Confusion over 67mm cartridges in 65mm chambered guns

[Wingman]

Guys

 

I just picked up a slab of 16 gauge Eley VIP cartridges, 28 gram no. 6 shot. On the box they state that the cartridges are 67mm cases but it states they are for guns with 65mm chambers. I plan to use them with my old SxS which has 65mm chambers.

 

How can this be, how can they claim to be both?

 

Are they ok to use in my geriatric gun?

 

Thanks for any responses.

[casts_by_fly]

67mm cartridges are generally fine in 65mm chambered guns. 70 in a 65 is a no no.

 

rick

[Daveo26]

Well 2 1/2" is 63mm

2 3/4" is 69.8mm

I'd use them

Edited November 10, 2016 by Daveo26

[Wingman]

Doesn't make sense to me!

[Stonepark]

Your chamber length is 2.5 inch (67.5mm).

 

Even if you have true 65mm chambers, your forcing cones are normally at least 1/2 long and 3/32 (2.5mm) creep into them is not generally going to cause an issue as there is still enough room for cartridge case and loading to pass through without raising pressure too much.

[kevin55]

osted 28 September 2011 - 09:28 AM It is quite dangerous to fire the wrong length cartridge in a gun marked 2/1/2 inch. When a cartridge opens up the crimp it does so in the chamber, which is considerably bigger than the forcing cone if 67mm cartridges are used when they open the crimp will be slightly in the forcing cone which will increase chamber pressure by at least 30% not a good idea on an older gun. Yes they will fire and just produce a slight bit more recoil however the gun might be hard to open after each shot.You will not tell by trying to fit a fired cartridge in the chamber please just use the correct size cartridge in the first place and use up the 67mm in something else

Happy shooting

 

 

An old post from 'Deerhunter' K -I was told the same, that the forcing cones are too abrupt on the older guns

[Wingman]

But they clearly state on the box they are for 65mm guns surely Eley woundt risk a law suit if there essentially dangerous? I'll post a pic later of what it says

[Daveo26]

Then the proper advice is take it to a reputable gunsmith a get their advice.

But for the record I would use them without giving it a second thought

[bruno22rf]

Perfectly fine for 2 1/2" chambers - you worry too much Paul !! The vast majority of guns chambered for 2 1/2" actually have 2 5/8" chambers.

Edited November 10, 2016 by bruno22rf

[Guest cookoff013]

Cip says yes. There is a footnote on this.

[wymberley]

But they clearly state on the box they are for 65mm guns surely Eley woundt risk a law suit if there essentially dangerous? I'll post a pic later of what it says

If you go to the Eley web-site, you'll only find two cartridges in the VIP range that equate to the chamber size - 20 bore and 12 bore extreme and this pretty much applies across their 'normal' game range. Your highlighted quote applies. They're safe to use but should you wish to give the old lady a rest or you find that they are a tad 'brisk' Gamebore Regal (just one example) have you covered.

Edited November 10, 2016 by wymberley

[Old farrier]

But they clearly state on the box they are for 65mm guns surely Eley woundt risk a law suit if there essentially dangerous? I'll post a pic later of what it says

Are they rto. Or. Crimped?

[Smokersmith]

I have been faced with the same dilemma with an Army and Navy 12g with 2.5" chambers.

 

At the weekend I used Express Supreme Game 65mm, and Winchester GB, which state OK for 2.5" but are 67mm.

 

Both worked well, and the spent cases looked very similar..... I.e. No evidence that the longer cases were having the end 2mm "squeezed" at all.

 

I will carry on like this, but only use loads of 30g or less.

[Guest cookoff013]

Did you know the chamber's have a minimum of +2mm?

So 65mm chambers should be 65.1mm +2 mm so the minimum 65mm chamber is 67.1mm.

Same for 67mm guns. 67.6mm + 2mm is 69.6mm minimum chamber length. All this info is from cip.

[Wingman]

Perfectly fine for 2 1/2" chambers - you worry too much Paul !! The vast majority of guns chambered for 2 1/2" actually have 2 5/8" chambers.

Your probably right, but need to be cautious as my son will shoot it this weekend!

[Wingman]

Thanks guys it makes more sense now. Have to say though the box is a little unclear in my view!

 

[shoot and be safe]

I have been in the same predicament in the past.

I sought advice from a couple of gunsmiths and the concensus of option was that the cartridges are proofed for use in 2.5" chambers so safe to use.

I should point out that the crimp part of the cartridge did look at little "stretched" after firing so I ignored their advice and stopped using them in my 2.5" chambered gun, which is a great shame as I liked the performance of that cartridge/gun combination.

 

If your fired cartridges don't show any sign of stretching, fill your boots and bang away

[panoma1]

I fired a few 28g 67mm fibre wad clay loads through my 2.5mm chambered light English gun, much too hot! Kicked like the proverbial.....Although it said they were suitable for 2.5mm chambered guns, I would not use them again!........ I'll stick to game loads from now on!

Edited November 11, 2016 by panoma1

[Guest cookoff013]

guy, guys the stats and criteria for 65mm are exactly the same as for 70mm

same 740bar limit,

67mm same again.

[Whitebridges]

These ones:

 

[casts_by_fly]

These ones:

 

 

 

yup. Some of the softest shooting game loads I have seen for their type. The 28 6's fiber are probably the perfect SxS load going right now. the three crowns from Hull are also excellent and equally soft (or softer).

 

thanks

rick

[Smokersmith]

Did you know the chamber's have a minimum of +2mm?

So 65mm chambers should be 65.1mm +2 mm so the minimum 65mm chamber is 67.1mm.

Same for 67mm guns. 67.6mm + 2mm is 69.6mm minimum chamber length. All this info is from cip.

 

Thanks for sharing ... I didn't know.

 

Do you know when this was instigated?

 

The real question is will an old 2.5" gun from say 1885 gun have to have conformed to these standards?

 

Not challenging, just hoping to learn!!

[wymberley]

These ones:

 

I suggested those until I realised my mistake. They don't appear to have a 16 bore version.

[Guest cookoff013]

t

 

 

Thanks for sharing ... I didn't know.

 

Do you know when this was instigated?

 

The real question is will an old 2.5" gun from say 1885 gun have to have conformed to these standards?

 

Not challenging, just hoping to learn!!

 

re revised 1984

and again 2005. (probably hp stuff.)

 

i`d think it be best if you guys bought a loader and reloaded subsonics in 2.5". they are the softest shells in the universe, load up 32g 5-4-3-2-1 and you can posatively contact targets with great authority, with no recoil.
i think someone here used some of mine and was really impressed, i did a 1.5oz 3" version too.

[Whitebridges]

I suggested those until I realised my mistake. They don't appear to have a 16 bore version.

 

They don't do them in 16 bore unfortunately. However, Hull do a 16g High Pheasant 67mm 28g Fibre 5 or 6 shot which ought to be pretty close.