anser2 Posted January 1, 2013 Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 Ok lets be a bit sensable about this. The furthest anyone should shoot at a live bird with 30 gr of no 6 is 50 yards. The pellets may well kill a little further but the pattern will have scattered so much you might not have a strike and if you do its unlikely to be a killing one. I saw the video of Digweed shooting 70 yard pigeons and noted he was using 34 gr loads , but they did not say what size pellets. I would not be surprised if they were no 4 . The main trouble here is one gunners 40 yards is anothers 50 yards. the only way to be sure is to measure out the distance. Even when you know your range the weather can effect your estimation. I can remember one morning many years ago killing cleanly 4 geese in a row with 42gr of no 1 lead in overcast conditions. The following morning was clear and frosty and the geese apeared the same height , but though I hit a few birds only one came down, hit in the head. The reason simple - the geese looked closer in the clear light than they did in overcast conditions and I was shooting at them slightly out of range. There are cartridges that will kill at extream ranges of 60 yards consistantly or a little more , the Winchester XXX 1 7\8s oz buffered copper plated lead shot. But they were made for long range shooting and for a 30gr load of lead in a game shell 50 yards is as far as anyone should ever shoot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted January 1, 2013 Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 Ok lets be a bit sensable about this. The furthest anyone should shoot at a live bird with 30 gr of no 6 is 50 yards. The pellets may well kill a little further but the pattern will have scattered so much you might not have a strike and if you do its unlikely to be a killing one. I saw the video of Digweed shooting 70 yard pigeons and noted he was using 34 gr loads , but they did not say what size pellets. I would not be surprised if they were no 4 . The main trouble here is one gunners 40 yards is anothers 50 yards. the only way to be sure is to measure out the distance. Even when you know your range the weather can effect your estimation. I can remember one morning many years ago killing cleanly 4 geese in a row with 42gr of no 1 lead in overcast conditions. The following morning was clear and frosty and the geese apeared the same height , but though I hit a few birds only one came down, hit in the head. The reason simple - the geese looked closer in the clear light than they did in overcast conditions and I was shooting at them slightly out of range. There are cartridges that will kill at extream ranges of 60 yards consistantly or a little more , the Winchester XXX 1 7\8s oz buffered copper plated lead shot. But they were made for long range shooting and for a 30gr load of lead in a game shell 50 yards is as far as anyone should ever shoot. People who use clay loads , 28g 7.5 reakon they can cleanly kill pigeons at 50 + yards though......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pestcontrol1 Posted January 1, 2013 Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 ive said it before and il say it again. Id let you shoot at me at 70yards with 6s I have 2 #6 in my leg and i was about 80 or so yrds off the gun they went through legins moleskin trousers 1 enbeded into my knee cap and the other was about 1-1/2" into my leg so i wouldt want shooting at 70 yrds its eye watering lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildfowler.250 Posted January 1, 2013 Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 Think 40 yards should be your standard. This can be stretched a bit with the right cartridge and ability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam-1990 Posted January 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 So the average seems to be about 30-40yrd with a few challenging/ lucky 50/60yrds shots but more can be achieved with bigger shot and heavier load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zapp Posted January 1, 2013 Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 I'd say so, as an average shot, I am confident in taking 40 yard shots with the shot charge in question. The individual shot (ie individual pellets) will kill much further if they strike the right place, but the pattern soon becomes too unpredictable to rely on at really long range, and so I dont shoot any further. