unico1 Posted August 22, 2019 Report Share Posted August 22, 2019 Any one got any good tips or advice on the above, it’s typically used when instructing clients and used to see where barrel clay relationship is. Typically used when teaching the method of shooting. I’m getting my head around it but wondering if any tips to give me a ureka moment. I think the biggest thing to adapt is to match the clients head/gun movement with your eye movement, if that makes sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 I think you need to expand on that a little, we're all confused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTaylor91 Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 (edited) I know a very small amount about parallax error from doing my pilots license but I’m not sure it exists in clay shooting, well not to any noticeable degree. Edited August 23, 2019 by JTaylor91 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno22rf Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 Isn't parallax the difference seen when viewing the same object but along 2 different lines of sight - not sure what 2 lines of sight are involved in clay shooting as your, single, master eye surely negates such phenomena? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuke Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 25 minutes ago, JTaylor91 said: I know a very small amount about parallax error from doing my pilots license but I’m not sure it exists in clay shooting, well not to any noticeable degree. You will have to use the shotgun like a rifle and have a scope mounted for there to be a parallax error. However, without high magnification, 16-, and small targets at long distances it will have no real practical impact. For a shotgun on clays I really can't see it. /M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cardigun Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 I think the OP is saying; When he looks over a clients shoulder, he sees the barrels about a foot or so to the left of the clay, when the client is pointing at it. Most Coaches get used to this, and build it in to their mind-set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 There is definitely parallax when viewing someone from behind and your eye is not sighted along the rib. As cardigun says you get used to it, you learn to work out the relationship between the barrels and the clay when standing behind someone. I know from doing 'have a go' type sessions on a busy day when supervising loads of shooters that afterwards i can shoot much better from the hip than i can normally as i have acclimatised to the different viewpoint For those that have not tried, if you can try safely then it is amazing the difference in perceived lead between shooting from the hip or mounted. It looks way less from the hip. Same with line, from the hip it feels as though you are miles underneath in comparison to the shoulder. The only time i can think of parallax being an issue with the shotgun mounted is on a fast going away target beneath your feet, especially if it is a good way below your feet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 Many years ago I was watching a young lad miss a simple crosser so stepped forward and had a quiet word and he immediately started to hit them, his father whom I already knew came forward and tried to push a handful of cartridges into my hand as a thank you (which I of course wouldn't take) but he asked me how I knew he was in front. Body language was my reply and I hadn't told him he was in front anyway but merely told him to alter his hold point and why. Any coach worth his salt would know simply by the posture and barrel address alone where the shooter is going wrong, to physically see the barrel being pointed behind, low or forward is not always necessary. In short I have never even given parallax a thought in this context. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 8 minutes ago, Hamster said: Many years ago I was watching a young lad miss a simple crosser so stepped forward and had a quiet word and he immediately started to hit them, his father whom I already knew came forward and tried to push a handful of cartridges into my hand as a thank you (which I of course wouldn't take) but he asked me how I knew he was in front. Body language was my reply and I hadn't told him he was in front anyway but merely told him to alter his hold point and why. Any coach worth his salt would know simply by the posture and barrel address alone where the shooter is going wrong, to physically see the barrel being pointed behind, low or forward is not always necessary. In short I have never even given parallax a thought in this context. I don't think about it consciously either and I agree, there are a multitude of reasons why people will fail to hit a target and a huge amount of that is due to the initial setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unico1 Posted August 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 Thanks for the replies gents, yes it was to do with coaching and watching the barrel clay relationship. For instance if the cpsa method of shooting is trying to be taught. Pick up and lock on, move with, pull ahead and shoot. If that method is being used by the client than an equal distance (gap) will be seen whilst looking over the shoulder of the shooter then an increased distance (gap) will be seen indicating pull ahead. If swing through is being used then the starting gap will be small increasing to a big gap before the shot is taken. If maintained lead is being used then bigger than normal gap will be used before the shot is taken. currently doing my instructors course and was struggling with the concept of parallax to analyse the shot whilst looking over the shoulder but slowly coming to terms with it. Friend of mine is going to do some fault shooting for me to analyse. As others have said comes bit more natural the more you do/see. Hope I haven’t board you all😩 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 So, is this parallax thing responsible for shooting 'behind em' then ? That seems to be the advice given at most of the shoots that I attend. 🙄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old farrier Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 2 minutes ago, Westley said: So, is this parallax thing responsible for shooting 'behind em' then ? That seems to be the advice given at most of the shoots that I attend. 🙄 More than likely 😂 I’ve nothing against anyone telling me where I missed them (if I ask or having a lesson) but it’s preferable to be told why I have missed and how to correct it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unico1 Posted August 24, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2019 Absolutely we can stand behind someone and say you missed that behind give more lead or missed in front half your lead...that’s what you have to factor in when giving a lesson to someone three R’s. Result (hit or miss). Reason (why you missed). And remedy how to rectify. To analyse these shots when on the shoulder of someone that’s when to use the parallax, it’s interesting just takes getting use to. Also being shooters we are told to focus on the target when coaching you look at the end of the gun in relationship to the clay, that also takes bit of getting used to. Perseverance I’ll get there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
www.sparky Posted October 31, 2019 Report Share Posted October 31, 2019 (edited) I think I had the same problems with the parallax view, but I was told a tip to help me with getting used to the view. Get the client/ friend to mount there gun on A point eg fence post, then have a look. this should give you the gap between your sight line and the shooter sight line. hope this helps mark Edited October 31, 2019 by www.sparky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westward Posted November 1, 2019 Report Share Posted November 1, 2019 On 23/08/2019 at 10:58, Hamster said: Body language was my reply and I hadn't told him he was in front anyway but merely told him to alter his hold point and why. Any coach worth his salt would know simply by the posture and barrel address alone where the shooter is going wrong, to physically see the barrel being pointed behind, low or forward is not always necessary. Makes sense to me. I've only ever had 1 paid for session with an instructor and I don't think he mentioned lead at all. Come to that I don't think we discussed "methods" either. He is very much a body and gun management coach who also happens to be a good AA in sporting and a top class DTL shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unico1 Posted November 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2019 Since opening the topic up I went on to get my CPSA level 1 qualification. As time has gone on working with clients it has come much more visible to me now. When I started the course it was hard to keep focused on the end of the clients gun not the clay naturally being shooters, but now after keeping my eyes fixed to the end of there barrels with the clay in my prefferal vision it is much easier to see the parallax error (gap) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old farrier Posted November 1, 2019 Report Share Posted November 1, 2019 Congratulations on getting your qualifications 👍😊 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted November 3, 2019 Report Share Posted November 3, 2019 Must admit I’ve stood next to thousands of clients and never thought about parallax error etc. Also if your head is trying to look down the barrel to get a similar view as the firer your standing in the wrong place get away from the client so you can see the whole shot feet to barrel, lead isn’t the only reason they miss. A coach needs to be looking at footwork shoulder body hands head barrels and the shot string not just the muzzle positions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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