Licence under review

[udderlyoffroad]

Remember, the advice on here is worth exactly what you paid for it.

Contact your shooting organisation.

Incidentally, it's worth bearing in mind, when it comes to allegations of domestic violence, that the police will essentially pursue a policy of 'arrest the male first, ask questions later' whether or not he is an SGC/FAC holder.  This may or may not be official policy, but it's what seems to happen.

[GingerCat]

9 hours ago, southeastpete said:

Have you ever had serious false allegations levelled against you?

 

Yes. 

[Darjohall]

44 minutes ago, Gordon R said:

Perhaps they are in the same boat as members on here. Drip fed half a tale and expected to come up with a definitive answer.

Two instances of alleged domestic violence. You do not say if she is still in the same household. If she is, or you are still in the relationship, you can say goodbye to your licence.

Yes, we are still together. She’s under a psychiatrist so she saw him following  recent events and had medication tweaked which has vastly improved things. 
I must admit that unfortunately I am concerned that her mental health might prevent me from having guns but that’s such a shame. She doesn’t have anything to do with my guns and as we have children as well I’m so careful with the gun cabinet keys and only I have access to them. 
surely if that was their only concern then they could give me the opportunity to keep my guns at my parents house who live locally as an extra precaution. 

[Gordon R]

I am surprised that you think the Police have gone overboard. Alleged domestic violence, mental health issues - just why do you think they would return the guns?

 

[clangerman]

i have no problem with police removing firearms but every problem they are to lazy to disprove allegations just as fast even more annoying is the pathetic way they repeat false allegations to you non stop as if it will suddenly become true all this case required once the allegations were found to be false is a request to store the firearms elsewhere 

[Scully]

1 hour ago, Darjohall said:

Yes, we are still together. She’s under a psychiatrist so she saw him following  recent events and had medication tweaked which has vastly improved things. 
I must admit that unfortunately I am concerned that her mental health might prevent me from having guns but that’s such a shame. She doesn’t have anything to do with my guns and as we have children as well I’m so careful with the gun cabinet keys and only I have access to them. 
surely if that was their only concern then they could give me the opportunity to keep my guns at my parents house who live locally as an extra precaution. 

I genuinely feel for you and your predicament if everything is as you say, especially with kids, but to be honest it doesn’t matter where your guns were stored because you’d still have access to them. 

[Zetter]

Its really unfortunate but I know of a couple of instances now of people I know who have had certificates not renewed due to their domestic arrangements. The police are now very much taking into account not just the certificate holder but the records/ actions of people living at the property.

[Gordon R]

Quote

The police are now very much taking into account not just the certificate holder but the records/ actions of people living at the property.

And so they should. Whilst you are awake, you might well carry your safe keys with you, but when you are asleep, whoever is in the property could theoretically gain access.

[clangerman]

they could also cut your throat when asleep but the police don’t seize all your knives this is just a poor excuse for the police to reach their goal of banning private ownership 

[Scully]

4 minutes ago, clangerman said:

they could also cut your throat when asleep but the police don’t seize all your knives this is just a poor excuse for the police to reach their goal of banning private ownership 

I have to agree with you there, but the police don’t issue licenses for knives. If they did they would have emptied his kitchen drawers also....it’s a backside covering exercise. 
 

[stuartyboy]

51 minutes ago, Scully said:

I have to agree with you there, but the police don’t issue licenses for knives. If they did they would have emptied his kitchen drawers also....it’s a backside covering exercise. 
 

I agree with this. What folk have to realise is that police, on the whole, don't want the general public to own guns.

And the main reasons for that are simple. It costs the police money to administer licensing that has to come out of an already stretched budget and the reputation of the force and individual chief officers will be damaged if a license holder commits an unthinkable act with a legally held firearm. There is basically no benefit at all to the police in regards to licensing. That is why they will always look to revoke at the slightest opportunity. And that is why, as certificate holders, you always have to act within the law if you care about owning firearms. 

I hope the ops situation works out and personally,  I would concentrate on getting my wife better and worry about my guns another time. And if anyone is in a negative domestic situation,  consider putting your guns into storage and notifying the police so you do everything in your powers as reasonable as possible. 

[Darjohall]

On 11/11/2020 at 17:57, clangerman said:

having removed my firearms the WORST advice i ever had was from a certain shooting organisation made the situation a nightmare for mths on end two weeks doing it my way all returned 

Are you able to give me any advice regarding how you managed to get your guns returned?

over the weekend I received the formal letter saying my licence has been revoked. The reason was because of the police involvement due to domestic abuse claims and also I was diagnosed with anxiety earlier in the year which I forgot to notify the police about with everything going on but did tell them in custody so they have also revoked it because of undeclared mental health condition. 
 

im really peed off with it all - as far as I know the police did not speak to my partners mental health team to actually find out what her state of mind was like at the time and if they had done so I believe this may not have come to this. 
 

ive made some enquiries with specialist firearms solicitors - one wanting a £6k fixed fee and another wanting £250 for just an initial hour consultation. 

any pointers really appreciated  

 

[Darjohall]

Is anyone able to recommend a solicitors which won’t charge the earth? 
infortunately I’m not a member of BASC. 

