ROBLATCH Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 what are your thoughts on this guys? http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/10339070.Police_chiefs_issue_tougher_gun_licensing_guidance/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aris Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 An inquest into the deaths, in Crook last month, heard that the 42-year-old taxi driver legally held six weapons despite a history of domestic abuse and threats of self-harm. Says it all - follow the current rules and guidelines first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salopian Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 I think you will find that the Police are often at fault in most of these incidents. But of course the Chief Constable could not possibly agree with that observation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 wonder which the other regions are that are trailing these "new guidelines". To be fair someone should be for the chop up there in Durham, its been an on going joke with arms dealing and giving the guns back to this guy without a court battle. Hopefully May will see through their incompetence and dismiss any new stuff, all the rules were there to stop this they just failed to follow them. Why do people have to loose their lives because of these fools? if something like this happened in industry the directors and managers would most likely find themselves fighting manslaughter charges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kernel gadaffi Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 I know two shooters who have lost their tickets following on from this incident through no fault of their own, call it persecution, call it, "closing the door after the horse has bolted", but, it seems they're acting now to remove the FAC/SGCs from anyone they want, to show that they are being proactive and put them in a good light in the public eye. The shooter who has held the required license for many years (in my friends case, over 30 years) has little recourse, I did ask my mate to join the NGO or another organisation, but he had better things to spend £30 on!!!!!! Now he has no rifles or shotguns, a lifetimes hobby/way of life removed, through the over zealous need by Durham Police to put themselves back in the good books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aris Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 I know two shooters who have lost their tickets following on from this incident through no fault of their own, call it persecution, call it, "closing the door after the horse has bolted", but, it seems they're acting now to remove the FAC/SGCs from anyone they want, to show that they are being proactive and put them in a good light in the public eye. The shooter who has held the required license for many years (in my friends case, over 30 years) has little recourse, I did ask my mate to join the NGO or another organisation, but he had better things to spend £30 on!!!!!! Now he has no rifles or shotguns, a lifetimes hobby/way of life removed, through the over zealous need by Durham Police to put themselves back in the good books. On what grounds did they remove them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 Threads like this are so depressing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenhunter Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 I know two shooters who have lost their tickets following on from this incident through no fault of their own, call it persecution, call it, "closing the door after the horse has bolted", but, it seems they're acting now to remove the FAC/SGCs from anyone they want, to show that they are being proactive and put them in a good light in the public eye. The shooter who has held the required license for many years (in my friends case, over 30 years) has little recourse, I did ask my mate to join the NGO or another organisation, but he had better things to spend £30 on!!!!!! Now he has no rifles or shotguns, a lifetimes hobby/way of life removed, through the over zealous need by Durham Police to put themselves back in the good books. This is the problem, the usual knee-jerk reaction! And, in case you thought it couldn't get worse...I know of one young lad who was threatened with losing his SGC because he has had a paternity suit slapped on him I couldn't believe it! So lads, it seems like you can lose your guns for dipping your bread in someone elses gravy! Be careful out there boys GH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 the police are getting a bit silly abount all this now,make it as hard as they want but people will still kill people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 So what do we propose to do about it then?Once again the majority of law-abiding shooters pay the price for the now all too familiar Police/Licensing incompetence/indifference/cock-up...delete as applicable,and rather than hold up their hands and say 'we are sorry,we got it wrong',they propose even more intrusion into the private lives of ALL of us.So do we do something about it,or as usual,just sit back,do nothing,and have a good old whinge? I've no doubt Theresa Mays office has e-mail.The shooting organisations also have e-mail.It's up to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROBLATCH Posted April 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 (edited) So what do we propose to do about it then?Once again the majority of law-abiding shooters pay the price for the now all too familiar Police/Licensing incompetence/indifference/cock-up...delete as applicable,and rather than hold up their hands and say 'we are sorry,we got it wrong',they propose even more intrusion into the private lives of ALL of us.So do we do something about it,or as usual,just sit back,do nothing,and have a good old whinge? I've no doubt Theresa Mays office has e-mail.The shooting organisations also have e-mail.It's up to you. to be honest the previous thread on this at the inquest you will probably read/find that the basc are in favour of the changes Edited April 9, 2013 by ROBLATCH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 The usual posturing to cover the fact the Police did not do their job adequately, but More Robust measures need to be adopted for Certificate Holders. Whats new, we had this after Michael Ryan and Thomas Hamilton , etc....... Even David Cameron said you can't legislate for someone throwing a wobbly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 (edited) So what do we propose to do about it then? Nothing. We're subjects so we have a mind set. The forbears of the existing American population set up home there to escape from it and the strength of the gun lobby reflects this. The French are 6 or 7 generations down the line from it and now won't take **** from any source. Us? Well, when I was a nipper a Sunday afternoon out was either feeding the ducks on the lake in the park or running free in the countryside. In 50 years time it'll be feeding the foxes in the high street. The countryside will be out of the question being riddled with TB, full of boar, deer and illegal immigrants and where there's any space, solar panels and wind turbines. Edited April 9, 2013 by wymberley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steppenwolf Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 It