Doctor Refuses Medical Report

[panoma1]

1 hour ago, toontastic said:

I must live in a different universe to most other people. I got a letter from Northumbria police notifying me my SGC/FAC were due to run out in 12 weeks, I filled in the forms sent them off got a visit about 5 weeks later, feo turns up with my paperwork including letter from doctor saying no problems then 1 week later new docs arrive 6 weeks before old ones expire. 

Your lucky judging by other people's comments! Some don't even get a notice of expiry letter, some have to pay for a GP's letter, some, if their certificate runs out, are told by the police to lodge their guns with a RFD, some are refused or don't get a Sect 7 notice, some, if they don't send their renewal in by an arbitrary date decided by the police, prior to certificate expiry, won't be offered an extension or a Sect 7 notice....some forces make up rules to suit themselves some drag their feet....because they can............and I'm sure there are other problems? The hurdles we are made to jump over seem endless!

[scottie2345]

I am in Leics, the team there are awesome,

Put in for my renewal 2 weeks ago, I received a letter from the Docs yesterday demanding £48 blackmail money,

I emailed firearms this morning at 06.30 and they called me back at 07.50, I was mighty impressed, especially when they said not to pay it, the FEO will want me to sign a statement when he calls, that was it, simples 🙂

 

Scottie

[JohnfromUK]

On 13/02/2019 at 12:49, toontastic said:

I must live in a different universe to most other people. I got a letter from Northumbria police notifying me my SGC/FAC were due to run out in 12 weeks, I filled in the forms sent them off got a visit about 5 weeks later, feo turns up with my paperwork including letter from doctor saying no problems then 1 week later new docs arrive 6 weeks before old ones expire. 

Good to hear that at least some forces (above and below) are giving a sensible service.  Most seem a shambles presided over by arrogant and overpaid Chief Constables obsessed with 'statistics and management' and not providing a decent policing service..

6 hours ago, scottie2345 said:

I am in Leics, the team there are awesome,

Put in for my renewal 2 weeks ago, I received a letter from the Docs yesterday demanding £48 blackmail money,

I emailed firearms this morning at 06.30 and they called me back at 07.50, I was mighty impressed, especially when they said not to pay it, the FEO will want me to sign a statement when he calls, that was it, simples

 

[oowee]

28 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

Good to hear that at least some forces (above and below) are giving a sensible service.  Most seem a shambles presided over by arrogant and overpaid Chief Constables obsessed with 'statistics and management' and not providing a decent policing service..

The last FELWG meeting would not agree to the payment of full cost recovery for the licencing process until the system is improved. The system is currently under resourced and not a priority for some forces, so not improving. Looks like we have a bit of a stalemate? 

[bluesj]

8 minutes ago, oowee said:

The last FELWG meeting would not agree to the payment of full cost recovery for the licencing process until the system is improved. The system is currently under resourced and not a priority for some forces, so not improving. Looks like we have a bit of a stalemate? 

As the licensing system was put in place to protect the public the public should cover some of the cost, having a license doesn't help me any.

If it was a case of you pay for your license go through the checks and then could get what you wanted or change it without having to get permission  from the police that might be different. why should I have to jump through hoops to get the tools to do my job and pay for it as well.

[oowee]

4 minutes ago, bluesj said:

As the licensing system was put in place to protect the public the public should cover some of the cost, having a license doesn't help me any.

If it was a case of you pay for your license go through the checks and then could get what you wanted or change it without having to get permission  from the police that might be different. why should I have to jump through hoops to get the tools to do my job and pay for it as well.

I wouldn't disagree with that at all. Seems to me that in more ways than one it is a system not fit for purpose. Not only do we have inconsistent delivery but its compounded by different approaches in different constabularies. Add to that all the stuff that just seems to me to make no sense at all, licencing of moderators and the treatment of variations are just two that come to mind. 

