Apple and Data Security

[JohnfromUK]

Apple has up to today offered users of its iCloud data storage the option (as an option which has to be selected if wanted by the user) to apply Advanced Data Protection (ADP) which fully encrypts the data such that no one can access it without the user's password (not even Apple as there is no 'back door' in the system).  My guess is that in fact few people use it (I didn't).

The UK Gov't has demanded that the Gov't must have access to the data stored there by a 'back door' or some other means and Apple must provide this - or not offer it.

In response Apple has refused to build in a back door (they claim because it would eventually be compromised and used by hackers) and has withdrawn the ADP option for users in the UK.  The rest of the world can continue to protect their data with ADP.

iCloud users can in future only use the standard storage encryption which (presumably since they agree to it) can be accessed by 'the Authorities' such as HMG and presumably other parties.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Edited Friday at 17:28 by JohnfromUK

[johnphilip]

27 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

Apple has up to today offered users of its iCloud data storage the option (as an option which has to be selected if wanted by the user) to apply Advanced Data Protection (ADP) which fully encrypts the data such that no one can access it without the user's password (not even Apple as there is no 'back door' in the system).  My guess is that in fact few people use it (I didn't).

The UK Gov't has demanded that the Gov't must have access to the data stored there by a 'back door' or some other means and Apple must provide this - or not offer it.

In response Apple has refused to build in a back door (they claim because it would eventually be compromised and used by hackers) and has withdrawn the ADP option for users in the UK.  The rest of the world can continue to protect their data with ADP.

iCloud users can in future only use the standard storage encryption which (presumably since they agree to it) can be accessed by 'the Authorities' such as HMG and presumably other parties.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Disgusting  big brother watch all your  private  stuff. Saw this on YouTube last week . Would they allow  use to view there stuff , they are working on becoming a Commie state day by day 

 

[old man]

It's certainly of great concern?

I have nothing to hide but somehow it doesn't sit right.

Very glad I'm old, what a cess pit this country is fast becoming.

[mel b3]

15 hours ago, johnphilip said:

Disgusting  big brother watch all your  private  stuff. Saw this on YouTube last week . Would they allow  use to view there stuff , they are working on becoming a Commie state day by day 

 

This.

Loads of people will say don't be ridiculous,  we're nothing like Russia or China,  but , we're slowly getting there an inch at a time.

[johnphilip]

2 minutes ago, mel b3 said:

This.

Loads of people will say don't be ridiculous,  we're nothing like Russia or China,  but , we're slowly getting there an inch at a time.

Exactly  what the Heck is. " none hate crime. "  they introduced  it into. Scotland. The other. Year. The then leader of the  SNP  so famous for. His. : white. White. White. Speech.  I belive. In the first. Few. Days of it being introduced  there was something. Like 40, 000  complains. Reported. To the police. How. Do you work through  all them while trying. To police a country. Of lots. Of other. Crimes.  So sad the way this country. Is going. Is it all by design . It sure caused  the SNP to loose loads of seats. , maybe a lesson  for the. UK government  .

[Newbie to this]

4 minutes ago, johnphilip said:

Exactly  what the Heck is. " none hate crime. "  they introduced  it into. Scotland. The other. Year. The then leader of the  SNP  so famous for. His. : white. White. White. Speech.  I belive. In the first. Few. Days of it being introduced  there was something. Like 40, 000  complains. Reported. To the police. How. Do you work through  all them while trying. To police a country. Of lots. Of other. Crimes.  So sad the way this country. Is going. Is it all by design . It sure caused  the SNP to loose loads of seats. , maybe a lesson  for the. UK government  .

I thought it was a 'non crime hate incident'.

So no crime committed. Just an attack on freedom of speech.

[old'un]

Think the powers that be have been watching us for a long time, so nothing new.

I have mixed feeling about it as its possible those that wish us harm can hide their intentions.

 

[johnphilip]

2 minutes ago, Newbie to this said:

I thought it was a 'non crime hate incident'.

So no crime committed. Just an attack on freedom of speech.

Yes your correct got the words around. The wrong. Way , I suppose. It's. The total  stupidly of al, of its.  " sticks and stones " 

[JohnfromUK]

2 minutes ago, old'un said:

Think the powers that be have been watching us for a long time, so nothing new.

I have mixed feeling about it as its possible those that wish us harm can hide their intentions.

 

The issue (as I understand it) is that the Apple ADP storage (that has now been denied to the UK) could not be watched (or possibly that watching it was far too heavy on resources). 

I agree that there are many legitimate cases where I think being able to watch would be desirable (just some examples being terrorism prevention, organised crime prevention, computer fraud prevention, child exploitation (and similar) protection), so I am also in 'two minds'.

 

[mel b3]

3 minutes ago, johnphilip said:

Exactly  what the Heck is. " none hate crime. "  they introduced  it into. Scotland. The other. Year. The then leader of the  SNP  so famous for. His. : white. White. White. Speech.  I belive. In the first. Few. Days of it being introduced  there was something. Like 40, 000  complains. Reported. To the police. How. Do you work through  all them while trying. To police a country. Of lots. Of other. Crimes.  So sad the way this country. Is going. Is it all by design . It sure caused  the SNP to loose loads of seats. , maybe a lesson  for the. UK government  .

