BRNDL Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 It is disappointing to read that some genuine invitations to other shooting enthusiasts have been misused in such a way that the host(s) consider revoking their offerings for the future. I fail to see any rational behind upsetting the host that has shown such generosity and opportunity both individually and for the sport? So, do you offer sporting opportunities to others and if so do you lay out the ground rules pre shoot? What are your genreal Ts&Cs? A P.W members has kindly offered to take me for a day on the pigeons...and has already highlighted there will be ground rules that need to be followed. I fully expect to be given ground rules and some do's and dont's. We have exchanged numerous emails and also spoken on the phone. As a new shooter the more information the better as it helps me feel at ease and less nervous about the event and also there are guide lines to help lighten the way. (This is not directly liked to the recently closed thread on permissions but indirectly raised some thoughts on invitations) ATB BRNDL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Galore! Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 i do try to lay down a few do's and don'ts, go through rifle safety etc, but i really don't appreciate having a novice threaten to turn a gun on me after a telling off. no one from pw by the way, but i won't bother taking anymore probies, my knuckles still hurt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRNDL Posted July 29, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 i do try to lay down a few do's and don'ts, go through rifle safety etc, but i really don't appreciate having a novice threaten to turn a gun on me after a telling off. no one from pw by the way, but i won't bother taking anymore probies, my knuckles still hurt Bloodyelll Sorry to hear that...(your not taking any more newbies) and well done for the slap around the chops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Yes it does seem a pity that some PW members appear to spoil it for others. Clearly some have fewer morals about taking shooting from someone who has given them a day out. Some may say that it is up to the landowner to decide who he lets on but I disagree. If a PW member has the pigeon shooting on a piece of ground and invites another party to shoot over it then it would be outrageous for the invitee to think that he could go onto that land under his own steam. I have had quite a few PW members out in the past year or so and I know for a fact that none of them would ever contemplate going behind my back. I have never mentioned it, I never felt I needed to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 JDog - that is the situation in a nutshell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Mongrel- Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Yes it does seem a pity that some PW members appear to spoil it for others. Clearly some have fewer morals about taking shooting from someone who has given them a day out. Some may say that it is up to the landowner to decide who he lets on but I disagree. If a PW member has the pigeon shooting on a piece of ground and invites another party to shoot over it then it would be outrageous for the invitee to think that he could go onto that land under his own steam. I have had quite a few PW members out in the past year or so and I know for a fact that none of them would ever contemplate going behind my back. I have never mentioned it, I never felt I needed to. I have a small syndicate shooting over a farm, a stables/riding school and a couple of smaller permissions. The guys on the syndicate are free to shoot freely as and when they can, and occasionally they ask to bring a guest. They need to show insurance and SGC as a member and I need to see the same from any guests, but I always make sure that they make it very clear that its a one off invitation, that the member is responsible for his guest and that if a 'guest' abused the offer then there would be syndicate member losing the right to shoot the grounds as well.... So far so good, but it still makes me nervous when we have guests on the ground! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRNDL Posted July 29, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Yes it does seem a pity that some PW members appear to spoil it for others. Clearly some have fewer morals about taking shooting from someone who has given them a day out. Some may say that it is up to the landowner to decide who he lets on but I disagree. If a PW member has the pigeon shooting on a piece of ground and invites another party to shoot over it then it would be outrageous for the invitee to think that he could go onto that land under his own steam. I have had quite a few PW members out in the past year or so and I know for a fact that none of them would ever contemplate going behind my back. I have never mentioned it, I never felt I needed to. I agree totally Jdog. Do you think issues like "toe treading" could be quashed if simple do's and dont's were drawn up. I mean, personally my thoughts are that most of this is general common sense with morals and ethics cohesively to standard. I presume the majority of members that take new shooters dont know them or their background? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRNDL Posted July 29, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 I have a small syndicate shooting over a farm, a stables/riding school and a couple of smaller permissions. The guys on the syndicate are free to shoot freely as and when they can, and occasionally they ask to bring a guest. They need to show insurance and SGC as a member and I need to see the same from any guests, but I always make sure that they make it very clear that its a one off invitation, that the member is responsible for his guest and that if a 'guest' abused the offer then there would be syndicate member losing the right to shoot the grounds as well.... So far so good, but it still makes me nervous when we have guests on the ground! Yes, I like the idea of revoking the permission to shoot if a guest misbehaves. It shows some accountability for the syndicate member and also encourages him to make an informed decision about who they do invite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 i do try to lay down a few do's and don'ts, go through rifle safety etc, but i really don't appreciate having a novice threaten to turn a gun on me after a telling off. no one from pw by the way, but i won't bother taking anymore probies, my knuckles still hurt Seriously :o Good on you for teaching him a lesson about rifle safety,and one that he won't forget. I have taken a few on my permissions,and safety brief if you are a newbie is paramount,my farmers are happy for me to bring someone along as they know i will take full responsibility for them,i am happy to say no one has ever gone behind my back to shoot on my land,and i would not dream of approaching a farmer if i had been on other peoples land. My Dad many years ago took a lad out for a shoot,and when he saw the farmer a couple of weeks later the farmer mentioned that this lad had been shooting by the duck ponds and had said Pete(my dad)had said it was ok,my Dad told the farmer that he had said no such thing and was disgusted that this lad was so underhanded. Between this farmer who was a major land owner,and my Dad who had a huge amount of land and was very well respected for his shooting and field craft skills they put out the word and this lad couldn't get his foot onto a farm for miles around. My Dad told him what he had done and why and this lad tried for years to make light of it but was totally shunned.Hard lesson learned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 I think Insurance is a must , for one thing it shows that the person invited takes things seriously . I also think to a certain degree when it comes to other PW members that you can tell those who you will most likely get on with by the contents of their posts , there are some I am sure on here I would get on with like a house on fire and others who I doubt I would want to share time