[Rim Fire]

What gets me is the Firearms department are telling applicants it is a new law when it isn't . They told my mate if he didn't get the medical report within 21 days they would not be able to process his renewell . Now this wasn't about payment  it was about the surgery not supplying the medical records are  these people who are processing your application forms  being told it is a new law and know no difference this is where the orgs should be stepping in and making sure they know it is not the law to demand a medical report       

[Major Sharpe]

I know this is slightly off topic, but the whole process is painful. This is what happened to me.

 

Because I put down I had stress some time in the past I disclosed it, but the Doctor sent a letter saying I had no issues to disclose. This in itself caused a problem.

I wrote the following on another forum back in October and have pasted it here for interest.

 

As we know, when you apply for FAC, the police contact your Doctor for a basic report on your health. Often a charge is made by the Doctor for this service.

On my application form, I disclosed stress, (it was a month period in 2010) which I felt was appropriate as stress was listed as a condition on the list of 'you must tell us about' conditions. However the Doctor sent a letter to the police saying that there was no evidence of any of the conditions listed. A huge discrepancy, which now means I have to pay again to get a full report.

The FEO told me over the phone that she needed a fuller report because I disclosed stress,
I therefore contacted the Practice Manager in advance and he suggested that he print off my medical record for that time period and I present that to the FEO.

Although this gave the FEO a very clear picture, she was not able to accept it as a report.

On the basis of this I arranged a meeting with the Practice Manager to discuss the process and get some clarity.
He told me that when they are contacted by police for firearm/shotgun applications, they look on the computer, at the patients front page of their file. On this page it shows any major illness that is ongoing or if long term medication is prescribed. If no condition on there is of concern regarding owning a firearm, they search the last five appointments to see if anything shows up there. If there is nothing of concern they send a standard form back saying there is no evidence of any condition etc.
This is why an historical condition that is no longer current will not be disclosed by them. This is common practice and fits with the Medical Council guide lines.

Another point to note is terminology used on police forms and by the Doctors. I thought I had stress, but my record states 'stress-like symptoms' therefore there is debate as to whether I had it or not. The police form asks about Acute Stress, I had no idea if I had Acute Stress or Stress or that there were different types. The Practice Manager says that Acute Stress is serious and can take some considerable time to recover from and that was not what I had.

He suggested that it would be wise for applicants to discuss with their Doctor the application before it is sent, so that the applicant knows what the Doctor will say.

He is going to get the Doctor to complete another report for me, and send it to the FEO, answering the four questions listed. There will be a charge for this he tells me, an invoice will arrive in due course for £35. Although he was going to look at reducing this as the process has been so messy.

Sorry this is long winded but it may save others grief in the long term.

 

I was never charged for the second letter.

[JohnfromUK]

What you say all makes sense and whilst not a good experience, seems to reflect what is actually happening on the ground.  I think you took a sensible considered path and that in itself should be a 'plus point'.  For me - there would be a significant problem when it comes to this bit;

7 minutes ago, Major Sharpe said:

He suggested that it would be wise for applicants to discuss with their Doctor the application before it is sent, so that the applicant knows what the Doctor will say.

When I book an appointment, because I only tend to go when something is needed fairly urgently, I only get to see whatever locum is in and has free appointments on that day.  To get an appointment with a 'named' Doctor is difficult/impossible and only seems to happen in 'ongoing matters'.  My own nominated Doctor and I have never met.  He is the senior partner and I think is just a 'nominal point of continuity' to be named - I think when my previous Doctor retired the present head of practice inherited the patients.  My contact with the practice is nearly always with one of the practice nurses (for annual blood tests for statin use issues and cholesterol levels), or an occasional 'emergency appointment' when I have been taken ill suddenly or have had an accident (sprains etc.) which has usually been with a locum.

I can fully understand the Practice being very reluctant to have Doctor's time taken up in discussing 'non issues' (to them) simply because the Police are being pedantic.  With Doctors in short supply, I can see their point.