The answer to that one is easy . The police ignore real crime , and focus on hurty words on Facebook instead . It appears to be the modern way of things unfortunately 😕. 

Example.

Homeowner 

"Good morning officer , I've been burgled , they've smashed my door open , stolen my gold jewellery,  stolen my life's savings ,taken the keys to my new car ,  ransacked my home , and taken a dump in my fridge".

Call handler.

"Here's your crime number madam.  I'm sorry that no officers can attend , but they're all on a police raid , as someone made a yo momma is fat joke on Facebook,  and hurt the feelings of someone that has a fat momma".

I'm not blaming the police officers , they're just doing as they're told.

[Miserableolgit]

There was a piece on Radio 4 about this yesterday and there was a child protection spokesperson from some organisation or other who stated that if access to personal data on the platform by the authorities saves just one Childs life then it is worth it.

Two minds..

[Newbie to this]

13 minutes ago, Miserableolgit said:

There was a piece on Radio 4 about this yesterday and there was a child protection spokesperson from some organisation or other who stated that if access to personal data on the platform by the authorities saves just one Childs life then it is worth it.

Two minds..

Now apply that to private ownership of firearms.............

[amateur]

It's probably just me, but I read the topic title as "Apple and Date security" and was expecting a topic relating stories of desperate gang raids on greengrocers.

[old man]

1 minute ago, Newbie to this said:

Now apply that to private ownership of firearms.............

They possibly have that info already?

Just think on though about the income stream the dvla already  have by flogging your info out to whoever it can relating to car parking charges?

[Miserableolgit]

6 minutes ago, Newbie to this said:

Now apply that to private ownership of firearms.............

Indeed..

[JohnfromUK]

8 minutes ago, Newbie to this said:

Now apply that to private ownership of firearms.............

Not really the same.  There are plenty of data storage services available (including the 'standard' offering of Apples iCloud, Microsoft One Drive, Google etc.), but they are not totally secure against the Authorities being able to view.  Apples ADP (allegedly) made it proof against even the Authorities viewing.

For Firearms/Shotgun legal ownership we do not get any SGC/FAC without giving a lot of information about us and (in some cases) intended usage etc. and they can check or revoke and sieze if they need to (subject to the current laws).

Edited yesterday at 12:04 by JohnfromUK

[Newbie to this]

1 minute ago, old man said:

They possibly have that info already?

That's not what I meant.

Appy the "if it saves one life it is all worth while" argument to removing private ownership of firearms.

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, Newbie to this said:

Appy the "if it saves one life it is all worth while" argument to removing private ownership of firearms.

What ADP does is make the protected data totally unavailable for checking/inspection.  Without ADP you can still hold data in iCloud, but cannot lock it away such that it is unavailable for inspection.

With FAC and SCG they have various rights to know about your licensed firearms.

[Newbie to this]

17 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

What ADP does is make the protected data totally unavailable for checking/inspection.  Without ADP you can still hold data in iCloud, but cannot lock it away such that it is unavailable for inspection.

With FAC and SCG they have various rights to know about your licensed firearms.

I get that, my point is the argument of even if it only saves one life........then it's worth doing. Even if the law abiding are effected.

Well we can all agree that sadly legally held firearms are used to kill. Thankfully it is very rare.

Well.......if removing legally held firearms saves just 1 life, surely if you apply the same argument, then , it has to be worthwhile.........

Be careful what you wish for people.

Edited yesterday at 12:26 by Newbie to this

[clangerman]

remember how the gov claimed having cameras everywhere would keep us safe and it didn’t stop one rape or robbery now apply that here and you have the truth! 

[old'un]

10 minutes ago, clangerman said:

remember how the gov claimed having cameras everywhere would keep us safe and it didn’t stop one rape or robbery now apply that here and you have the truth! 

Possibly so but they have helped catch and convict a lot of criminals.

[johnphilip]

This video explains. It.  His. View 

 

[Scully]

This is probably something to do with the pending digitisation of accounts for the self employed. Whether it is for all businesses I have no idea, but I assume so.
 I received an email from my accountant yesterday making me aware of the digitisation of accounts in the forthcoming years dependant on your gross income. 

[clangerman]

2 hours ago, old'un said:

Possibly so but they have helped catch and convict a lot of criminals.

if there was coppers on the street instead of cameras there wouldn’t be a crime in the first place being stabbed on camera is no good when your dead! 

[old'un]

12 minutes ago, clangerman said:

if there was coppers on the street instead of cameras there wouldn’t be a crime in the first place being stabbed on camera is no good when your dead! 

True again but we just dont have the numbers to put a copper on every other street corner.

When we first moved into our present house we were only in it for a couple of weeks when a knock at the door was from our local beat bobby introducing himself, that was 30+ years ago