udderlyoffroad Posted September 3, 2021 Report Share Posted September 3, 2021 4 hours ago, 12gauge82 said: Rewulf is correct that following solely the msm is not going to give you a balanced view. Imagine if the current dumpster fire that is the Afghanistan withdrawal had happened under Trump*. Do we honestly, for a second, believe the media would've reacted in the same way they have? No, we would have had day after day of incredulous reaction and tedious micro-analysis of every malformed tweet. Frankly, imagine if *Anything* Biden has done or said so far had been done by Trump. Imagine if Trump had checked his watch or fallen asleep meeting foreign leaders...It would be wall-to-wall for days on UK media. But Biden somehow gets a pass. So no, the MSM has an obvious bias. Whether that translates to an actual agenda is debatable, or simply just people living in a media bubble. *Yes I know, he set events in motion there. Biden had 6months to change the direction of travel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted September 3, 2021 Report Share Posted September 3, 2021 3 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said: *Yes I know, he set events in motion there. Biden had 6months to change the direction of travel. What he wanted was to extract American forces from their occupation there, keep US and western business interests, and let the ANA do the job its paid and equipped to do. Having a foreign army on your soil is never popular, and particularly in a tribal culture like Afghan. Biden and his government implemented a rushed pull out that beggars belief in its ineptness ! At first I thought it was some kind of tactical move to draw the taliban out and deliver a mortal blow, but no, it was strategic cluster .... that makes me wonder how it got past the defence staff ? The only conclusion I can come to , is that they are going to use this as Bidens exit move, hence the very silent Kamala. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted September 3, 2021 Report Share Posted September 3, 2021 (edited) 20 hours ago, ordnance said: You think, a payment for what ? One of the relevant articles i read but don't know the truth of: https://www.hsj.co.uk/workforce/exclusive-very-low-uptake-of-covid-death-payments-by-families-of-health-and-care-staff/7028744.article And another: https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jul/26/only-19-bereaved-families-approved-for-nhs-staff-coronavirus-compensation-scheme Edited September 3, 2021 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted September 3, 2021 Report Share Posted September 3, 2021 Quote I asked you previously if you believe everything the MSM tells you, personally I dont think they lie or mislead ALL the time, but they have been proven time and time again. You seem obsessed with MSM, there are other media outlets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saltings Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 sometimes the most intelligent seem the most stupid when the least intelligent do the right thing its called common sense if it hurts dont do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 39 minutes ago, Saltings said: sometimes the most intelligent seem the most stupid when the least intelligent do the right thing its called common sense if it hurts dont do it Yeah that's a load of nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saltings Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 9 minutes ago, chrisjpainter said: Yeah that's a load of nonsense. self prevacation i want to live eat anything to stay alive heat fire fire is life and a tv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saltings Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 19 minutes ago, chrisjpainter said: Yeah that's a load of nonsense. your wright youve never been hungry for days when muscles and oysters and kelp was the only food available Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saltings Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 1 hour ago, chrisjpainter said: Yeah that's a load of nonsense. go figure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 12 hours ago, ordnance said: You seem obsessed with MSM, there are other media outlets. Main. Stream. Media. Yes there are other media outlets, but you would call them conspiracy theorists. Try GB news. 6 hours ago, Saltings said: your wright youve never been hungry for days when muscles and oysters and kelp was the only food available Have you seen the price of mussels and oysters!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 8 hours ago, Saltings said: your wright youve never been hungry for days when muscles and oysters and kelp was the only food available 2 hours ago, Rewulf said: Have you seen the price of mussels and oysters!! To say nothing of the price of muscles! gym memberships, protein shakes, steroids... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mice! Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 23 hours ago, Rewulf said: Biden and his government implemented a rushed pull out that beggars belief in its ineptness ! At first I thought it was some kind of tactical move to draw the taliban out and deliver a mortal blow, but no, it was strategic cluster .... that makes me wonder how it got past the defence staff ? I'm still expecting who ever takes over from Biden to be able to charge back in saving the day, but its going to cost American lives doing it, so I can't see how its going to pan out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 4 minutes ago, Mice! said: I'm still expecting who ever takes over from Biden to be able to charge back in saving the day, but its going to cost American lives doing it, so I can't see how its going to pan out. I'm thinking the Taliban successfully tricked the US, aided and abetted by the so called afghan government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 7 hours ago, Dave-G said: I'm thinking the Taliban successfully tricked the US, aided and abetted by the so called afghan government. I'm thinking there was no need, biden is so inept they sat there and let Biden hand it to them on a plate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 13 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said: I'm thinking there was no need, biden is so inept they sat there and let Biden hand it to them on a plate. They must have thought all their christmases had come at once. 