HantsRob Posted October 6, 2021 Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 So, following from my other thread on not reloading the steel carts once shot, I actually emailed a number of companies asking why you can't reload. I actually got a sensible reply from one company! I have asked to quote them, however whilst they were happy with the content sharing they didn't want to be mentioned in name or brand which I shall honour. Quote Cartridge cases can basically be made in two ways. Standard cases are made of a tube, a base wad and a metal head which is formed around these and holds them together. Compression formed cases have the case and base wad moulded in one piece using high resilience plastics with the metal head then attached. The latter are very expensive to manufacture and are often found in loads in the USA where reloading is not uncommon and the case is tough enough to withstand it. They are very robust - I used to reload Remington and Winchester compression formed cases as a student to save money ! Standard cases are best shot once as reloading and firing them again runs the risk of the case separating from the head due to the method of manufacturing. This also does help potentially answer why American shooters ask why the UK don't reload more, and certainly a higher cost of shell that's cheaper to reload would partially explain it. So..... having shot this brand that replied and can agree they produce a nice standard shell, their affordability through cheaper production methods render their cases unsuitable for reload. In our market where many (most?) don't reload, a lower price point is definitely what the market wants! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceWelder Posted October 6, 2021 Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 Nice share! I was given a lee loadall 2 about 6 years ago by a good friend of mine and Im yet to use it, not for lack of desire tho, it seems that every time i sit down and try to find cheap enough components i end up getting angry and swearing alot before forgetting about the whole idea of reloading for another 6months lol I wonder if theres a way to easily tell which type of cartridge is which? Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted October 6, 2021 Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 I reload 410 cases and now only Fiocchi BUT only once. I was recently witness to what you desribe when case heads separated and it was obvious the cases had been reloaded numerous times. I have never had a case head separate and have shot my reloads now for six years. Certainly with 410 then my advise is use Fiocchi and reload the cases just once. I buy a slab of Fiocchi just to replace them and also have one or two kind friends who save their cases for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted October 6, 2021 Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 Resizing should keep the case integrity. I only ever reload once though because the crimps can begin to split and cause problems. 9 minutes ago, SpaceWelder said: Nice share! I was given a lee loadall 2 about 6 years ago by a good friend of mine and Im yet to use it, not for lack of desire tho, it seems that every time i sit down and try to find cheap enough components i end up getting angry and swearing alot before forgetting about the whole idea of reloading for another 6months lol I wonder if theres a way to easily tell which type of cartridge is which? Cheers! If you look inside a shell the compression formed ones are one piece but the parallel tube type have a base wad which is like a thick washer seated in the bottom. Virtually all UK cases are parallel tube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted October 6, 2021 Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 The only time I've had a base seperate was in a Hatsan pump trying to eject the cartridge but in all fairness the gun was rubbish. I've reloaded probably tens of 1000s of shells. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HantsRob Posted October 6, 2021 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 15 minutes ago, SpaceWelder said: Nice share! I was given a lee loadall 2 about 6 years ago by a good friend of mine and Im yet to use it, not for lack of desire tho, it seems that every time i sit down and try to find cheap enough components i end up getting angry and swearing alot before forgetting about the whole idea of reloading for another 6months lol I wonder if theres a way to easily tell which type of cartridge is which? Cheers! Welcome aboard and great first post Move to 10 gauge or another rare gauge and the price of reloading will become worthwhile! I'd love a go at reloading, just can't see a cost benefit for 12g! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceWelder Posted October 6, 2021 Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 7 minutes ago, sitsinhedges said: Resizing should keep the case integrity. I only ever reload once though because the crimps can begin to split and cause problems. If you look inside a shell the compression formed ones are one piece but the parallel tube type have a base wad which is like a thick washer seated in the bottom. Virtually all UK cases are parallel tube. Good info, I was going to say I bet they're ok to reload once without a problem, but reloading them multiple times might just be asking for trouble. 