.243 or 6.5x55 for occasional deer

[al4x]

 

Plenty of Muntjac and masses or Roe round my way but the CWD has still not made it to these parts. Having eaten all 5 of the other deer I have to say Muntjac is my personal favourite with Roe second, which is rather useful as that's what we have most of here. Never shot or eaten a CWD, actually never seen one in the wild, so that may change if I ever get to try one!

 

Do I take it you still have no, or very few Roe, your way al4x?

Nope our area is a little strange, we aren't that far from Woburn yet the cwd are only just making it in this direction and Roe are within 20 miles but just don't seem to come closer. Loads of muntjac and fallow though

[welshwarrior]

I like the 6.5 but for this job a 243 sounds the best solution imho

[Dekers]

Both over kill in that environment a FAC Air Rifle is plenty capable and safer.

As you are so experienced.

.243 100gr Projectile clean broadside lower rib shot ( heart ) say 150yrd on Roe same type of shot on Roe but with a .300 Win-Mag 200gr Projectile which calibre would/will give a cleaner usable carcass

 

:lol:

 

Most of the time people slag off the HMR as underpowered for fox, but here you are suggesting FAC AIR.

 

Anyway, that is a daft and thoroughly inexperienced comment!

 

Please go away, have you done the Site Survey, Risk Assessment, Method Statement, do you know the topography, neighbours or distances etc., etc??

 

I took 5 foxes out last night (between about 60-130 yards) and it should have been 6. In honesty I did make a schoolboy mistake, I had a brilliant shot lined up at the biggest and best condition fox all night, squeezed the trigger, only to find I had left the safety on. By the time I sorted things he had given it legs! First time I have missed a sitter for that reason for about 8-9 years when I left the safety on at a Pheasant shoot.

Edited September 25, 2017 by Dekers

[Dekers]

You haven't changed one single bit have you Deker`s... Even after all these years you still write a load of twaddle when it come`s to choice of calibre`s where Deer Management is concerned..

The 243 is an excellent Fox round which is also adequate for the smaller deer species here in the UK.

However the 6.5 in its various forms is an ideal calibre for all Deer Management.

Whether your a recreational stalker out just a few times a year or even if your working on a semi professional basis like some..

 

Thank you for actually confirming my suggestion of .243!

 

He isn't dealing with ALL deer, Colin was talking about Occasional Roe!

 

There is NOTHING underpowered or inadequate or minimalistic about a .243 on a Roe, they knock them down efficiently and legally with .22 centrefires in Scotland (and so have I), or hadn't you noticed!?!

 

I get the impression that a number of people have read the thread headline but not the opening post.

 

Colin says OCCASIONAL Roe, NOT ALL DEER!

Edited September 25, 2017 by Dekers

[activeviii]

If you go with the .243 Colin then let me know ow and I'll bring over you the brass I have. I bought a load of mixed for John and took 200 for his 243 and load for him. The rest your more then welcome to. If not then I'll bang it up for resale.

 

Between Redgun, John and I we have found that the 100gn pro-hunter to be the best of the bunch. Acceptable shoulder damage for the speed and weight. Fine on foxes. The last batch worked out to 51p a click. Brass was free. But this will change as we have to load develop again as h414 powder will discontinue soon.

 

We use to run 55gn varmageddon in Neil's and mine but it's a trade off. Very very explosive round and as good as point and shoot on fox to 350 yards but wind was the pain in the butt on the lighter bullets, as was the barrle life. Shoot the light, fast bullet and barrel life will half. If your going second hand then that would concern me a little as you don't know ow the history of the bore.

 

The swede, I use to run 95 gn V-Max for fox but again barrle life was the concern as its my every day bread and butter rifle so I'm sticking with the 140gn interlocks and deer with the odd fox. My triple is my fox gun really.

 

This looks a very long thread, I stopped reading most of the comments but dekers is just about on the money from what I did read, lots of" I shoot this calibre and I'm dam well going to defend my reason too". Which we are all untitled to, but it dosent really help you in you quest. We can only really give you what we know on what we have used for for a while in the field. As you know ow, between Neil and i, there isn't really much out there we haven't put a beating on. Both have settled on the swede, both have used the .243, only reason for the 6.5 is the .243 is splatty and dealers are wanting clean shot carcuss, for you I don't think it's a problem as you 100% Neal with your own shot game and know how to work a knife around the shot site.

