Kids and Guns.

[Westley]

Can I ask any 'Dads' who are taking their Kids shooting, to ensure those Kids are well versed in basic gun safety. I have noticed a couple of incidents at local clay shooting grounds recently that should have been nipped in the bud, before they are allowed to progress. They involved the removal of a gun from both a gun rack and a gunslip. Dad was present, BUT 'blind leading blind' springs to mind. In the first incident a lad of about 11 years of age, takes a closed gun from a gunslip, a single barrel .410, with a top lever. He then begins to look for somewhere to put the gunslip, whilst waving the closed gun around. As I started to make a move towards him, Dad relieves him of the still closed gun and merely put the gun in the rack. At no time was that gun opened, prior to being put in the gun rack. The second incident involved Dad and 2 sons aged around 14 and 10. They all preferred to carry the guns around their necks, but that aside, again gun safety became an issue. The 10 year old had a single barrel Baikal .410. Now I know that the opening lever on this model of gun can be a bit tricky, due to it's location, but THAT is all the more reason why Dad should be more aware of what the young lad is doing. I have taught my 3 Grandsons (and previously my 2 Daughters) to shoot. Without exception, they all knew how to take from and replace a gun in a gun rack and a gunslip BEFORE they ever went near a shooting ground. That was hammered home in the back garden, long before they ever fired a gun. If I was teaching them, my gun stayed at home. That way they received 100 % of my attention and I ALWAYS controlled the ammunition. I dislike saying anything to Dad, in front of the kids, BUT sometimes I am made to feel that there is no other option. Dads please, if you are going to teach the kids (and NOTHING even compares with the enjoyment of doing that ) ensure that you are well versed in all aspects of gun safety and teach them correctly from the start.  Thanks, rant over  !

[JJsDad]

44 minutes ago, Westley said:

Thanks, rant over  !

Thats not a rant. That`s a large dose of common sence. A 10 or 11 year old can kill or maim someone just as easy as an adult and then has to live with the consequences. Surprised they didnt have a safety officer available who could have taken the parent to one side and had a word in his shell like ear.

[Farmboy91]

Sound words. 

My lads still a bit small for he's first shotgun but he has a .177 diana that was he's great grandfathers. We take it out to the back field any time he likes and like yourself we always go through the basics, carry the gun broken, never point the gun at anyone, ever, don't touch the trigger until you are ready to shoot etc. 

I feel like the younger I drum it into him the better, even if when the time comes he doesn't want to move on to shotguns he will always have a respect for all firearms and be safe around them, same as I was taught. 

Genuinely scary some of the things you see. 

 

Edited December 10, 2018 by Farmboy91

[welshwarrior]

Not a rant a good reminder for some.  

Often ive correct young clients in gun handling to get the reply my Dad showed me that or told that was fine. 

Regularly the dads go quite and look embrassed whilst I explain why there is a different/better way.  

Gun handling is very very important and should never be paid lip service 

[shalfordninja33]

It's difficult to be too safe IMO, I've taught a few friends to shoot and always drummed into them them it takes one mistake to cause a lifetime of misery, just dont go there. The clay ground is quite a structured environment, if they're not perfectly safe there I'd be more concerned with them out in the Field. 

Another Friends son has been shooting for a few years now and he'll be shooting on the beaters day under the supervision of one of the guns, his dad had been pushing for him to do more than I believe he's capable of, as a result they've both spent a lot more time shooting clays over the summer and the boy's now pretty capable. I explained to his dad that the boy's got the rest of his life to enjoy shooting, if it takes a year or two to get the basics nailed he'll be better for it.  

[Scully]

I am constantly amazed at the numbers of shooters of whatever experience, who have no idea of the correct way to sleeve and unsleeve a shotgun from to and from its slip. Have a look at some DC videos; even he doesn't have a clue!

[Diss4111]

1 hour ago, Scully said:

I am constantly amazed at the numbers of shooters of whatever experience, who have no idea of the correct way to sleeve and unsleeve a shotgun from to and from its slip. Have a look at some DC videos; even he doesn't have a clue!