1 minute ago, HantsRob said: Welcome aboard and great first post Move to 10 gauge or another rare gauge and the price of reloading will become worthwhile! I'd love a go at reloading, just can't see a cost benefit for 12g! Thanks! I shall one day delve into the big boy gauges but unfortunately I've already had to dismantle 2 of my guns just to fit them all in the safe. I've a talent for buying absolute BARGAIN guns (at least, that's what my wife thinks) but unfortunately i'll never make a good salesman so they just keep building up.....poor me whatever will i do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enfieldspares Posted October 6, 2021 Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 Most cases used in the UK by the major cartridge makers aren't brass headed either. They are steel headed with a brass wash. The best quality cases are, as others also know, American cases for the reasons noted. Those and the fact that the brass head really is brass and not steel with a brass wash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceWelder Posted October 6, 2021 Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 17 minutes ago, enfieldspares said: Most cases used in the UK by the major cartridge makers aren't brass headed either. They are steel headed with a brass wash. The best quality cases are, as others also know, American cases for the reasons noted. Those and the fact that the brass head really is brass and not steel with a brass wash. Begs the question how American manufacturers are able to use real brass, better quality cases and still charge less than we pay! (especially as of march this year what the bloody hell!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wharf Rat Posted October 6, 2021 Report Share Posted October 6, 2021 I've used Kent Velocity for 'odd' shot sizes before, as the ultra thin plastic allows you to see the shot through it (good for buck or slug). They reload fine. They must be about the worst cases on the market. I prefer Fiocchi 67mm cases though. They last forever or so it seems. Not suggesting anyone does the same, just my decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cervusman Posted October 7, 2021 Report Share Posted October 7, 2021 (edited) I have 1000s of once fired 2 1/2” 410 Remington SP and Winchester AA cases that I got in a job lot and I can honestly say that I can reload them numerous times without any problems. Edited October 7, 2021 by cervusman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceWelder Posted October 7, 2021 Report Share Posted October 7, 2021 I wonder if its worth asking your local clay range for empties? Rummage around for the higher end cases for reloading... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAB1954 Posted October 8, 2021 Report Share Posted October 8, 2021 I reload for 12 gauge and fine Fiocchi cases are best for reloading, had some Rio cases from a clay club a few years ago and they where good also. In my opinion the crimp end of the case will start to split on the folds rendering the case useless for further reloading before any issue with the case base wad. I have never had a base wad separate and normally load cases until crimp area has a split. With 12 gauge you will not save money reloading, but you will have loads in the pellet sizes and payload weight that you want. That's why I reload. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted October 8, 2021 Report Share Posted October 8, 2021 On 07/10/2021 at 08:09, SpaceWelder said: I wonder if its worth asking your local clay range for empties? Rummage around for the higher end cases for reloading... A lot of clay clubs won't let you take cases away because they dont want you coming back with dodgy reloads Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceWelder Posted October 8, 2021 Report Share Posted October 8, 2021 2 hours ago, Vince Green said: A lot of clay clubs won't let you take cases away because they dont want you coming back with dodgy reloads Ah....well....****** 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centrepin Posted October 9, 2021 Report Share Posted October 9, 2021 14 hours ago, Vince Green said: A lot of clay clubs won't let you take cases away because they dont want you coming back with dodgy reloads I thought all clay grounds would be only too glad to get rid of any empties at any time as they have to pay for disposal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted October 9, 2021 Report Share Posted October 9, 2021 14 hours ago, Vince Green said: A lot of clay clubs won't let you take cases away because they dont want you coming back with dodgy reloads I very much doubt that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted October 9, 2021 Report Share Posted October 9, 2021 (edited) 38 minutes ago, sitsinhedges said: I very much doubt that. Bisley wont let you take cases away, notices on all the bins. Pretty sure Bisley don't allow reloads West London wont either they are the only two places I go to Edited October 9, 2021 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted October 10, 2021 Report Share Posted October 10, 2021 On 09/10/2021 at 10:41, sitsinhedges said: I very much doubt that. No , they want you to buy the shells from them obviously. I can understand them being a bit iffy about reloads because some people are not as fastidious and carefull ....does that mean the same. If I finish a shell and it doesn't look right then it goes in the reject box and will be take apart and reusable bits will be put into the production line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny English Posted October 11, 2021 Report Share Posted October 11, 2021 A lot of the grounds won't allow you to take empties or use home loads because there is no guarantee of what shot load you have put in. Most grounds have a load limit of 28 gram for noise or cpsa comps and they don't want people sneaking through home loads higher than that in 28 gram marked cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrowning2 Posted October 11, 2021 Report Share Posted October 11, 2021 (edited) CPSA rules ban the use of home loads at CPSA registered competition. I doubt anybody could tell the difference in noise between a 28gm and a 30gm or even 32gm load. Grounds may restrict shot size, as I think CPSA do to size 6 due to pellet energy and fallout safety zone. I doubt many could tell the difference between a probably made reload and a commercial cartridge. Have shot at a lot of grounds for practice and have never been asked about what cartridges, other than restrictions on wad type, I am shooting they care about one thing that is taking your money. Edited October 11, 2021 by rbrowning2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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