Mungler Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 The overdose and sedation theory is a new one on me though and would have rather long odds at the bookies. That theory has been doing the rounds for quite some time. I'd be happy to put money on it being the most likely truth. She killed her by accident and Gerry orchestrated the cover up, that's been top of my list of theories since week 1. Dunno, a pair of doctors accidentally over dosing their kid? Unlikely. Moreover that's the easiest one to cover up - "we didn't put the lid properly on the bottle and she helped herself to the lot officer". Accidental death, case closed. Anything else would have left a forensic trail in the apartment. Since we are speculating, I would speculate that had they had a hand in it they wouldn't want to keep a high profile - wouldn't it be more realistic to keep a low profile and get back to blighty asap? Having seen their gaff and given that he is a consultant cardiologist and she a GP I don't think they were conducting a global media campaign for the air miles or the wonga. As I have said, I am neither for or against, I am merely keeping an opening mind. I hope none of you lot get jury service any time soon :unsure: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancs Lad Posted September 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 I mean, its not as if doctors and nurses dont kill anyone is it... Beverly Allit. Harold Shipman. And a few more others. The media circus has been interesting to say the least, all of the high and mighties queing up for a bit of PR. Wonder how it will look upon them "SHOULD" it turn out that MR and MRs MC have had a part to play. End of the day, the two other kids should be taken from them. If this would have been a "council house chavette" then MR and MRS Social worker would be right on the door step taking away Chantelle and Brogan quicker than you can say Kappa Tracky. Its pure neglect. No ifs buts or what ever.... 1- No ransom demand. It isnt kidnap. 2- I think the Paedo Ring is a "long shot". They would have had their fun and dumped her either alive or dead. 3 - No body.........Now, I dont know if/how it would be possible for them to dump the body after the effect and the alarm has been raised. Too much media spot light. 4 - Given all of the media interest, I doubt if someone has little maddy tucked up in a farm house. 5 - Like others have said..............I would be in friggin bits if my daughter went missing...Mrs Mc seems all too settled to me. 6 - Blood results, assume that if she has been slipped a mickey then it would show in the blood samples found - it they were from some time after it was given...Could it be an arterial splash after IV drugs have been given and then cleaned up. 7 - If it was abduction....then why take a noisy toddler....why not take the little uns..... 8 - The media has been put into over drive..............or over spin..........nothing like playing to the circus to throw off the scent. Ask the fiend who killed Holly and Jessica.... 9 - The Brit and the Russian...............Nothing has been said (in the media) about them for some time.......taking computers and all that holds some suspicion but if there was anything on them, then I assume that Portugal has Paedo laws on such stuff and they would have been charged. 10 - Its all too fishy.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 I'm sympathetic to the theory that the country dont want tourists to feel there is a paedophile problem to worry about. Politics has no consience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 No one ever said Doctors don't kill people. Are you saying that because they are Doctors they are more likely to? The point I was making was that Doctors would be less likely to "overdose" anyone accidentally and if they were to deliberately (or even accidentally) overdose someone it would be the easiest thing to cover up (see above). As for taking their other kids into care, interesting. Do you think that would be best for the two other children working to the basis that there is no evidence so far to suggest that the McCanns were directly involved in the disappearance - everything mentioned on this thread has been massive speculation and conjecture. There is no evidence. Not unnamed sources, un corroborated leaks from the press but good old fashioned hard evidence. Does this not worry anyone? What about Robert Murat? Is he off the hook then? I recall unnamed sources previously linking him, his computer, his van, a bed / matress in the van and a mobile phone. Where's all that now? What you are basically down to is no one likes the McCanns. It would be much easier if everyone just said "I don't care about the lack of evidence, I don't like them". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherman Mike Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 We are all speculating and none of us have any idea of the facts. We are all critical of the McCanns leaving their kids unattended for short space of time but weve all done it and nipped round the neighbours for a couple of drinks. We all now seem to dislike the McCanns but do any of us know them personally ? I have given my kids a good dose of Medised, which contains a anti histamine, in order to get a good nights kip. When I was a bab it was gripe water containing Alcohol. In my opinion, for what its worth, the McCanns are I believe, innocent of any involvement in Madelines dissapearance. I believe the poor girl was targeted for the lucrative child trade of the Middle East or Africa, and I like to think she is alive and well cared for. I also believe that the Portugese Authorities did not take her dissapearance seriously until her abductor had potentially covered some 1500 miles. I believe the Authorities in Portugal to be less than efficient, extremely naive and certainly not up to an investigation of this magnitude. The suspicion falling on the parents being purely a smoke screen to divert the Public