World ICTSF Sporting at Kelmarsh

[Gordon R]

Facebook post from a none too happy George Digweed - traps removed from second round or position of traps moved. A fair number of fellow shooters have endorsed his opinion:-

World ICTSF Sporting at Kelmarsh ... I have just walked in at home having thought about nothing else in the car going home from the 2 day event I have just attended at Kelmarsh. It has made me so angry that I have had to vent my frustration on social media. Having shot in a competitve enviroment for nearly 40 years, I can honestly say that this is the worst event I have ever been to.
Billed as a 'World Championship' with a price tage of £130 to enter, which puts each course of 100 registered targets at £65, which is incredibly 'top end' to say the least, we arrive full of expectation yesterday morning, to go through a lengthy questioning procedure on the gate as to where and when I can park my car in a flat field!!!
If I had taken somebody to the event to show them what a World Championship looks like in our sport ... I would have been horrified,. as a small collection of marquees at the far end of the field, with 3 small trade stands, was all a World Championship shoot could muster. You had to make your own tea/coffee before paying for it, and was generally devoid of people.
That was the good bit we were to find out!!! ....
After my first 6 stands yesterday, I was unsure as to whether I was clay shooting or pigeon shooting, as targets being shot through small holes in trees generally does not inspire. Everything was edge on with no dome or belly shown, and very little thought gone into angles and speed. I shot the red course yesterday and whilst it was wind effected in a small manner, I felt the targets were too hard for the majority of competitors BUT the shoot was SHOOTABLE. I then hear the comments coming off the Blue Course, and on getting back to my car, witness Richard Faulds shoot a 5/10 on a pair of springing teal, which was from where I was stood and the degree of difficulty of the targets looked a reasonable score on that stand. I shot this stand this morning (second day) in a different wind and killed 10 on the drop with my second barrel being 20 yards! How can this be fair!!! With this stand coming so early in the round, and breaking so many peoples cards, their interest for the rest of it would have wained.
If shot today, and you have pretty much filled in the stand, it would give you the momentum to go onto a bigger score. Targets can be wind effected as we all know, but there should
NOT be 100 yards difference.
Having shot the course today, Richard's 90 yesterday would have been phenominal. Having looked round other stands on the course, and understanding wind direction, targets AND TRAPS have moved on the red and blue courses.
In the modern day enviroment within shooting, to not put a minimum of 14 (if not 15) stands at a major Championship is at best short sightedness and at worst ... penny pinching.
Thank God the majority of shooters who were in Budapest for a first class event last week from overseas did not continue on and come to this event, because having tried to represent the sport in a proffessional manner for a long period of time for my Country - I was genuinly embarressed.
I feel the event was a total CPSA cash cow, with the World Championship tag thrown in for incentive. I spoke to a lot of angry people on the phone driving home, who all feel very, very hard done by.

 

Edited July 14, 2017 by Gordon R

[welshwarrior]

There's a "jury" decision on the CPSA website as well say 1 stand now discounted and 1 every one get full points.

 

Not heard anyone saying anything positive yet!!

[Westley]

There's a "jury" decision on the CPSA website as well say 1 stand now discounted and 1 every one get full points.

 

Not heard anyone saying anything positive yet!!

 

It's over ! and by all accounts THAT is the only positive thing about it.

[Salopian]

Westley,

It isn't over yet , another two days to go .

Plus if you win the main shoot by a good number of targets , you don't carry them over .

You do another 50 bird final shoot on Sunday morning starting with all the other finalists from scratch. The you do a Super Final of 25 targets to keep a virtually none existant crowd entertained . £65 per hundred targets was a tad expensive for my taste. (Entry fee is £130 ).

[a303]

Glad I gave it a miss listening to what people have to say about it.

[Sian]

An absolute joke. I went just for a bit of fun as I was having to use a gun I've never shot before so no big expectations. No balance and lots of edge on, a few eyesight tests with colours/backgrounds. A stand so affected by the wind which was strong today it was closed and us all being given 10/10 on another wind affected stand. I think they changed Sportrap as well a teal which left its trap at about 40 yards, black on bushes/hedges and you couldn't see it for a while was changed to an incomer today! A lot of unhappy shooters. Ice cream was good though.

[jasper682]

Sounds like the shoot should null and void.

[jasper682]

See some guys wanting their money back now.

[Rupert]

Just got back on my sofa after managing to find others to fill our STR slots today and get a refund on them.

Regret committing nearly 900 quid to the whole event,(entries,shells,food,hotels,mileage pool etc etc, It was all as written by Digweed and Faulds, Blue 3 on Thursday was just an eyesight test and Friday totally different .It was hard work even for those of much greater ability than myself.