Never a truer word spoken

[Westley]

5 hours ago, Scully said:

I am constantly amazed at the numbers of shooters of whatever experience, who have no idea of the correct way to sleeve and unsleeve a shotgun from to and from its slip. Have a look at some DC videos; even he doesn't have a clue!

For God's sake do NOT mention it to him though, he will really throw Teddy out of the cot  !  He has done so much to help Shooting in Britain with all of his 'Carrie On' vids  ! 

[Westley]

7 hours ago, shalfordninja33 said:

It's difficult to be too safe IMO, I've taught a few friends to shoot and always drummed into them them it takes one mistake to cause a lifetime of misery, just dont go there. The clay ground is quite a structured environment, if they're not perfectly safe there I'd be more concerned with them out in the Field. 

Another Friends son has been shooting for a few years now and he'll be shooting on the beaters day under the supervision of one of the guns, his dad had been pushing for him to do more than I believe he's capable of, as a result they've both spent a lot more time shooting clays over the summer and the boy's now pretty capable. I explained to his dad that the boy's got the rest of his life to enjoy shooting, if it takes a year or two to get the basics nailed he'll be better for it.  

I once warned a good friend about the downside of 'pushing' his son, with his shooting, the lad was around 11 then.  He is now a Barrister, living in London, married, with 3 kids of his own and has never looked at a gun since the episode when he was 11. Put him off for life  !

20 hours ago, JJsDad said:

Thats not a rant. That`s a large dose of common sence. A 10 or 11 year old can kill or maim someone just as easy as an adult and then has to live with the consequences. Surprised they didnt have a safety officer available who could have taken the parent to one side and had a word in his shell like ear.

Although qualified, I did not get the chance to speak with Dad, out of earshot with the lad,  and he had left before we got back to the clubhouse. I will make a point of seeing him though.

[Old farrier]

7 minutes ago, Westley said:

 

Although qualified, I did not get the chance to speak with Dad, out of earshot with the lad,  and he had left before we got back to the clubhouse. I will make a point of seeing him though.

Sorry but I never bother with the dad 

I just walk up to the kids compliment them on there gun and ask if I may look at it 

telling them how nice it is and how much I would have liked one at there age 

this usually gets the parents attention 

then I say 

would you like me to show you the safe way to put it into your slip explaining the process and reason for what I’m doing 

i then ask the kids to repeat the process help if they struggle and praise them for getting it correct 

and as I leave them to carry on I say 

make sure your dad does the same as he’ll be keeping a eye on you and you on him 

we are all safety officers 

never had a problem with a parent yet 

 

[Del T]

My boy has just turned 5 and knows how to remove his gun from his slip, how to carry it correctly and safely.

Little lads only take a split second to be distracted so I'm always right behind him when shooting clays or even carrying it just to be sure it's done correctly.

Come boxing day or over Christmas we will see many adults swinging loaded or unloaded closed guns around for their once a year shoot ( normally with 5 or 6 members of the family sharing one gun) and non of them have no idea, Now that does get scary.

[Wingman]

Unfortunately many in our sport are far from competent when handling a gun I have seen this with some of my own shooting friends and I always pick them up on any potential issue.  As for  my sons I have drummed the principles of gun handling into them but they still make mistakes. The important thing is for constant supervision and coaching and now my eldest handles his shotgun in a very safe manner.  That said I would always still remove the gun from the slip and break it and ask him to confirm its clear, can you see the "ground through it" is what I ask.  

As the previous poster mentioned the shooters who dust off their side by side for the once a year game shoot, which is often attended with a raging hangover from the previous night or those that start the day with a "sharpener" from the hip flask are a real concern.  Our local boxing day shoot last year had far too many sozzled shooters by the late morning, and unfortunately I think its an accident waiting to happen!

[Scully]

2 hours ago, Wingman said:

Unfortunately many in our sport are far from competent when handling a gun I have seen this with some of my own shooting friends and I always pick them up on any potential issue.  As for  my sons I have drummed the principles of gun handling into them but they still make mistakes. The important thing is for constant supervision and coaching and now my eldest handles his shotgun in a very safe manner.  That said I would always still remove the gun from the slip and break it and ask him to confirm its clear, can you see the "ground through it" is what I ask.  