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin lad Posted January 1, 2013 Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 So the average seems to be about 30-40yrd with a few challenging/ lucky 50/60yrds shots but more can be achieved with bigger shot and heavier load. the bigger shot will carry its energy better but with less shot the you will get bigger gaps in the pattern then you would be relying more on luck. stick to the 30-40 yards as so many have said mate and you will be fine colin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WGD Posted January 1, 2013 Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 Learn to judge distance, then worry about killing range - I see far more inability to judge distance in the shooting field than inability to shoot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figgy Posted January 1, 2013 Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) I've read all the posts in this thread,no doubt some are good shots but how many of us go game/pigeon shooting with full choke I don't. My sxs is fixed 3/4-3/4 and has pulled down some fantastic birds,but when out last a jay landed in a tree and I shot at it,never touched a feather at aprox 50-55 yards with blackgold 32g of 5. My pattern had holes big enough to miss. Only time I use full is Wildfowling as my mod kicks is full for steel,otherwise half is the norm for me. Figgy Edited January 1, 2013 by figgy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swingit Posted January 1, 2013 Report Share Posted January 1, 2013 ive said it before and il say it again. Id let you shoot at me at 70yards with 6s Please tell me this is a wind up!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockercas Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 Please tell me this is a wind up!!!!! Dose. I live to tell the tale. Answer your question? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oops Missed Again Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 What is the killing range in reality for a full choke 12 bore Make up 6ft x 6ft wooden frame, fill in with paper, I use brown masking paper, it's cheap! Fasten pork chop in the middle. Measure 70 yrds out and fire. Yes I am raving mad before we get all the comments, but try it and I think the armchair ballistic experts could learn a thing or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdSolomons Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 I think the thing you can take from al this is 99 times out of 100 the limiting factor is the shooter, not the shell. Shoot to your ability and you wont go far wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 (edited) I think the thing you can take from al this is 99 times out of 100 the limiting factor is the shooter, not the shell. Shoot to your ability and you wont go far wrong. The next question will be, how will you expect to get any better if you don't push yourself....... To an extent you can learn on a clay ground, but at some point you will need to put all your practice to use in the field...... And I don't mean kicking the **** out of the ranges, I'm implying an average, or slightly below, shooter learning to shoot decent birds over 30 yrds away.. Edited January 2, 2013 by chrispti Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swingit Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 Dose. I live to tell the tale. Answer your question? Ok,so it's not a wind up!.I just think it a little insane that you let somebody do it. Would you be foolish enough to do it face on with just a waistcoat and shirt on.I'd like to know the results as I don't always wear a thick shooting coat,leggings etc! Swingit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anser2 Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 Chrispti , I have used several loads of 7.5 ( winchester \ Dan arms \ Calidonian and Eley firsts ) and can tell you they will not in my guns consistantly kill a 50 yard pigeon. They struggle to do so with 45 yard birds. They have been used through two S\Ss with I\C and 1\ 4 choke and 1\2 and full choke. And i am pretty confident about knowing my ranges as for the past 8 years I have been doing bird survey work for wind farms and part of the job is measuring bird hights through the wind farm area. I have found 7.5s will knock down the odd bird usually with a broken wing at 50 yards , but the usual result is a cloud of feathers and the pigeon flys on. In contrast no 6 will do the job at 50 yards though is better at 45 yards. I have found 7.5s only suitable for pigeons between 25 and 35 yards. Closer birds are hit with so many pellets that they are unfit for the table and 40 yard birds are usualy wounded unless hit in the head. I suspect the real reason why so many like 7,5s clay loads is that they are cheaper than normal game loads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evo Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 simple answer is no6,s shoot 25 - 45yrds for a good kill rate,any further out and you will just be guessing judging by the sound of your experience if you have the ability of ed or george then you could probably go a little further but not much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 Chrispti , I have used several loads of 7.5 ( winchester \ Dan arms \ Calidonian and Eley firsts ) and can tell you they will not in my guns consistantly kill a 50 yard pigeon. They struggle to do so with 45 yard birds. They have been used through two S\Ss with I\C and 1\ 4 choke and 1\2 and full choke. And i am pretty confident about knowing my ranges as for the past 8 years I have been doing bird survey work for wind farms and part of the job is measuring bird hights through the wind farm area. I have found 7.5s will knock down the odd bird usually with a broken wing at 50 yards , but the usual result is a