Red diesel / VOSA

[kdubya]

I've known people with low paid jobs working miles from home use red. I know it's wrong and so did they but the option was to work at a loss or be unemployed.

 

Bit like a low paid worker getting tax credits IE a benefit, yet he gets crucified for being a scrounger? pray tell me the difference.

 

KW

[Trevorevans]

 

 

:hmm: :hmm: :hmm: strange answer

Away from the OPs original question I know but am just following the theme the thread seems to have taken.

[Gordon R]

BRNDL - I think you have cornered the market on strange, but simplistic posts. :hmm:

[Trevorevans]

 

 

Think it's more of a plea for justification of using red. The "what if" scenario which we can all appreciate I think. What if XYZ...

No, not looking for justification I'm supplied with a vehicle for daily use by my employer and only use my own at weekends so no need to even consider using red, just realise that not all people are so fortunate that's all, especially in these tough times.

[evo]

if you are using red then you are knowingly participating in an illegal activity,,you will then be showing a disregard for the law and will have failed to demonstrate the required temperament and high standards of integrity required to possess a shotgun / or firearm

[Blackbart]

I think anyone faced with the OPPORTUNITY to save money or make money, weather it's legit or not would take the opportunity.

 

 

Bizzare statement !

 

So you think EVERYONE has criminal tendencies and given the opportunity would break the law to make a few quid.

[BRNDL]

BRNDL - I think you have cornered the market on strange, but simplistic posts. :hmm:

 

Another nonsense post from Gordon R...and probably another one to follow this.

[Blackbart]

No, not looking for justification I'm supplied with a vehicle for daily use by my employer and only use my own at weekends so no need to even consider using red, just realise that not all people are so fortunate that's all, especially in these tough times.

 

 

2 pages back you said you had a £500 banger for daily use and now you have a company car for daily use

[Trevorevans]

 

 

Bit like a low paid worker getting tax credits IE a benefit, yet he gets crucified for being a scrounger? pray tell me the difference.

 

KW

Think you've tarred me with the wrong brush mate. I'd totally agree with you, wouldn't consider that scrounging. My point in the previous post was that it would be better to lose a little on fuel duty to someone using red in order get to their low paid job and keep working rather than having them end up unemployed and on the dole, sorry if it came across any differently.

[evo]

I think anyone faced with the OPPORTUNITY to save money or make money, weather it's legit or not would take the opportunity.

 

 

Bizzare statement !

 

So you think EVERYONE has criminal tendencies and given the opportunity would break the law to make a few quid.

 

if it meant i was going to break the law then sorry if you dissagree BRNDL but i would stay on the law abiding side of the road

[BRNDL]

I think anyone faced with the OPPORTUNITY to save money or make money, weather it's legit or not would take the opportunity.

 

 

Bizzare statement !

 

So you think EVERYONE has criminal tendencies and given the opportunity would break the law to make a few quid.

 

Taking the quote away from the context of the original post here...

 

I think a large proportion of people have, in a fashion broken the law at some stage of their life. Sometimes, if something is presented to you at a VASTLY reduced price and you wanted it, would you not buy it unless it came with a receipt for purchase from a legitimate person?

 

I appreciate this is my opinion, but I would be very tempted to buy an item at a bargain price if It was already on my shopping list.

 

 

 

if it meant i was going to break the law then sorry if you dissagree BRNDL but i would stay on the law abiding side of the road

 

I don't disagree EVO, that's your choice. I appreciate that

[Gordon R]

BRNDL - your feeble attempt at sarcasm is wasted. Your logic is not merely flawed and simplistic, it is rather stupid.

[BRNDL]

BRNDL - your feeble attempt at sarcasm is wasted. Your logic is not merely flawed and simplistic, it is rather stupid.

 

And there it is...

 

Thanks for your input

[Trevorevans]

 

 

 

2 pages back you said you had a £500 banger for daily use and now you have a company car for daily use

Yes I have a banger as a run around and also a van supplied by my employer for work purposes. Maybe daily driver was the wrong term as ok I probably don't actually use it daily but then again I dont have reason to go out every day after getting home from work, but when I do, I do drive the previously mentioned £500 banger.

[Gordon R]

BRNDL - are you up past your bed time? Remember - you have school in the morning.

 

Be interesting to see if he can heed his own advice and resist posting. I suspect not. :lol: :lol:

Edited December 11, 2012 by Gordon R

[Blackbart]

Taking the quote away from the context of the original post here...

 

I think a large proportion of people have, in a fashion broken the law at some stage of their life. Sometimes, if something is presented to you at a VASTLY reduced price and you wanted it, would you not buy it unless it came with a receipt for purchase from a legitimate person?

 

I appreciate this is my opinion, but I would be very tempted to buy an item at a bargain price if It was already on my shopping list.

 

 

 

I don't disagree EVO, that's your choice. I appreciate that

 

 

I think that would be about right and the majority of people that do run on red are open to other criminal activity.

 

The romantic notion that someone is only using it to get to their low paid job is just that, "A romantic notion" as i would think the majority that use it dont work.

[Dirty Harry]

 

 

You can - this is from the list of excepted vehicles on the HMRC website.