As the previous poster mentioned the shooters who dust off their side by side for the once a year game shoot, which is often attended with a raging hangover from the previous night or those that start the day with a "sharpener" from the hip flask are a real concern.  Our local boxing day shoot last year had far too many sozzled shooters by the late morning, and unfortunately I think its an accident waiting to happen!

I apologise for coming across as pedantic, but the correct method is to break it BEFORE you remove it from the slip, and return it the same way. 

[Old farrier]

40 minutes ago, Scully said:

I apologise for coming across as pedantic, but the correct method is to break it BEFORE you remove it from the slip, and return it the same way. 

Not always possible 

breaking as you remove from the slip is however usually possible 

[hod]

4 hours ago, Del T said:

My boy has just turned 5 and knows how to remove his gun from his slip, how to carry it correctly and safely.

Little lads only take a split second to be distracted so I'm always right behind him when shooting clays or even carrying it just to be sure it's done correctly.

Come boxing day or over Christmas we will see many adults swinging loaded or unloaded closed guns around for their once a year shoot ( normally with 5 or 6 members of the family sharing one gun) and non of them have no idea, Now that does get scary.

Your five year old uses a shotgun? I’ve got a five year old but can’t imagine him holding an actual gun just yet! 

Sorry for the thread derail...

[Scully]

6 minutes ago, Old farrier said:

Not always possible 

breaking as you remove from the slip is however usually possible 

Ok, to be more accurate; break it before you remove it from the slip COMPLETELY then. 👍

[welshwarrior]

15 minutes ago, Scully said:

Ok, to be more accurate; break it before you remove it from the slip COMPLETELY then. 👍

👍🏻

[Old farrier]

47 minutes ago, Scully said:

Ok, to be more accurate; break it before you remove it from the slip COMPLETELY then. 👍

Checking the chambers and barrels as you do so 

obviously holding your slip in a safe direction 

[welshwarrior]

15 minutes ago, Old farrier said:

Checking the chambers and barrels as you do so 

obviously holding your slip in a safe direction 

What you shouldn’t swing it around like your drawing Excalibur in a Hollywood movie! Pointing the muzzles at everyone!!

[Westley]

Watch people taking a gun from a rack  !  In fact I know of several gun shops who hand you a closed gun off the rack  ?

[Old farrier]

25 minutes ago, welshwarrior said:

What you shouldn’t swing it around like your drawing Excalibur in a Hollywood movie! Pointing the muzzles at everyone!!

Only if you’re a adult trying to get attention 😉

[Scully]

1 hour ago, Old farrier said:

Checking the chambers and barrels as you do so 

obviously holding your slip in a safe direction 

If done correctly the slip will be pointing directly at the ground. I always rest the muzzle end of the slip on a boot while I unsleeve/sleeve my gun; if some feel uneasy with this the obvious question has to be why? 

[Westley]

33 minutes ago, Scully said:

If done correctly the slip will be pointing directly at the ground. I always rest the muzzle end of the slip on a boot while I unsleeve/sleeve my gun; if some feel uneasy with this the obvious question has to be why? 

Would it be safer if you used one of them leather toe protectors  ??    😎

[Scully]

26 minutes ago, Westley said:

Would it be safer if you used one of them leather toe protectors  ??    😎

 I'm covered thanks, as the muzzle end of my slip is covered in leather. 😉

[Del T]

5 hours ago, hod said:

Your five year old uses a shotgun? I’ve got a five year old but can’t imagine him holding an actual gun just yet! 

Sorry for the thread derail...

Yes he has a yildiz .410 single barrel. Had his first go before his 4th birthday then left it until he was around 4 and a half. He maybe has 3 or 4 shots every time we go which is most weekends. Some weekends he doesn't fancy it so we don't push him.

He's a good shot so far. Just on static clays at the moment. Will be on slow incomers soon.

Keeps him from being bored whilst we shoot. He's good on the buttons too lol.