[clangerman]

6 minutes ago, Darjohall said:

Are you able to give me any advice regarding how you managed to get your guns returned?

over the weekend I received the formal letter saying my licence has been revoked. The reason was because of the police involvement due to domestic abuse claims and also I was diagnosed with anxiety earlier in the year which I forgot to notify the police about with everything going on but did tell them in custody so they have also revoked it because of undeclared mental health condition. 
 

im really peed off with it all - as far as I know the police did not speak to my partners mental health team to actually find out what her state of mind was like at the time and if they had done so I believe this may not have come to this. 
 

ive made some enquiries with specialist firearms solicitors - one wanting a £6k fixed fee and another wanting £250 for just an initial hour consultation. 

any pointers really appreciated  

 

you would have to provide more details were you charged with a offence has your doctor voiced any concerns always remember you are dealing with the people who wish to stop ownership of firearms i would start with obtaining a copy of your custody record and a health report from your gp had mine removed more than once and got them back with a apology so long as your in the right don’t be afraid to stand up for your self always advice on here if needed 

[Darjohall]

15 minutes ago, clangerman said:

you would have to provide more details were you charged with a offence has your doctor voiced any concerns always remember you are dealing with the people who wish to stop ownership of firearms i would start with obtaining a copy of your custody record and a health report from your gp had mine removed more than once and got them back with a apology so long as your in the right don’t be afraid to stand up for your self always advice on here if needed 

No I have never been charged. I think the concern of the police is because this has happened three times this year but the fact is I was released as charged refused each time. During interview I did tell them about my partners mental state at the time yet they never seem to make adequate enquiries to ascertain what her state of mind is at the time from her mental health team. 
my doctor has never voiced any concern about me holding guns and I would be happy to get a medical report should it be needed. 

[Rewulf]

35 minutes ago, Darjohall said:

ive made some enquiries with specialist firearms solicitors - one wanting a £6k fixed fee and another wanting £250 for just an initial hour consultation. 

any pointers really appreciated  

Dont waste your money , and forget about about firearm ownership for a good few years is the best advice I can give you.

Non declaration of  pertinent mental health history.

Domestic abuse allegations (they dont have to be proved to be relevant) the fact that their are issues in the relationship causing frequent police call outs is enough.

Your partner , who still resides with you, her mental health issues.

Any one of those is plenty reason to remove your firearms from a potentially dangerous situation.
Firearms licencing weigh up risks when granting , renewing or continuing FACs.
Sorry , but in your case that risk is too high, and I dont think many people would disagree with that.

[London Best]

8 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Dont waste your money , and forget about about firearm ownership for a good few years is the best advice I can give you.

Non declaration of  pertinent mental health history.

Domestic abuse allegations (they dont have to be proved to be relevant) the fact that their are issues in the relationship causing frequent police call outs is enough.

Your partner , who still resides with you, her mental health issues.

Any one of those is plenty reason to remove your firearms from a potentially dangerous situation.
Firearms licencing weigh up risks when granting , renewing or continuing FACs.
Sorry , but in your case that risk is too high, and I dont think many people would disagree with that.

My thoughts exactly.

[Lloyd90]

On 11/11/2020 at 19:26, bruno22rf said:

What the police have, in fact, is removed guns from a totally law abiding man - they have no right to remove legally held weapons. If we do not stand united against such heavy handed tactics and use the actual law, and not the police version of it, we are all doomed. I would have thought that BASC, wether the OP is a member or not, would have jumped at such an opportunity to put the Police in their place - upholding, and not making up, the law.

Dream on, even with fully paid up members they were reluctant to spend any money on legal challenges. 

On 11/11/2020 at 18:33, bruno22rf said:

whilst on the phone make it clear that you need his full contact details so you can issue a Summons for theft.

Im sure the CC will be shaking in their boots. Making silly threats is sure to make you a priority to get your guns back eh? 🤷‍♂️👀

On 11/11/2020 at 17:02, Darjohall said:

I’m after some advice please. There was a recent incident with my partner which I won’t go into ... 

To be blunt: 

You say the Police reaction is overboard ... but then say you don’t want to go into what happened. 
 

I’m not sure anyone can give you any decent advice without knowing the full facts of the case. 
 

 

[Lloyd90]

On 11/11/2020 at 21:09, southeastpete said:

Well then perhaps when people lose guns due to a false allegation a false allegation against those who took the guns would make them appreciate the absurdity of it all.

What a very stupid thing to suggest. 
 

Are you going to make false allegations against a Police officer for giving you a speeding ticket? Or if one of them has a chat to you? 
 

Your lack of integrity and honesty makes your fitness to hold a SGC questionable if you honestly think such stupid things as that! 

