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nabbers

Side by Side stock repair

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Try putting a ten pound note across the face and see if the gun closes. Quick test to see if it off its face. 

You crack on and enjoy doing it, I'm sure you'll test the gun in a safe manner before putting it to your face and shooting it. I've shot guns in the past that rattled. People who owned them said been like that for years still works, so they just carried on.

Edited by figgy

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Thanks Figgy, might also try the smoke test shown in that great video up the thread.   
Yep value my face, eyes and fingers so will make certain all is right before shooting it.

 

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22 minutes ago, nabbers said:

Thanks Figgy, might also try the smoke test shown in that great video up the thread.   
Yep value my face, eyes and fingers so will make certain all is right before shooting it.

 

You could just put a shim in to tighten it up strip of metal cut from a coke can unless you have access to some of the shim stuff we used in the old days on drive shafts 

wasn’t having a pop at your work or what you were doing was just looking at it from the other side 

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Put a slot in the stock which will be totally hidden by the trigger guard.  Its about 75mm x 6mm x 40mm and I've made a new section out some Elm that fits in the slot.  

 

I've used more of the West System epoxy to lock the new tenon in place.  This is now stronger than the original, I'm happy that it is a solid repair.   Off to Holmfirth next to find some checkering tools so I can sharpen up the checkering and I'm hoping that will blend in the repair joint making it less obvious, but at the end of the day, its a very old gun the the break is part of its story.

 

 

 

 

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Edited by nabbers

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I've also started removing some re-bluing that has been done.   The action was blued which seemed odd to me, I've trawled the net for pictures of Rosson Hammer guns and nit found any with blued action so I thought I would see what the finish is like below.   I used warm apple cider vinegar and dipped the side locks and the action in it.   The action is polished clean steel, with some case hardening evident so I think it should stay un-blued.    The Sidelocks are a duller iron like finish, so maybe they would have been blued?  Or perhaps just polished.

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Great repair and strong I am sure. I have seen a similar repair done with a “bow tie” type of insert which was extremely strong when glued up. I am sure that the joint has a name but it escapes me for now. Looking forward to the end result pictures 

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Impala59, no room for that here with such a thin bit of stock between the pockets for the locks but that would be a nice solution if there is room.  I’ve now temporarily replaced locks and action whilst waiting on checkering  tools and also tightened up the headache the gun had using the 2lb hammer method, and it also closes “like a safe”.  Trigger guard has gone to be repaired with silver solder weld on a break.  Next issue is the bead, it’s wavy indicating a poir previous repair or maybe rust under it? Any thoughts anyone?

Edited by nabbers

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I have used on occasion a radio control car ball joint (they come with an M3 thread with a 3,4,or 5mm ball, cheap on the 'bay) allen screws, (put in a drill and file the head to desired shape, screw in place then fill the hex drive with epoxy) and one time a simple piece of brass rod, rounded and silver soldered in place. With modern glues even a .177 bb would work. Depends on the size that you want of course.

1X(For HSP Racing 1/16 Scale RC Car Spare Parts 4P M5 Ball Head Screws 8608 Y9H9

Edited by impala59

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Sorry meant rib not bead.....just desoldered it as it was very loose and there is a lot of surface rust under it which is why it had detached itself midway.  I saw you test for a loose rib by seeing if the barrels  ring like a bell when you tap them with something metal, these didn’t!  I can linish  the under side of the rib to remove rust, barrels will have to be cleaned with emery cloth.  Just shows what could be lurking in any sxs under the rib! Go check yours chaps!

4F702962-64AA-47C4-9CF3-25D87E218912.jpeg

Edited by nabbers

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the barrells need to be resolded by a gunmaker............

de-assembled

cleaned within an inch of their life

wired together and set

and then soldered

not something you would do at home.........

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18 minutes ago, nabbers said:

Sorry meant rib not bead.....just desoldered it as it was very loose and there is a lot of surface rust under it which is why it had detached itself midway.  I saw you test for a loose rib by seeing if the barrels  ring like a bell when you tap them with something metal, these didn’t!  I can linish  the under side of the rib to remove rust, barrels will have to be cleaned with emery cloth.  Just shows what could be lurking in any sxs under the rib! Go check yours chaps!