with. The few I have been out with or taken out both shooting and fishing have ended up firm friends and 100% trust worthy, I would like to think they consider me in the same way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the pigeon man Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Pigeon basher on here I think has got it down To a tee he tells it how it is while offering a day out witch I don't blame his I have taken loads of people out with me each one has broke a record and enjoyed the day never had to explain rules ect but I don't really like shooting with novices after taking some 1 my own age out (clay shooter) and ended up shooting over my head and shooting at swallows shortly after was told to leave ... My farmer is understanding in all this permission malarkey and will tell any 1 where to go if asked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 I think its wise to measure a PW'er before inviting and would expect to be so measured. The measure is simply - is this person honest, decent and reliable? If not I would not invite anyone or advise others do. I agree completely with JDOG but some people are unlucky. Rifles are a different matter and insurance would be a minimum, ideally a safety check and some little experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 I take guests out on my permissions, so far 10 members from P.W. have enjoyed a day. Many have returned for further days and all but one have been a pleasure to host. Some have become firm friends. All of my farms have locked gates, I have the keys and the farmers would be most surprised if a stranger were to approach them for access. I have in the past introduced guests to some of the farmers when they have come along to see how we are doing. So far the most people I have ever taken out at one go is 6, it's a great way to cover ground and keep birds moving. I like to know that the guests have third party insurance and a shotgun certificate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Yes it does seem a pity that some PW members appear to spoil it for others. Clearly some have fewer morals about taking shooting from someone who has given them a day out. Some may say that it is up to the landowner to decide who he lets on but I disagree. If a PW member has the pigeon shooting on a piece of ground and invites another party to shoot over it then it would be outrageous for the invitee to think that he could go onto that land under his own steam. I have had quite a few PW members out in the past year or so and I know for a fact that none of them would ever contemplate going behind my back. I have never mentioned it, I never felt I needed to. I could not have put it better myself. Exactly my feelings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Galore! Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 (edited) Seriously :o Good on you for teaching him a lesson about rifle safety,and one that he won't forget. unfortunately so mate, third time out and he was doing so well on targets i thought let him try for some live quarry. i was lamping and told the boy twice not to fire and just wait for the rabbits to move nearer the bank, he didn't listen and pulled the trigger i hasten to add just in case my feo is reading this, i was provoked and took only necessary action to disarm him. then made him walk home on the other hand i've had some good evenings out with silpig5 and reddan, both top blokes imo. Edited July 29, 2013 by Paddy Galore! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRNDL Posted July 29, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Pigeon basher on here I think has got it down To a tee he tells it how it is while offering a day out witch I don't blame his I have taken loads of people out with me each one has broke a record and enjoyed the day never had to explain rules ect but I don't really like shooting with novices after taking some 1 my own age out (clay shooter) and ended up shooting over my head and shooting at swallows shortly after was told to leave ... My farmer is understanding in all this permission malarkey and will tell any 1 where to go if asked Hopefully after I return from my day with Caesar he will post up a good word for me! Nothing better than a good recommendation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiffy Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 only once have i been invited onto someones permission, i know that it is a good site with a lot of shooting through the year and that i could easily go back there if i so wished but i wouldnt do it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepasty Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 its simple... Do ask for permission if the invitee has suggested it or you feel you can ask the invitee if they'd mind.... alls good in the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 on the other hand i've had some good evenings out with silpig5 and reddan, both top blokes imo. Whats happened to Adi ,dont see him on here now , is it because he,s now a businessman that he does not want to mix with us commoners Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Galore! Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Whats happened to Adi ,dont see him on here now , is it because he,s now a businessman that he does not want to mix with us commoners yup although i do often see him in mcdonalds carpark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunnerbob Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Yes it does seem a pity that some PW members appear to spoil it for others. Clearly some have fewer morals about taking shooting from someone who has given them a day out. Some may say that it is up to the landowner to decide who he lets on but I disagree. If a PW member has the pigeon shooting on a piece of ground and invites another party to shoot over it then it would be outrageous for the invitee to think that he could go onto that land under his own steam. I have had quite a few PW members out in the past year or so and I know for a fact that none of them would ever contemplate going behind my back. I have never mentioned it, I never felt I needed to. Spot-on JDog... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckyshot Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 (edited) Don't have any guidelines now. its easier to just not invite anyone to come along as they either let me down by not turning up or try to go behind my back and see the farmer themselves. Lucky for me I am the only person my farmers trust to shoot on there land so its all good. (Grasshopper is welcome to come along anytime for a nv session as he so kindly took me out on his permission) Edited July 29, 2013 by Luckyshot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiffy Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Don't have any guidelines now. its easier to just not invite anyone to come along as they either let me down by not turning up or try to go behind my back and see the farmer themselves. Lucky for me I am the only person my farmers trust to shoot on there land so its all good. dont blame you one bit especially if you have been let down but its a damn shame that theres so many with so few scruples Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the pigeon man Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 Rich Dave and Glenn off here 3 lads i can trust 3 great lads off out on crows with rich again tomoz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Mongrel- Posted July 29, 2013 Report Share Posted July 29, 2013 It is a tricky one, especially in the South East where I am. Permission is hard to come by, and jealously guarded. It took me a long time to get any permissions and I'll be mightily peed off if someone else loses it for me! My 'terms' may seem a little draconian to some, but, I have a good group of guys who could all lose their shooting if someone ****s up, I'll do everything I can to prevent that happening. ALL bar one of the members are on PW so they see these posts too and I've not had anyone complain yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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