The whole thing was crackers,like the separate parts were divorced from each other, for the vets and those of lesser mobility they could have put on a shuttle like Sporting targets as it was a fine distance from the ESP to booking in or any food or beverages, Food was shocking, make your own brews and one of the earns was down today SATURDAY the busiest day, a couple of outside caterers offering spuds/pizza chips etc???, the whole thing was permanently deserted. I bet the organizers wanted too much for the privilege. No free drinks or snacks. for 65/100 bad show again..Bearing in the majority of entrants were in hotels overnight, raid the breakfast anybody??. For our overseas visitors im embarrased, some chairs at the start of courses, gazebos?? a considerstion for any spectators, not that i saw. It just looked like a rapists priced event put on with a council house budget.Thats aside from the target issues.

[kenholland]

shot the cpsa 100 bird sporting yesterday, I did put an eighty in but I think it was an awful set up, more rabbit's than on my perm.i shot over 50 no9 shot that's how close they were, my local shoot could put on a better shoot than that last one for me.

[kingo15]

shot the cpsa 100 bird sporting yesterday, I did put an eighty in but I think it was an awful set up, more rabbit's than on my perm.i shot over 50 no9 shot that's how close they were, my local shoot could put on a better shoot than that last one for me.

Loopers,rabbits and going away. It was ok nothing special. Shot a 73 thinking it was going to harder than it was and just kept over leading everything

[figgy]

Been to a few badly organised cpsa events and I'm seriously thinking of not renewing my membership next time, I have BASC as part of my Wildfowling fees so only have cpsa membership for the few bigger comps a year I shoot. Now with high price entries and poor events is it worth booking onto majors.

 

So glad we didn't bother with this shoot.

Edited July 16, 2017 by figgy

[Westley]

Westley,

It isn't over yet , another two days to go .

Plus if you win the main shoot by a good number of targets , you don't carry them over .

You do another 50 bird final shoot on Sunday morning starting with all the other finalists from scratch. The you do a Super Final of 25 targets to keep a virtually none existant crowd entertained . £65 per hundred targets was a tad expensive for my taste. (Entry fee is £130 ).

 

'Booze ups and Breweries' spring to mind !

[Salopian]

Just read this mornings comments.

Apparently at the closing speeches it was mentioned that it was a marvelous , successful event that had received a lot of unfounded negative comments on social media . Actually it was a total disgrace and a fine exhibition of the CPSA's total incompetence. How many of you walked to the Pool shoot only to find that you had to return to the entrance to book a Pool ticket? A total cockup.

[chesterse]

Those who shot well thought it was marvellous, those who shot badly thought it was ****!

[Rupert]

Just read this mornings comments.

Apparently at the closing speeches it was mentioned that it was a marvelous , successful event that had received a lot of unfounded negative comments on social media . Actually it was a total disgrace and a fine exhibition of the CPSA's total incompetence. How many of you walked to the Pool shoot only to find that you had to return to the entrance to book a Pool ticket? A total cockup.

This must be for the STR pool? its just ridiculous, i used the 15 bird pool round past the starshot, was spot on, 6 quid for 15 birds, and absolutely rammed out all weekend, the only thing i could pull it on was the change, why not make it 12 birds and 5 quid or more for a tenner, the lad was scratting about for change all weekend.

[Gordon R]

Those who shot well thought it was marvellous, those who shot badly thought it was ****!

 

 

I think George Digweed's opinion is one which commands attention, no matter who shot what. Are you saying that not one of the criticisms is correct?

[dashman1]

Those who shot well thought it was marvellous, those who shot badly thought it was ****!

I will go with that

[Gordon R]

So, George Digweed is wrong - based on opinions from people who weren't there. Just how does that work?

 

Is there anyone who attended who will refute what George and others said?

[SirDread]

I was there and shot the same 2 days as George did. Here is what I have to say about the event.

 

Car park attendant was enthusiastic that is all.

Sign on tent was tucked away and not very well Identified. No water as part of signon and it was hot on both days so all shooters will have needed a drink at some point.

Received a map of the venue so pretty clear on where you had to go/be etc. On Thursday however the toilets Identified on the map were not there and you had to walk all the way round the back of the star shot to answer nature. 10 minute walk

Catering tent was large enough and plenty of seats and tables however Food options was very limited and when I went to get something on friday lunchtime the queue was large and the catering team were awaiting food cooking. Tea and coffee facilities were there for you to make yourselves but not free.

 

Targets were stiff. No doubt about that and in my personal view one or two were somewhat ridiculous but then am not a AAA shooter nor do I have Georges experience so I accept there will be targets that will cause me problems. I did think the overall layout lacked imagination on the red course. It was somewhat improved on the blue course but the springing teal danger stand was eventually removed.