4F702962-64AA-47C4-9CF3-25D87E218912.jpeg

Same can be lurking in a over and under they have ribs just on the side 

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2 minutes ago, ditchman said:

the barrells need to be resolded by a gunmaker............

There speaks the voice of experience !

I have had the process explained to me in great detail by a barrel maker, prior to me attempting to sleeve a double .410. Despite following his advice to the letter and having all the necessary tooling and equipment to hand, I ended up with a `satisfactory` bottom rib and a top rib that had a number of lumps, bumps and wavy lines in.  My friendly barrel man had a good chuckle when I showed him the result of several hours work. I admitted defeat and he kindly struck off the bottom rib to make it look presentable and removed and relaid the top rib leaving me the job of removing the excess solder. He then cut the chambers and the gun passed proof.

Having tried it (once), I am with ditchman. This is not a job that can be done over the kitchen sink and having the onset of rust between the barrels and rib just makes the job more prone to problems.

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Well done JJsDad for having a go!   Nothing will dissuade me from having a go too, I'm not burning any bridges, if the repair doesn't work, it can easily be de-soldered and done by an expert, but there is no money in the budget for that.    There's a pretty good video online by Larry who featured in the video posted above on this thread and I reckon that if I can straighten out the rib which already had a buckle in it  and remove all the rust then I can solder it back in place just fine.  I do worry about the effect of leaving flux residue in the void under the rib if I follow Larry's method. Maybe that's a reason why the area rusts?  Done plenty of plumbing and some lead burning in my time so whilst I've never soldered steel to steel, now is the time to have a go! 

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57 minutes ago, London Best said:

For pity’s sake, will you finally scrap it?

Always an option, but learning about how these are put together and facing the challenges of a restoration are all far more interesting.

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I think you are fine trying to see how it’s put together....stripping it down and trying to repair/improve it aesthetically! But I would caution against firing it even when it’s reassembled to your satisfaction!.....

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does it need reproofing once you have done it ?

will you make a furnace to heat the whole length evenly......

Edited by ditchman

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Definitely a job for a gunsmith in my opinion. Those barrels look pretty rusty under the rib which must impact on wall thicknesses.

I wonder what Gunman on here has to say. He’s the expert.

OB

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16 minutes ago, Old Boggy said:

I wonder what Gunman on here has to say.

I should think he is hiding under the duvet and shaking his head at where this is going. However, if `nabbers` wants to give it a go, good luck to him. I have worked in engineering all my life including an apprenticeship and thought with some guidance from an expert I would give it a try. I didnt have rusty surfaces to contend with as I used new sleeving tubes and the rib was free of corrosion on its underside. The biggest problem was the rib distorting during the soldering process, try as I may, I couldnt get the rib to smoothly follow the contours of the barrels as I ran the torch and solder along the length of the rib. The bottom rib (probably because it was flat) strangely went on ok.

Anyway,  having tried it and found myself wanting, I watch nabbers reports with interest.

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The same issues could be lurking under that perfectly looking rib on your own gun, especially if it has any age to it.  The good news is the rust has cleaned off The barrels  nicely, it was mainly crud that cleaned right off.  The makers have scribed a little channel for the rib to sit in which should make lining it up easier.  The rib has one defective  area that means it would never be perfect unless I get that area welded up and ground down, it’s worth doing I think. JjsDad is correct, the challenge will be not buckling the rib as it expands under the heat applied to melt the solder.   Structurally I can’t see if a piece of metal soldered to two barrels adds any strength? I doubt it, and what looks such an integral part of the gun is pretty much cosmetic other than being essential for aim. Going to hit the American forums to find out what specification of solder would be best unless anyone here knows? 

Edited by nabbers

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Wire brush the rust off and see what you have.

Silver solder is better than plumbing solder.

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