seems we need to find some contact details for this Andy Marsh, head of ACPO, since he will be pushing for these extra checks. I am on the Hamnpshire police website but I can't find an e-mail for the guy, if anyone else has any better luck they can post the information here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 It seems we need to find some contact details for this Andy Marsh, head of ACPO, since he will be pushing for these extra checks. I am on the Hamnpshire police website but I can't find an e-mail for the guy, if anyone else has any better luck they can post the information here. Email and ask........ postmaster@hampshire.pnn.police.uk or just take out postmaster and insert AndyMarsh and see what happens, he is the Chief Constable and will have an email, fact is they will almost guaranteed be filtered and he will not see them all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steppenwolf Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 This is why hopefully more than just me will be sending that email. WE need to tell them to actually do their job and follow existing regulations, not implement new ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 It's not all bad news, the below is taken from the latest published minutes of the ACPO FELWG meeting. FUTURE OF FELWG 15.1 DCC Marsh outlined his vision for the future of FELWG. 15.2 Members agreed: • That the existing national and regional meetings would continue in the current format in order to provide clear opportunity for reps to highlight issues to FELWG members and agree a consistent approach and a preferred practice. • That a strategic leaders meeting be created to allow the National FELWG Lead to communicate with either force or regional senior police officers. This would allow the opportunity to promote a collaborative national approach, introduce new initiatives, provide guidance on where efficiencies/improvements could be made and monitor performance. It will also look to promote consistency in the firearms licensing processes and encourage support and resource to departments to prevent failings. DCC Marsh envisages the meeting involving Superintendents/Chief Superintendents/police staff equivalent under which portfolio firearms licensing sits. DCC Marsh will draw up some terms of reference and as a initial proposal asks for strategic representation from the current regional areas represented at FELWG. Regional reps were asked to consider the most appropriate representation from their areas, to link in with Mr Groothuis. Action: Regional reps to consider strategic representation from their forces and notify Mr Groothuis. • To review the current practitioners’ meeting and membership therof. Currently there is a lack of expansive representation in the group and DCC Marsh, whilst recognising the value of an umbrella/funnel, is keen to have a forum accessible to the shooting community. It was agreed to arrange a meeting with senior representatives of BSSC in order to move this forward. Action: Mr Taylor to initiate contact with BSSC in order to have discussions concerning representation within the current Practitioners’ Group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 Maybe a start, but I'm not celebrating yet! Just the same it does sound relatively positive. Is that a typo, should they have said BASC? Who is BSSC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 British Shooting Sports Council Ultimately the police are a bit between a rock and a hard place they have to licence with public safety in mind while also allowing shooters a little discretion and keeping their decisions defensible against court action from shooting organisations or private appeals. Yes this case with hindsight should have resulted in a revoke but that is easy to say now they presumably on past experience didn't think they could defend such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 Maybe a start, but I'm not celebrating yet! Just the same it does sound relatively positive. Is that a typo, should they have said BASC? Who is BSSC? Is there by any chance (bells are ringing) a British Shooting Sports Council/Committee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 to be honest the previous thread on this at the inquest you will probably read/find that the basc are in favour of the changes Fair enough,but does that mean WE have to be in favour? The licensing procedures were and are already in place(and have been since before Dunblane,and indeed Hungerford) to either respond to,or act on information received,to prevent what happened at Durham,from happening.The Police,for reasons best known to them,chose not to act or respond to their own findings!!!!!!(sound familiar?)And now they are mooting more stringent proposals to try and distract from their shortcomings. Is it me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 (edited) British Shooting Sports Council........................ Thanks for that. Flippen ek, Umbrella organisation for 12 shooting sports organisations. I suspect I have come across that before but as we speak I don't remember. SO...what do they do then? Another toothless, gutless monster funding jollies for those involved, someone tell me I have it wrong, I only say this on the basis that I haven't seen them at the forefront of any campaigning/pressure/support for shooting! Why isn't it them bullying the media/Police, why are they waiting an invite from ACPO, why haven't they already got a voice on the shooting front with them? Why is it always *********** or the BASC? Rant over, I'm just off to take my pills! Edit I'm confused, the stars are Mike Y**d**y why doesn't that work? Edited April 9, 2013 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steppenwolf Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 BSSC do a lot for shooting, they are the Target Sports version of BASC, they liaison with a number of other shooting organisation, with ACPO, the Police and the Home Office to get legislation favourably passed for shooting, or to get police to use common sense in decisions. They are definately not some"toothless organization",, I know the top people and they have unbeleivable high level contacts. I suspect I have come across that before but as we speak I don't remember. SO...what do they do then? Another toothless, gutless monster funding jollies for those involved, someone tell me I have it wrong, I only say this on the basis that I haven't seen them at the forefront of any campaigning/pressure/support for shooting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 BSSC do a lot for shooting, they are the Target Sports version of BASC, they liaison with a number of other shooting organisation, with ACPO, the Police and the Home Office to get legislation favourably passed for shooting, or to get police to use common sense in decisions. They are definately not some"toothless organization",, I know the top people and they have unbeleivable high level contacts. So, what does the NRA do these days if we have the BASC for the field and BSSC for Target? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 and how come BASC, CPSA and NRA are on the council of BSSC is its all target related, seems to be a conglomeration of all shooting organisations from what I can see Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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