 

Bit of a topsy turvy post but laid up again and just rambling on.

[6.5x55SE]

 

:lol:

 

Most of the time people slag off the HMR as underpowered for fox, but here you are suggesting FAC AIR.

 

Anyway, that is a daft and thoroughly inexperienced comment!

 

I take it you are referring to yourself as inspite of you thinking you know it all trust me you don't as for my statement it is not daft or from a inexperienced shooter in fact id bet ive got/ had more experience than yourself .

[colin lad]

Shame Kent is no longer here

he would of given the only answer to matter

 

colin

 

what has happened to him

Edited September 25, 2017 by colin lad

[welshwarrior]

he would of given the only answer to matter

 

colin

 

what has happened to him

Bored himself to death

[lancer425]

 

Thank you for actually confirming my suggestion of .243!

 

He isn't dealing with ALL deer, Colin was talking about Occasional Roe!

 

There is NOTHING underpowered or inadequate or minimalistic about a .243 on a Roe, they knock them down efficiently and legally with .22 centrefires in Scotland (and so have I), or hadn't you noticed!?!

 

I get the impression that a number of people have read the thread headline but not the opening post.

 

Colin says OCCASIONAL Roe, NOT ALL DEER!

I have shot over a hundred Reds and nearly as many again sika with a .223, that the .243 was not capable of killing roe was never in question. What was in question is why use a .243 as an occasional roe rifle when the other rifle in the equalisation is more versatile and offers the purchaser more options should they arise in the future.

As you mention the OP which i did read Colin says he has 204 and .222 so it is not even that the .243 offers him anything he has not already got well covered on fox and vermin.

The 6.5 not only has the occasional roe in its remit it has the other advantages if required and with no compromise whatsoever .

If he had no .222 or 204 this would leave me recommending the .243 not because the 6.5 is not capable as a fox and vermin rifle just that it fits in neater as a vermin to deer round . in this case though the 6.5 has the high ground .

[Christian Sutton]

Lancer our Dekers isn't the sharpest for forward thinking. He gets too carried away with his keyboard nonsense

Now Colin what im about to write read it real slow like chap..

If it so happens that you do take a keen interest in Deer Management?

Instead of the occasional one or two a year like some and you wish to book a mornings stalking with me.

The minimum calibre that I allow clients to use is 6.5 calibre firing a projectile of no less than 120grains..

[activeviii]

Don't worry Colin, we will allow the minimum legal deer calibre if you wish you go for a few as a 243 will meet all legal requirements. Lmao

[al4x]

This gets better and better only allowing clients to use a 6.5 come on....... most that take your money are just happy if you can hit a barn door....

[team tractor]

I'm limited on my land to 243 so that's what I have

[colin lad]

Lancer our Dekers isn't the sharpest for forward thinking. He gets too carried away with his keyboard nonsense

Now Colin what im about to write read it real slow like chap..

If it so happens that you do take a keen interest in Deer Management?

Instead of the occasional one or two a year like some and you wish to book a mornings stalking with me.

The minimum calibre that I allow clients to use is 6.5 calibre firing a projectile of no less than 120grains..

i did say in my earlier post i shoot plenty muntjac and cwd each year and have the odd roe starting to appear and that i don't go on paid stalks or travel to others places as it not my thing, i have more shooting than i would ever need within 20 miles of me so no point travelling to pay for shooting when i have as much free shooting that i could ever want,

i have taken about a dozen members of pigeon watch out cwd stalking free of course and all but a couple have offered me fee roe stalking in return but like i say not my thing but thanks for the offer

 

colin

Edited September 25, 2017 by colin lad

[Christian Sutton]

This gets better and better only allowing clients to use a 6.5 come on....... most that take your money are just happy if you can hit a barn door....

 

So things are not taken out of context.. The minimum bullet weight that I`d allow is 120grain right up to a 220g and that`s in any calibre that propel those projectile weights.

If your only allowed up to a certain calibre on a specific piece of ground then there`s probably a good reason.