from their total ineptitude. I would like to see the British Authorities take over the investigation as they should have from a much earlier stage. I think that somebody known to the McCanns in England is behind the dissapearance, perhaps a aggrieved patient with a grudge against their GP? We are all starting to Judge Mrs McCann after taking into account little or no evidence of any consequence offerred by the Portugese Authorities. If they had anything concrete sufficient to support a charge I am sure they would have be detained before now. If the McCanns are as I believe innocent of any involvement, who amonggst us who are parents, can even begin to imagine the sickening turmoil and emotional torment they are enduring at this moment. I hope and pray that the little girl is still alive and will be found and if the parents are in any way involved may they be damned for eternity. FM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markbivvy Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 but weve all done it and nipped round the neighbours for a couple of drinks. not me, and i have 3 grown up kids. and four grand kids, and if any of mine left my grand children unattended they would sharp know how i feel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadkill Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 but weve all done it and nipped round the neighbours for a couple of drinks. not me, and i have 3 grown up kids. and four grand kids, and if any of mine left my grand children unattended they would sharp know how i feel. i dont think it was them as they would never be able to move a body 25 days after she went missing ....... also when we were kids we went to south of france and my parents went to the next town which was about 20 mins away and all we had was a camp site nanny that would ride round on her bike every hour i was 7 my brother was 4 how time has changed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sniper Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 My suspicions have never changed from day one. The parents are still prime suspects to me. They are home now and want some privacy. Hard luck, as they actively cultivated the media for attention. On the subject of media I think the idea of interviewing " distraught " parents etc. should be banned as it is counter productive to an unbiased investigation and is always referred to in any subsequent trials. Some people just do not come across very well on TV and, after any subequent interviews are aired on national TV, it is easy for the public to make the wrong assumptions. Plus how many times in recent years have we seen the interviewee be proved to be perpatrator ( Huntley ??) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john faul Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 i heard the blood in the car was a match to madelines dna ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadkill Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 i heard the blood in the car was a match to madelines dna ?? but the media stated that they didnt hire the car till 25 days after mad went missing ... how the hell would they have moved a body with the police / press about watching there every move unless its was clothes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyjaimz Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 As has already been said, they should never have left the kids alone If it was a genuine kidnap then they have effectively put the poor little ****** in the ground themselves by generating so much publicity and hype around the situation IMO. I dont have much faith in our judicial system, but I have less faith in those of some other countries with more bent coppers than good. I was on holiday in greece only a few weeks ago in an apartment complex and there was a british family of 4 staying in the apartment next door to us. The parents were both teachers with a little girl who was the spitting image of poor madelaine and a younger little boy. They would frequently leave both kids in the apartment with the front patio door wide open while they were either in the pool or having food/drinks - some people just dont seem to learn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chard Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 but weve all done it and nipped round the neighbours for a couple of drinks. not me, and i have 3 grown up kids. and four grand kids, and if any of mine left my grand children unattended they would sharp know how i feel. Nor me either. I once left my lad for about 2 minutes while I drove round to the post box to post an urgent letter. He mentioned it to my misses when she came home and she ripped into me like never before. B) :yp: It's one of the sacrifices you make when you decide on a family. My misses and I both go out, but we go out separately, or on the odd occasion where we get to go out together, we get a baby-sitter. Not too difficult really If we wanted a wild social life on the lash, we wouldn't have had kids, the two don't go together - end of story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 So then, the BBC today says: Portuguese police have played down claims that Madeleine McCann's blood was found in her parents' hire car. ((coughs)) so then, there is no direct evidence at all against the McCanns. Back to leaving their kids to nip out for dinner down the road - what if that was the "one" mistake they ever made. They will be paying for it forever. My point being what would be achieved by sending them to prison? I still think we are right back round to no one likes the McCanns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkield Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 I heard that, and reading through the replies so far most people opinions are only based on what they feel, not what they know. My feelings are: I don't think they actually killed their daughter. I do think they may be hiding something. I am not sure how I would react