[Major Sharpe]

3 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

What you say all makes sense and whilst not a good experience, seems to reflect what is actually happening on the ground.  I think you took a sensible considered path and that in itself should be a 'plus point'.  For me - there would be a significant problem when it comes to this bit;

When I book an appointment, because I only tend to go when something is needed fairly urgently, I only get to see whatever locum is in and has free appointments on that day.  To get an appointment with a 'named' Doctor is difficult/impossible and only seems to happen in 'ongoing matters'.  My own nominated Doctor and I have never met.  He is the senior partner and I think is just a 'nominal point of continuity' to be named - I think when my previous Doctor retired the present head of practice inherited the patients.  My contact with the practice is nearly always with one of the practice nurses (for annual blood tests for statin use issues and cholesterol levels), or an occasional 'emergency appointment' when I have been taken ill suddenly or have had an accident (sprains etc.) which has usually been with a locum.

I can fully understand the Practice being very reluctant to have Doctor's time taken up in discussing 'non issues' (to them) simply because the Police are being pedantic.  With Doctors in short supply, I can see their point.

The current system is not ideal for anyone. The Practice Manager said it can all be very time consuming and they want to do the right thing by their patients. I too never see my Doctor so they don't know me personally. Therefore 'Someone' looks at the computer and goes with that.

I live in a rural area and my practice gets a lot of these requests.

[kaunda]

Out of interest; when an applicant does pay,to whom does he/she make out the cheque ? To Dr.Dolittle or to the Practice ?

[JohnfromUK]

7 minutes ago, kaunda said:

Out of interest; when an applicant does pay,to whom does he/she make out the cheque ? To Dr.Dolittle or to the Practice ?

II didn't pay, but I did have a request for payment - which I declined to pay on BASC's advice.  The payment was to have been to the Practice.

[butchdickason]

I paid,  I was not prepared to take the risk that the Doctors  letter would delay my renewal,the payment was to the practice.   

[mossy835]

the more that pay, and go against basc advice,then it could become law i never payed,and they sent me a letter.

[Scully]

6 hours ago, Major Sharpe said:

I know this is slightly off topic, but the whole process is painful. This is what happened to me.

 

Because I put down I had stress some time in the past I disclosed it, but the Doctor sent a letter saying I had no issues to disclose. This in itself caused a problem.

I wrote the following on another forum back in October and have pasted it here for interest.

 

As we know, when you apply for FAC, the police contact your Doctor for a basic report on your health. Often a charge is made by the Doctor for this service.

On my application form, I disclosed stress, (it was a month period in 2010) which I felt was appropriate as stress was listed as a condition on the list of 'you must tell us about' conditions. However the Doctor sent a letter to the police saying that there was no evidence of any of the conditions listed. A huge discrepancy, which now means I have to pay again to get a full report.

The FEO told me over the phone that she needed a fuller report because I disclosed stress,
I therefore contacted the Practice Manager in advance and he suggested that he print off my medical record for that time period and I present that to the FEO.

Although this gave the FEO a very clear picture, she was not able to accept it as a report.

On the basis of this I arranged a meeting with the Practice Manager to discuss the process and get some clarity.
He told me that when they are contacted by police for firearm/shotgun applications, they look on the computer, at the patients front page of their file. On this page it shows any major illness that is ongoing or if long term medication is prescribed. If no condition on there is of concern regarding owning a firearm, they search the last five appointments to see if anything shows up there. If there is nothing of concern they send a standard form back saying there is no evidence of any condition etc.
This is why an historical condition that is no longer current will not be disclosed by them. This is common practice and fits with the Medical Council guide lines.

Another point to note is terminology used on police forms and by the Doctors. I thought I had stress, but my record states 'stress-like symptoms' therefore there is debate as to whether I had it or not. The police form asks about Acute Stress, I had no idea if I had Acute Stress or Stress or that there were different types. The Practice Manager says that Acute Stress is serious and can take some considerable time to recover from and that was not what I had.

He suggested that it would be wise for applicants to discuss with their Doctor the application before it is sent, so that the applicant knows what the Doctor will say.

He is going to get the Doctor to complete another report for me, and send it to the FEO, answering the four questions listed. There will be a charge for this he tells me, an invoice will arrive in due course for £35. Although he was going to look at reducing this as the process has been so messy.

Sorry this is long winded but it may save others grief in the long term.

 

I was never charged for the second letter.

Interesting post.