On 12/11/2020 at 08:58, Darjohall said:

Well to give a bit more detail, this year has been pretty turbulent with my partner. She made similar claims of domestic violence some months ago saying I dragged her down the street which led then to my arrest but the properly is covered fully by CCTV so I was able to completely disprove the claims and they were dropped then too and charge was refused. Since then she was diagnosed with bipolar and is generally better now she’s on right medication but can still have the occasional blip which is what happened a few weeks ago where similar claims were made - apparently I threw her down the stairs which of course was totally untrue and she can be seen leaving the house calmly and on her own on my cctv system. 
I do get the police need to be sure I’m suitable to hold guns but it’s upsetting that they aren’t looking at all the facts. 

You should have left her after the first incidence. 
 

I get it that people can be unwell etc. but that kind of allegation could ruin your entire life, job/career, all sorts of back ground checks, issues with your kids let alone gun licences. 
 

If someone had bipolar they can’t help it but if they start making allegations like that then they’d have to work through it alone! 
 

 

[Lloyd90]

38 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Dont waste your money , and forget about about firearm ownership for a good few years is the best advice I can give you.

Non declaration of  pertinent mental health history.

Domestic abuse allegations (they dont have to be proved to be relevant) the fact that their are issues in the relationship causing frequent police call outs is enough.

Your partner , who still resides with you, her mental health issues.

Any one of those is plenty reason to remove your firearms from a potentially dangerous situation.
Firearms licencing weigh up risks when granting , renewing or continuing FACs.
Sorry , but in your case that risk is too high, and I dont think many people would disagree with that.

Bang on mate! 
 

Chaotic partner living in the house where guns are with a serious mental disorder who is making MULTIPLE allegations of domestic violence. 

Regular Police call outs. 

The OP who failed to declare a mental disorder on his application, despite it being beyond clear that they want you to declare absolutely everything. 
 

 

I think they might have given the OP the benefit of the doubt to begin with, but how many times can they be expected to be called out and do nothing? 
 

 

 

[Darjohall]

13 minutes ago, Lloyd90 said:

Bang on mate! 
 

Chaotic partner living in the house where guns are with a serious mental disorder who is making MULTIPLE allegations of domestic violence. 

Regular Police call outs. 

The OP who failed to declare a mental disorder on his application, despite it being beyond clear that they want you to declare absolutely everything. 
 

 

I think they might have given the OP the benefit of the doubt to begin with, but how many times can they be expected to be called out and do nothing? 
 

 

 

Although I’m well aware I should’ve informed licensing about my anxiety, I was only diagnosed three months ago and with everything going on I simply just didn’t think to inform then. It’s not like I lied when I applied for my licence all those years ago!

[Rewulf]

23 minutes ago, Darjohall said:

Although I’m well aware I should’ve informed licensing about my anxiety, I was only diagnosed three months ago and with everything going on I simply just didn’t think to inform then. It’s not like I lied when I applied for my licence all those years ago!

its usually down to your GP to notify firearms IF he feels there is a risk, but thats really besides the point.
Couple that with ongoing domestic issues, AND your mentally ill partner, and its a no brainer.

You are clinging on to the fact you have done nothing wrong, and that may be the case, but despite advice to the contrary on here, that doesnt prevent the police removing firearms from a licencee.
You could have an ongoing neighbour dispute, neither party may have been arrested or charged.
Your doctor may have concerns about your alcohol consumption.
You may have friends or family who are known or suspected criminals.
You may be on certain prescription drugs , or have a medical condition which may affect your judgement .
OR the person that you live with could have any of the above.

You see, YOU have done nothing wrong in the eyes of the law.
But any one of the above will see you firearm free quick time, or at least have some difficult choices to make.

Dont take this as a dig at yourself, its just the harsh realities of firearm ownership in this country.

[Lloyd90]

33 minutes ago, Darjohall said:

Although I’m well aware I should’ve informed licensing about my anxiety, I was only diagnosed three months ago and with everything going on I simply just didn’t think to inform then. It’s not like I lied when I applied for my licence all those years ago!

My apologies it sounded like it was left off the application. 
 

I feel for you mate it’s not a nice position to be in. 
 

I think you need to take some time to settle, have a long hard look at the situation and decide what things are going to look like moving forward. 
 

Your partnership etc potentially on the line, kids involved. It’s very messy. Get everything sorted and then talk to the Police about getting your guns back. 
 

Sorry to be harsh but I don’t think your going to get them back whilst your in that domestic setup myself. 

[Scully]

If your anxiety problems are a symptom of the stress of your relationship then I’m surprised your GP hasn’t stated as much, as I can’t say I’m surprised you have anxiety issues, but anxiety issues aren’t of them self enough to bar you from holding firearms. I know this through experience, and I can’t criticise you for not stating them ( as I didn’t either  for donkies years, on the advice of my shooting organisation ) but perhaps you need to think long and hard about the relationship you have with your wife prior to anything else. 
If things are as bad as you state, then perhaps it’s time to get out, which will cause even more stress, especially with children involved; but if I were you I’d forget about shooting until your domestic situation is sorted.
We only have one life, and yours isn’t a situation in which to spend it. For the sake of your kids and yourself, get it sorted. 

[clangerman]

this chap is in for a long hard fight the last thing he needs is advice from those who have NOT been in his shoes