to this situation, but they seemed to have remained remarkably cool throughout. Just because they seem a bit wierd, it doesn't make them murderers. I don't know either of them, so I can't realy dislike them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starlight32 Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 So then, the BBC today says: Portuguese police have played down claims that Madeleine McCann's blood was found in her parents' hire car. ((coughs)) so then, there is no direct evidence at all against the McCanns. Back to leaving their kids to nip out for dinner down the road - what if that was the "one" mistake they ever made. They will be paying for it forever. My point being what would be achieved by sending them to prison? I still think we are right back round to no one likes the McCanns. You got that right Mung, From what I hear from everyone around me when the subject arises is that no no-one likes the Mc canns and never have since the whole tragic incident started. The point is that no-one has yet to publicly tell them so. But I would suspect that under the surface they have felt the wrath of negative feedback from the general public but are not going to admit so. They are surrounded by a ring of steel supporters who are from the same 'establishment' ilk. Time will tell....................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul65 Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 The idea that one of the McCanns accidentally killed their daughter and then the other agreed to cover it up seems extremely far fetched to me. I really can't imagine my wife telling me that she had accidentally killed our three year old and me saying, 'Not to worry, let's stash him for a while till we get a chance to stick him in a shallow grave somewhere. If we're quick, we can still make dinner and the quiz.' The time frame for this was about an hour, I believe Maddie was seen alive by non family at around 7 and her parents went out at 8 or so. That's not much time to kill your child, deal with immediate horror of it, get your partner onside, come up with a plan, stash a corpse, get washed and dress and go down to dinner with a smile on your face. Unless of course it was no accident and it was all planned and prepared with Hollywood style meticulous attention to detail. We have no knowledge at all of what evidence exists in this case, all we have are rumours put out by the police or the McCann supporters. I read all this rubbish today about Kate McCann being an aggressive and violent mother because neighbours at the apartment had heard her losing her rag and Maddie crying for her daddy. Well, this morning my little boy wouldn't let me get him washed before I went to work and I shouted at him in exasperation. He started wailing for his mum. I very much doubt my neighbours assumed I was going to do away with him. The police say Kate McCann was unco-operative and had aggressive outbursts. Well I don't blame her, I think I'd be like that if I was being browbeaten into a confession. People don't like the McCanns because they are impassive (it's their job to be so), they are wicked parents for leaving their children alone (it happens ALL the time. I've seen loving parents do it at family events in hotels, though probably never again) because of tales that the police and media have made up (who says the kids were sedated?) or maybe for class reasons. Those who introduce Shipman et al as examples are talking nonsense. Shipman was a serial killer, Allitt was a mad spree killer and Huntley had a long record for sex and violence to children. Yes the stats say that mothers murder their babies or that parents abuse their children to death. I'm not aware of a case where two parents accidentally killed their child on holiday, hid the body, launched a worldwide campaign to find her and in the midst of it moved the corpse to it's final resting place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 Paul65 well put! Welcome to the site. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chard Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 Yes, very well put, Paul and welcome to PW However, the sad fact is, that your statements are no more based on fact than the McCanns accusers statements are. None of us know what went on, what was said before dinner, what the neighbours heard through the apartment wall, because we weren't there. On both sides, we can only go by the tripe that the papers write, and if it's inaccurate nonsense on one side of the fence, then suffice to say that it's equally inaccurate on the other side. The Portuguese Police do appear to be dealing with the case strangely (according to the papers) but they have got their teeth into something and I'm afraid I can't just dismiss it as the desperate clutchings of detectives out of their depth with the case. It might be, but I don't know that. The papers hint that it might be, but having already dismissed what the papers say, we can't start conveniently picking bits of their stories out that seem to support our personal views. The fact is that none of us know, because we haven't been given the facts, only a load of media speculation. I personally would choose not to compare your morning argument with your lad with anything the McCanns may or may not have done. You seem a pretty balanced bloke. My view of the McCanns is still that they're weird (Team McCann, world tour, audience with the Pope, etc etc etc) and I'm afraid that, rightly or wrongly, I base my suspicions (sp) on that, until somebody shows me how wrong I am Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 Like chard I'm pretty unsure of just what the police are grabbing at but the facts are that something has been produced DNA wise that has caused a pretty spectacular re-think on their part. On the basis of British test results they went from saying they were innocent to pulling tham as proper suspects spending a long time questioning them to pushing for a plea bargain