Sportrap targets were also equally tricky and very challenging with only 9/116 shooters making 20+ on layout 3 on the first day including some top shots. Too stiff However what was unforgivable was it took 20 minutes to fill the traps on layout 2 due to the worker first missing a trap when filling up and then having to wait for layout one to finish so he could gain access to the trap behind the hedgeline. I sat in my car waiting to start. Layout 3 stalled again while a ref decided to top the teal trap up when clearly there was more than enough clays for our rotation. another 7 minute delay. Then onto layout 4, just on our second stand report pairs and the ref from layout 3 stops our rotation so he could remove the cardboard boxes that had blow across his layout. another 5 minutes waiting. Needless to say not conducive to maintaining competitive focus and our squad went downhill from layout 2.

 

The biggest issue with this event was the lack of planning and organisation not the difficulty of the targets. Remember this was a premium event costing £50 per 100 clays. Poor hospitality and catering, poor planning for the weather and the targets, lack of staff (Trap filling I only ever saw the same 2 guys covering 2 courses and a sportrap layout), lack of facilities although the toilets all appeared on the friday. This year I have shot essex masters, english open, worlds in texas, Jack pyke, Benelli championship as well as a number of CPSA registered shoots and by far this was the poorest run event I have attended

[Rupert]

I agree with the above, entry was 130 for the ICTSF event,the central admin refreshment area was five mind brisk walk down hill from the sporting courses, so uphill on way back, any less able vets, and there are a few securing ringside parking at the sporting would have had to go by car to get a coffee, butty, etc the esp pool was prob 3/4 of a mile from the esp ? so unpack, move car repack move again// there should have been a shuttle due to the vast area, having a look round was a hike, and this is not sunday at Catton , get in get shot and home for dinner this is the worlds,

My local club had two golf carts for the oldies and cheeky ******* ant 16/100 there.

 

No complimentary beverages, i heard in the states it was a big golf cart with coolers you just flagged down, this is classy make a statement.The food was dire in variety and being central,miles away, getting a pop while watching ya mates on the str was impossible without missing them shoot, there should have been satellite stations, no faves, 1 ice cream van in the hub, no bins for slab boxes, a 400 shell event? ? the CPsa prelim was a bit steady, a respected big name referred to it as corporate.The red and blue were stiff, red more so on the days i went, Blue 3 on thurs was berserk an eyesight test, watched 3 squads thru most just playing the percentages and barreling the A, some decent lads too. On fri it was chalk and cheese, now wind happens, but it can be planned for, like the sun been going past that bit of sky for 100 million years, The removed stand well safety is a priority,but good planning mitigates most circumstances.

Essex masters, real prizes,real big entry real value,

Even if i had shot my socks off the target and problems would be the same but i would not have made such a fuss,true, the other issues would still be there.

At majors like this, our, and probably same for most,group of famiilar faces are all when you on? where you staying? see you there, there is more to an event like this than the score.

 

I managed to find replacements for our STR slots so will hopefully secure my promised refund tomorrow. I have never bailed on a booked slot before but i just didn't have the heart for it.

 

In all a drove 606 miles

2 nights in hotel

2 nights dinner for 2 people

drinks at the bar

Entries

9 goes on the pool

Lunch on the second day

Packed lunch and snacks for day one and the road trip

Fruity sweeties, cans of pop coffees,

 

Now i was off work as it happens due to a lul in contracts so no lost earnings but still a considerable investment for us.

Now it is notable this year every man and his dog is having a go at a big shoot, Eley, Cheddite,Perazzi,Essex and some more i forget about, now the gods and those who thing they have a chance will always goto the bigger stage the standard might have won my class a couple of time and got a cap in the raffle lads like me,lads who the fiscal success of these events is built on, we have more choice than ever.

Edited July 17, 2017 by Rupert

[chesterse]

With all the adverse comments it's only fair to relate my own experience.

I shot the blue course on the Thursday and the red on the Friday.

I thoroughly enjoyed it, found it to be a tough shoot on the whole.

Would have liked a few more stands rather than the 12 on each course.

We had a great squad of friendly people and had no breakdowns or hold ups.

Yes it was expensive!

Didn't find it being spread out as an issue as drove everywhere.

As for the catering again it was OK for me and although you had to make your own the tea and coffee it was only a £1 and they did have decaff coffee.

Regarding the name check on entry which took about 2 minutes, I think that was a good idea in the times we live in.

I'm A class and finished on 150.

[Gordon R]

I come back to George Digweed's comments. It takes a fair bit for a lad of his stature to put pen to paper in the manner he did.

 

Is he telling the truth - I don't see anyone disputing traps being moved or discounted? Some of the comments make it appear that this is sour grapes from those who didn't shoot well. George's comments and others would appear to go far deeper than poor food and cost of entry.

[Rupert]

George got it bang on

[Hamster]

I spoke to a high up junior who shot it and his view was that it was the worst shoot he'd ever been to.