Anyway good luck to all those that only shoot the occasional one

Edited September 25, 2017 by Christian Sutton

[Dougy]

Entertaining read.

 

Sounds like you have to have a 243 because that's what most people have. Apparently :-)

Good for fox and all deer species in the UK.

I don't have one personally and am wondering now how on earth I get to actually shoot anything at all.

 

I see a variation coming in. Lol

[suburban shooter]

I was watching University Challenge but it lost out over this discussion and that new gladiator programme probably has lower testosterone levels as well !

 

Has anyone got any advice about a good all round deer calibre that doesn't have to take reds

 

 

 

Only joking but a future question that I will be asking.

[Hendrix's rifle]

i did say in my earlier post i shoot plenty muntjac and cwd each year and have the odd roe starting to appear and that i don't go on paid stalks or travel to others places as it not my thing, i have more shooting than i would ever need within 20 miles of me so no point travelling to pay for shooting when i have as much free shooting that i could ever want,

i have taken about a dozen members of pigeon watch out cwd stalking free of course and all but a couple have offered me fee roe stalking in return but like i say not my thing but thanks for the offer

 

colin

What ever is going cheap (within your budget) and does the job you want it to do. Be it 243, 6.5, 270... take your pick!

[scotslad]

I have shot over a hundred Reds and nearly as many again sika with a .223, that the .243 was not capable of killing roe was never in question. What was in question is why use a .243 as an occasional roe rifle when the other rifle in the equalisation is more versatile and offers the purchaser more options should they arise in the future.

As you mention the OP which i did read Colin says he has 204 and .222 so it is not even that the .243 offers him anything he has not already got well covered on fox and vermin.

The 6.5 not only has the occasional roe in its remit it has the other advantages if required and with no compromise whatsoever .

If he had no .222 or 204 this would leave me recommending the .243 not because the 6.5 is not capable as a fox and vermin rifle just that it fits in neater as a vermin to deer round . in this case though the 6.5 has the high ground .

 

Out of courosity where were u shooting all these red and sika with a 223?

 

A lot of hinds are culled in Scotland with 22.250's but not exactly legal.

 

It really won't make a blind bit if difference wot u choose.

 

Woud anyone mind/know if they fell over with ur 222?

Otherwise u can bet when ur out for munties with ur 222 u will be tripping over roe only never to see them when u have the 'big gun'

 

 

As I've already said I think all the smaller 3 calibres are far to close together to justify the expense for me, and the 6.5 is only a slight gain in bullet wieghts if u do fancy a slightly larger calibre (with a new mod) I'd go even bigger (270/308), stilla variation, new mod and again plenty of choice of 2nd hand rifles

As for meat damage, while calibre can make a difference so does bullet type/choice and placement.

Generally a bigger slower bullet will cause less damage than a faster lighter 1 esp if highly fragible

[lancer425]

 

Out of courosity where were u shooting all these red and sika with a 223?

 

A lot of hinds are culled in Scotland with 22.250's but not exactly legal.

 

It really won't make a blind bit if difference wot u choose.

 

Woud anyone mind/know if they fell over with ur 222?

Otherwise u can bet when ur out for munties with ur 222 u will be tripping over roe only never to see them when u have the 'big gun'

 

 

As I've already said I think all the smaller 3 calibres are far to close together to justify the expense for me, and the 6.5 is only a slight gain in bullet wieghts if u do fancy a slightly larger calibre (with a new mod) I'd go even bigger (270/308), stilla variation, new mod and again plenty of choice of 2nd hand rifles

As for meat damage, while calibre can make a difference so does bullet type/choice and placement.

Generally a bigger slower bullet will cause less damage than a faster lighter 1 esp if highly fragible

New Zealand we were resident there for ten years my sister still lives in Masterton we visit her every year her bloke is a keen hunter.

[Dekers]

I have shot over a hundred Reds and nearly as many again sika with a .223, that the .243 was not capable of killing roe was never in question. What was in question is why use a .243 as an occasional roe rifle when the other rifle in the equalisation is more versatile and offers the purchaser more options should they arise in the future.