cloud of feathers and the pigeon flys on. In contrast no 6 will do the job at 50 yards though is better at 45 yards. I have found 7.5s only suitable for pigeons between 25 and 35 yards. Closer birds are hit with so many pellets that they are unfit for the table and 40 yard birds are usualy wounded unless hit in the head. I suspect the real reason why so many like 7,5s clay loads is that they are cheaper than normal game loads. I agree. I'm pretty confident on my range judging, and even revisited using clay loads after reading posts on this forum My findings were the same, they just don't kill consistently at range. Pigeons in particular, look a long way off when they are above you, Iv been out with plenty of other shooters who have shot pigeons that look high coming over tree tops, thinking they have just Poleaxed a good 50yrd bird, when in fact the tree tops are only 30-35yards high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 What is the killing range in reality for a full choke 12 bore Make up 6ft x 6ft wooden frame, fill in with paper, I use brown masking paper, it's cheap! Fasten pork chop in the middle. Measure 70 yrds out and fire. Yes I am raving mad before we get all the comments, but try it and I think the armchair ballistic experts could learn a thing or two. What a waste of a perfectly good Pork chop! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oops Missed Again Posted January 8, 2013 Report Share Posted January 8, 2013 REF No 62 Anyone tried it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted January 8, 2013 Report Share Posted January 8, 2013 Not triying to stir up a debate here or encourage anyone to do anything stupid.. But on grouse moors the horn/whistle posts (safety post where keepers blow horns to stop shooting birds forward) are generally between 70-120m out so it is not unusual to be hit depending on the drive (albeit not full pattern aiming at you) usually a few pellets but they can sting a bit, been hit a few times in short sleves and it stings a bit more a couple off times u could see the mark and a black line the lead leaves. Generally u would be fine if it hit ur back at that range but would still take an eye very easy. But u should not take chances doing it intentionally To the average shot 35yds is about the max range i shoot too consistantly and i've been shooting all my life(mainly walked up/rough), but i shoot well up to that range. I am more than happy to let a bird go over and not lift a gun to it, 1 day i was picking up on a morning duck flight but i had my gun as well, ducks coming over me that were out of MY range so i wasnae lifting my gun yet the shoot captain and keepers son on far side where taking out left and rights and the birds where higher by then, but there are far better shots at that type off driven game and even afterseeing them drop them i still never lifted my gun All those who think they can shoot to 70m CONSISTANTLY well if u really could u would be a hell off a shot and probably competeing at national stanard, U realy should be aiming to get ur shots to kill down i very much doubt u are shooting 4 or even 5-6 to 1 on 70m birds It's more about finding YOUR range that U can kill consistantly and be happy with that and hopefully with practice experience it should extend, the fact that someone like Mr Digweed can kill at X m's is really irrelevent, he's a world class athelte/performer. I could watch Messi play football but i din't think i can do most of wot he does so wht would i watch GD and expect to do the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oops Missed Again Posted January 8, 2013 Report Share Posted January 8, 2013 Nice post Scotslad. One mistake 50/60 to 1 because most people think 40 yrds is 70. Me included!! I once broke a clay at 60 ish yrds, it took the shot (what seemed like) 2 or 3 seconds to get there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobbyathome Posted January 8, 2013 Report Share Posted January 8, 2013 this was a perfectly good question to help someone understand how far killing range is when you are a newbie this info is a normal question that would go through your mind and to turn the thread into some idiot that would happily get shot at from 70 yards is unbelievable sir you are a plank anyone that shoots a gun at anyone from any distance deserves to have his licence taken away anyone that wants to be a target should not be on this forum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockercas Posted January 8, 2013 Report Share Posted January 8, 2013 Or the fact ive demonstrated that 70m is to far for a 12 bore. Are you the forum police? Would you like to spank me? i bet you would? Anyway. Who said i have a licence? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobbyathome Posted January 8, 2013 Report Share Posted January 8, 2013 i am not the forum police and i would not like to spank you i dont care if you have a licence i just think that when a forum member askes a normal question he deserves a decent answer not a plank that wants to be shot at Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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