ...45-70 might be a better choice. Edited February 8, 2018 by Walker570 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 I've had the 20 grain vmax up to 4900 and still make it to the target in 1 piece (blown primer, slightly too much powder). Don't know anything about the 15 grain bullets. If you were closer i let you have a go with mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 (edited) I have used the 20gr and with success with no problems. I don't have any of the custom made 15g hps or full metal jackets left. They were given to me to try by the late John Wootters when I stayed there in Texas. I think they were a short run by a custom bullet maker and given to John to test and evaluate, because since then (1988) I have never seen the company listed. The main reason I now use the 25gr is because I made a purchase of a few boxes when I was in Texas last at a very good price. They do the job. I don't have my book here but I think my 20gr load was running about 4300. My main grouse is I can't find W760 now which produced the very best groups ever. Edited February 8, 2018 by Walker570 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casts_by_fly Posted February 8, 2018 Report Share Posted February 8, 2018 The hornet can be moderated with a Sak moderator. With the rem you have to step up a bit bigger and heavier. i run almost the same as walkers rig, but in hornet (16” encore). I’m pushing 20 gr vmax to a +/- 1” point blank range to 200 yards and it shoots 3/4” groups at a hundred with 4198. Like all have said, cheap to reload, easy to shoot. Great walkabout gun. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetter Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 Also on the hornet front don't do what I did and get a big mod for it .I had a Wildcat Evo on mine nice mod but pretty heavy especially as I have a varmint barrel. I now have a Wildcat Panther on it which is still calibre specific but loads less weight and does the job as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halowa Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 As the 17 hornet is cf and faster than the 22 hornet, is it ok for a sak mod? When I first got my HMR that was under scrutiny...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 29 minutes ago, halowa said: As the 17 hornet is cf and faster than the 22 hornet, is it ok for a sak mod? When I first got my HMR that was under scrutiny...... It won't last long. Get something more up to the job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markm Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 11 minutes ago, Dougy said: It won't last long. Get something more up to the job. 11 minutes ago, Dougy said: It won't last long. Get something more up to the job. I wasn’t asking. Cast by fly suggested it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted February 9, 2018 Report Share Posted February 9, 2018 31 minutes ago, markm said: I wasn’t asking. Cast by fly suggested it. Was I a little abrupt ? Sorry didn't mean to be. The Sak will definitely suppress it but it will burn out. The HMR does, and it's only got 7 grain of powder in, the hornet nearly twice the amount. You could say that with the Sak being just £30 It's a disposable item. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_b_wales Posted February 10, 2018 Report Share Posted February 10, 2018 Regarding moderators for 17 Hornet /22 Hornet etc, I use a Phantom moderator on my .22 Hornet which is rated for centrefire. It's lighweight and fits over the barrel. I purchased mine from Sportsman Guncentre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edinburgh Rifles Posted February 10, 2018 Report Share Posted February 10, 2018 Have just the thing right here! https://www.guntrader.uk/guns/rifles/remington/bolt-action/17-rem/700-stainless-synthetic-fluted-180128104824373 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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