As you mention the OP which i did read Colin says he has 204 and .222 so it is not even that the .243 offers him anything he has not already got well covered on fox and vermin.

The 6.5 not only has the occasional roe in its remit it has the other advantages if required and with no compromise whatsoever .

If he had no .222 or 204 this would leave me recommending the .243 not because the 6.5 is not capable as a fox and vermin rifle just that it fits in neater as a vermin to deer round . in this case though the 6.5 has the high ground .

 

Colin didn't ask for ALL deer or any other eventuality that may arise in anyones mind in the future.

 

He asked for a calibre for Occasional Roe!

[Dekers]

I have shot over a hundred Reds and nearly as many again sika with a .223, that the .243 was not capable of killing roe was never in question. What was in question is why use a .243 as an occasional roe rifle when the other rifle in the equalisation is more versatile and offers the purchaser more options should they arise in the future.

As you mention the OP which i did read Colin says he has 204 and .222 so it is not even that the .243 offers him anything he has not already got well covered on fox and vermin.

The 6.5 not only has the occasional roe in its remit it has the other advantages if required and with no compromise whatsoever .

If he had no .222 or 204 this would leave me recommending the .243 not because the 6.5 is not capable as a fox and vermin rifle just that it fits in neater as a vermin to deer round . in this case though the 6.5 has the high ground .

 

:hmm:

 

So Reds and Sika Fall down with a .223 but Colin needs a 6.5 for Occasional Roe?!

[lancer425]

 

:hmm:

 

So Reds and Sika Fall down with a .223 but Colin needs a 6.5 for Occasional Roe?!

I have tried throughout this thread to put across the point that the OP has 204 and 222 the .243 is close to what he has the 6.5 offers him more, and with zero disadvantages it can work at 10 yards or 400.

Its not the calibre of the weapon that makes a good deer culler but the calibre of the bloke shooting it, anything will kill anything with reservations ancient man used spears clubs and bow hunting is awesome in most country’s but ours its in another class in fact.

The hunt is what you make it how close are you good enough to get how close do you want to get do you want long shots only, have you broken your leg your in plaster where can you get to take a shot .

The bush is a very different environment to deepest darkest Bedfordshire .222 was the round of choice for the old culler’s for good reason it worked in the bush close cheap to load .

if it were legal in Bedfordshire to take Roe he could use it, but its not, and even if it was legal i still would not recommend it for Roe there. its not about what any given calibre can do its about making choices and i happen to believe if you agree with me or not that of the two options the 6.5 offers the OP the best of those two choices, and none of your rhetoric or stoic resolve will steer me away from that choice.

I must say 6.5 would not be my choice for Colin if i could pick any round for his occasional roe but he never asked for other suggestions.

[Dougy]

The thing is with so many choices of caliber, we all have our favorites , those that we chose at the time are the ones we usually recommend to fellow shooters, or in this case anyone who asks for an opinion.

 

An we all know what we think about opinions, every one seems to have one, and some of course have bigger ones than anyone else. And thats life.

 

 

But if it were my choice I would say get a 30.06, they really are the best, but then it may be a 9.3 jury's out on that till mid November, i will get back to you on that.

[lancer425]

The thing is with so many choices of caliber, we all have our favorites , those that we chose at the time are the ones we usually recommend to fellow shooters, or in this case anyone who asks for an opinion.

 

An we all know what we think about opinions, every one seems to have one, and some of course have bigger ones than anyone else. And thats life.

 

 

But if it were my choice I would say get a 30.06, they really are the best, but then it may be a 9.3 jury's out on that till mid November, i will get back to you on that.

Of course you are right and having choice is good and experience to make those choices even better, your 3006 is so well known few will be strangers to its ability it is a very good versatile round for anywhere with a broad range of uses.

9.362 no experience with them, but i have had extensive use of a similar round in the smaller .35 whelen which i happen to be incredibly fond of its a potent performer with a gentle nature and a joy to shoot i kind of get the feeling the 9.3.62 should be similar in nature i think you will be pleased with your choice.

Speaking of choices, brings me to suggest to colin another round for is assessment, the .708 because .708s are simply brilliant deer rifles ideal for roe or any kind of stalking in the uk.

And NO i do not own or ever have owned a.708.