 

 

8.3 Tractors

 

To qualify as an excepted vehicle, the tractor must be an agricultural tractor designed and constructed primarily for use otherwise than on roads. It must be used on public roads solely for:

(a)

purposes relating to agriculture, horticulture or forestry,

(B) cutting verges bordering public roads, or

© cutting hedges or trees bordering public roads or bordering verges which border public roads.

See paragraph 8.21 for what we mean by activities falling within agriculture, horticulture or forestry.

If a tractor has a vehicle Excise licence as a general haulage vehicle it cannot use red diesel as a fuel either on or off public roads, regardless of whether it is undertaking agricultural, horticultural or forestry work. This is because it is licensed to perform other work and is not therefore assumed to be used solely for agriculture, horticulture or forestry.

 

Perhaps the one you saw seized was done by someone with no understanding of what they were doing (highly possible), or where there was some other reason why the vehicle wasn't legit.

 

The tractor was being used for landscaping and maintainence of recreational facilities. It was a contractor doing private work relating to sports fields and gardens not verges and hedges............see below.

 

 

 

 

Activities accepted as falling within the definition of agriculture, horticulture or forestry include the:

 

breeding or rearing of any creature kept for the production of food, wool, skin or fur, or for the purpose of its use in the farming of land

growing or harvesting of crops including cereals, combinable crops, roots, tubers, vegetables, pulses, fruit, nuts, grasses, oilseeds and fungi for food, beverages, fodder, fuel or industrial purposes

growing or harvesting of flowering or ornamental plants

growing or harvesting of timber or other forestry products

upkeep of agricultural land such as set aside under environmental management schemes.

Activities not accepted as falling within the definition of agriculture, horticulture or forestry include:

 

The breeding, rearing or keeping of any creature for purposes relating to sport or recreation.

Dealing in agricultural, horticultural or forestry products.

Landscaping.

The maintenance of recreational facilities, including beaches.

Flood protection.

Peat or loam extraction.

The exploitation of wild animal or fish stocks.

Construction of buildings or other structures used for purposes relating to agriculture, horticulture or forestry.

Transportation of agricultural, horticultural or forestry produce, livestock, implements, inputs or waste, other than where this is incidental to an agricultural, horticultural or forestry operation being performed on the land. Accepted transportation uses are as set out under this agreement.

[BRNDL]

 

 

 

I think that would be about right and the majority of people that do run on red are open to other criminal activity.

 

The romantic notion that someone is only using it to get to their low paid job is just that, "A romantic notion" as i would think the majority that use it dont work.

 

Does that mean Blackbart and BRNDL agree on something?

[Sprackles]

well well,,i knew it would soon creep in sprackles :no: :no:

 

Why the head shaking.

This is a forum for field sports enthusiasts many of whom will be in total disagreement with the ban on Fox Hunting.

Amongst those who would not say a dicky bird if they saw a fox killed would I imagine, be some of the same people who are condemning the use of red diesel and branding those who do criminals.

I merely put the hypothetical question to see if those same people this comment was aimed at might openly admit to double standards.

[Blackbart]

Why the head shaking.

This is a forum for field sports enthusiasts many of whom will be in total disagreement with the ban on Fox Hunting.

Amongst those who would not say a dicky bird if they saw a fox killed would I imagine, be some of the same people who are condemning the use of red diesel and branding those who do criminals.

I merely put the hypothetical question to see if those same people this comment was aimed at might openly admit to double standards.

 

Your right many will be in disagreement with the ban.

 

Foxes are accidentally killed at hunt's , it is pretty hard to accidentally fill your tank with red.

[Mr Rizzini]

Your right many will be in disagreement with the ban.

 

Foxes are accidentally killed at hunt's , it is pretty hard to accidentally fill your tank with red.

My uncle once accidentially filled his motorbike with red diesel (true story) that was in what was meant to be his petrol can and while the hose was in the tank he didn't see what was going in and it was a few minutes later that he realised that the smell was wrong lol. Is he a criminal?

[BRNDL]

 

 

Your right many will be in disagreement with the ban.

 

Foxes are accidentally killed at hunt's , it is pretty hard to accidentally fill your tank with red.

 

I suppose it's minimising the risk to prevent the law being broken. So if I had 10 cans of diesel, 8 were red and 2 White and I put red in, that's an accident so it's not really breaking the law?

 

Or would it be suggested that I had NO cans of red thus erradicating the risk indefinitely?

 

So no hunting to prevent the unlawful killing of a fox?

 

" definitely got my tin hat on making my way to the bunker"

[BRNDL]

Plus I don't think the law works on weather it was an accident or not. They fact find.

 

Whether...not rainy stuff.

Edited December 12, 2012 by BRNDL

[Blackpowder]

So if it comes about that red diesel is discontinued and legitamate previous users can claim back the duty on white diesel does this leave the door open for undetectable abuse? That is ,say a farmer has his tank of now white fuel for agricultural use, but what is to stop him filling up his diesel mercedes with the same fuel. Doubtless the VAT people could track him down on paper but roadside dipping and testing would no longer reveal misuse.

 

Blackpowder

[Blackbart]

My uncle once accidentially filled his motorbike with red diesel (true story) that was in what was meant to be his petrol can and while the hose was in the tank he didn't see what was going in and it was a few minutes later that he realised that the smell was wrong lol. Is he a criminal?

 

Yes he is criminally stupid for not taking a sniff before he put diesel in a motorbike never mind red diesel.