on accidental death. Ok it could be a last ditch attempt to make them confess but it seems to me they must have some evidence we know nothing about that has caused this. I don't think there could have been proper murder involved but some tragic accident is entirely possible in my eyes. Personally I'd not be surprised if the prosecutor charges them in the near future as it seems as though the evidence has been presented and that would only happen when they thought there was a case to answer. I'm also a little surprised how fast they skipped the country after being made suspects only time will tell but I have a feeling we'll know more fact pretty soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr W Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 Evening standard now saying a clump of hair was found in the boot. This could have come from her clothing, hat etc I suppose but what is for sure is that this is a strange case and I guess it will all come out in the wash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 My money is on: 1. nothing will out 2. case closed in 2 months 3. big whiff left hanging over the McCanns, Joanne Lees stylee. There is no evidence at all against the McCanns at this stage. You cannot say "there is no evidence to say they didn't do it", well there is evidence to say they didn't do it - its called "no evidence to say they did do it". Proving a negative is almost impossible. Innocent until proven guilty. If the world wishes to find them guilty on the basis of the Portuguese police making them official suspects then I ask again what about Robert Murat? The police pulled him in - is that another "there's no smoke without fire" wild bit of speculation. Indeed, if Robert Murat is completely and utterly innocent then his life is still f'ed right up - I hope he wasn't planning a career in teaching or childcare. Now, imagine that the Portuguese police have got it wrong. In fact, got it wrong again. Well it's too late isn't it - suspicion has already been cast and lives ruined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorfolkBoy Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 Hmmm...Innocent until proven guilty. Well I think we can all agree that their negligence has been proven, but will they even be called to account for that ? Paul65 makes a good point when he says that the McCanns are impassive as a result of their professional backgrounds, you could also argue that people just cope with extreme stress in different ways, though that may appear bizarre to others. I just feel very sorry for the children involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancs Lad Posted September 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 Paul65 - Mr Shipman was a fully respected doctor........... who would have thought that he was slipping granny a good dose of the old knock out drops. Bev Allit....ok she had a bit of a "Munchausens sydrome by proxy". What I was getting at was that people in the medical proffession have been shown as killers. Mung............ Your very perceptive............... I dont have a I hate the Mccans view on life...... Infact... No I do.......... Its not because they are Gps....... earn shed loads.......... or Im jealous.......... the long and short is........... THEY LEFT THEIR KIDS...... If some people find that its acceptable to leave your kids whilst you go out on the lash, for a meal, pop next door etc then Im sorry but you really need to take a look at your parenting skills. And this isnt me being an over protective parent..................We have never left our daughter alone, even for 2 mins.......... Yeh times have changed,,,,but belive me,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,there probably aint any more Nonces around now than there were 20 years ago...............we just seem to report it more. Your kids are precious...........they are special............they are wonderful little things..................yes they can be a pain in the ****..............but christ...........just try loosing one....................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palombier Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 I'm with FM and Chard on this one and I liken the Portugese police's enquiry to the Jamaican Police's investigation of Bob Woolmer's murder(strangulation,poisoning)/manslaughter/death by natural causes etc. For all you conspiracy theorists/cynics that believe that she died at the hands of her parents,look at the timescales involved, what caused her death in that short period?, the motivation for wanting to bury your first born daughter in an unmarked grave in a foreign country and then live the lie that she was abducted for the rest of your life and by doing so try and con the world. I personally do not think that is plausible nor do I think that they would be able to keep up such a charade for so long. If I'm wrong then i would be truly shocked P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancs Lad Posted September 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 I'm with FM and Chard on this one and I liken the Portugese police's enquiry to the Jamaican Police's investigation of Bob Woolmer's murder(strangulation,poisoning)/manslaughter/death by natural causes etc. For all you conspiracy theorists/cynics that believe that she died at the hands of her parents,look at the timescales involved, what caused her death in that short period?, the motivation for wanting to bury your first born daughter in an unmarked grave in a foreign country and then live the lie that she was abducted for the rest of your life and by doing so try and con the world. I personally do not think that is plausible nor do I think that they would be able to keep up such a charade for so long. If I'm wrong then i would be truly shocked P Any type of knock out drops buddy....................as for disposal............Im still stuck on that one................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.