'We'll withdraw, but you'll have to promise not to be naughty'. 'Yes...we promise' (thought bubble 'yeahhh....or what?) It turns out there is no 'or what.' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 2 hours ago, chrisjpainter said: They must have thought all their christmases had come at once. 'We'll withdraw, but you'll have to promise not to be naughty'. 'Yes...we promise' (thought bubble 'yeahhh....or what?) It turns out there is no 'or what.' Most seem to forgetting it was Trumps surrender deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 1 hour ago, ordnance said: Most seem to forgetting it was Trumps surrender deal. Mmmhmm, although withdrawal had begun even before Trump, but yeah he massively expedited things. Of all the Trump era things not to go back on, Biden picks this? How did The Who put it? 'Meet the new boss...' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 9 hours ago, ordnance said: Most seem to forgetting it was Trumps surrender deal. So you'd have stayed in Afghanistan for ever? Leaving wasn't the issue, the disaterous way in which it was done was. I really can't understand how you seem unable to grasp that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 I'm no Biden fan but he seems to be getting blamed for what looks like a deal with the Afghan army to support Afghanistan - with a massive load of gear left for them, being reneged on like a hot potato. Sucker punched politics at its best or worst depending on which side its viewed from is my thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Dave-G said: I'm no Biden fan but he seems to be getting blamed for what looks like a deal with the Afghan army to support Afghanistan - with a massive load of gear left for them, being reneged on like a hot potato. Sucker punched politics at its best or worst depending on which side its viewed from is my thinking. I take your point, but...he could have looked to change the policy. The CIA had given him a briefing that they'd projected the government to fail within 18 months of the USA pulling out months before the deadline. The speed of the fall might have surprised them, but the fact that it happened shouldn't have done. He'd been made aware that withdrawal meant a Taliban return at some point. Biden's gone out of his way to be seen as washing away Trump era politics, but has chosen not to with Afghanistan. You can't be blamed for someone else's mistakes. But you can be blamed if you knew the consequences and did nothing to try and prevent them. Edited September 5, 2021 by chrisjpainter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
udderlyoffroad Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 2 hours ago, chrisjpainter said: You can't be blamed for someone else's mistakes. But you can be blamed if you knew the consequences and did nothing to try and prevent them. Indeed, this dumpster fire happened under Biden, and Biden alone. The Secretary of Defense has a lot to answer for here, his generals must have been telling him this would be a disaster. For all his faults, Trump was a delegator, and would've likely listened to the DoD, or at the very least told them to withdraw as they saw fit. We'll never know of course, but all those people going 'muuuh Trump did this' clearly haven't noticed all the other parts of Trump policy rescinded, stopped or otherwise overturned by Biden through executive order. Anyone who think still thinks 'thank god the orange man has gone' clearly hasn't been paying attention. From a UK perspective, certainly not. I'd almost rather back-of-the-queue-Obama was at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. And he hated the UK too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mice! Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 2 hours ago, chrisjpainter said: take your point, but...he could have looked to change the policy. The CIA had given him a briefing that they'd projected the government to fail within 18 months of the USA pulling out months before the deadline. The speed of the fall might have surprised them, but the fact that it happened shouldn't have done. He'd been made aware that withdrawal meant a Taliban return at some point. More like 18 minutes, imagine telling them when you were leaving unless it was a clever ruse. Entirely Bidens fault no matter whose idea it was, it still baffles me, all the time spent there thrown away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 8 hours ago, 12gauge82 said: So you'd have stayed in Afghanistan for ever? Leaving wasn't the issue, the disaterous way in which it was done was. I really can't understand how you seem unable to grasp that. I don't think i said NATO troops should have stayed there for ever the one sided surrender was the disaster, and that was on Trumps watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 58 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said: We'll never know of course, but all those people going 'muuuh Trump did this' clearly haven't noticed all the other parts of Trump policy rescinded, stopped or otherwise overturned by Biden through executive order Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 Quote Quote For all his faults, Trump was a delegator, and would've likely listened to the DoD, or at the very least told them to withdraw as they saw fit. Trump aggreged to a withdraw deadline, not leave as you see fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.