Here we go again......lockdowns

[Stonepark]

9 hours ago, ordnance said:

Some people are missing the point that even if Omicron less severe there will be a lot more infections, a small percentage of a massive number is still a very large number. 

Indeed in London 0.73% have the mainly Omicron Covids (cough ...... common cold)  at the same time or circa 1 in 130

Not exactly a #majorincident but higher than UK average.

Likewise in the UK at 100k cases a day it's 1 in 670 or thereabouts.

 

[Walker570]

11 hours ago, Newbie to this said:

That is purely hypothetical or should that be hysterical, there is no evidence that omicron is going to overwhelm any hospital system, in fact quite the opposite.

Why shouldn't we listen to those who have been dealing with omicron the longest, they are suggesting, that although more transmissible, omicron is far less severe.

Exactly. I live nearby to a nurse who works in a large hospital and she says the media and so called experts are spreading false narrative as they are not under any pressure whatsover and have only had eight minor cases.  

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, Walker570 said:

they are not under any pressure whatsover

That is not the case round here (though I don't know if is omicron related).  My clays shooting Doctor friend has called off attending clays for at least 3 weeks now and won't be shooting again until after new year - due to being called in to work extra hours to cover the huge demand, and A&E times at local main hospital have been above 8 hours most days recently as "they are under so much pressure".  Again, I can't say it is omicron, but they are certainly under pressure.

[Mice!]

11 hours ago, ordnance said:

Some people are missing the point that even if Omicron less severe there will be a lot more infections, a small percentage of a massive number is still a very large number. 

But if Omicron didn't ravage South Africa then why should we fear it? The original Covid wasn't enough to make everyone think they needed the vaccine so an easier to catch strain with less effects isn't going to bother them.

[millrace]

1 hour ago, Mice! said:

 The original Covid wasn't enough to make everyone think they needed the vaccine so an easier to catch strain with less effects isn't going to bother them.

How dare you suggest such a thing.....you sir are irresponsible and therefore surrender your certs immediately!!!!!!.....😂😂😂

To justify our impending restrictions we have had  this morning by local politician our worst case  upgraded from friday it being 11k cases to 30k a day.... by christmas......we average 15/1700 daily....utterly impossible from where we are at the minute but sure does scaremongering well to cover major mismanaged nhs in n.ireland

 

Edited December 19, 2021 by millrace

[TRINITY]

Plenty 0f chatter in the media about an emergency brake. Doesn't sound like a full lockdown but just banning or severely limiting indoor events and large outside gatherings. As long as I can shoot Clay's it doesn't bother me. Ok the club houses may be shut but I could live with that.

[Mice!]

1 hour ago, millrace said:

How dare you suggest such a thing.....you sir are irresponsible and therefore surrender your certs immediately!!!!!!.....😂😂😂

To justify our impending restrictions we have had  this morning by local politician our worst case  upgraded from friday it being 11k cases to 30k a day.... by christmas......we average 15/1700 daily....utterly impossible from where we are at the minute but sure does scaremongering well to cover major mismanaged nhs in n.ireland

 

Probably why Scotland said they were seeing more cases of Omicron,  and shock they were going to ask for help from the Gov, which means cash, I wonder how they would cope on there own, given there NHS is apparently a mess as well.

1 hour ago, TRINITY said:

Plenty 0f chatter in the media about an emergency brake. Doesn't sound like a full lockdown but just banning or severely limiting indoor events and large outside gatherings. As long as I can shoot Clay's it doesn't bother me. Ok the club houses may be shut but I could live with that.

They say this, but all the shops and pubs will stay open.

We will just do as we normally do, if we know we're going seeing relatives then we'd do a LFT first.

 

[wymberley]

This is fun, but rumour control has  got it all wrong.

Back along there was an MoD establishment where serving members of the armed forces were invited to take part in trials designed to find a cure for the common cold. As an additional incentive for your trouble, you were paid an additional couple of bob a day during your stay.

However, eventually it was rumbled so now it's become necessary to involve the general public to make up the numbers. Slipped in with the various covid strains, do you really think that the super cold/cough - call it what you will -  is just that? If so, oh, boy! Are you in for a surprise. 

[ordnance]

 

7 hours ago, Stonepark said:

Indeed in London 0.73% have the mainly Omicron Covids (cough ...... common cold)  at the same time or circa 1 in 130

Not exactly a #majorincident but higher than UK average.

Likewise in the UK at 100k cases a day it's 1 in 670 or thereabouts.

 

We shall see soon enough. 

Edited December 19, 2021 by ordnance

[ordnance]

Quote

Exactly. I live nearby to a nurse who works in a large hospital and she says the media and so called experts are spreading false narrative as they are not under any pressure whatsover and have only had eight minor cases. 

 So the doctors etc are just making up the figures of Covid patients in hospital for treatment and taking up ICU beds   

[captainhastings]

Lock downs or not what would be the point of locking down after christmas. Where on earth is the logic there. Let every one mix and socialize then lock down wow you may as well not bother in the first place

[ordnance]

4 hours ago, millrace said:

How dare you suggest such a thing.....you sir are irresponsible and therefore surrender your certs immediately!!!!!!.....😂😂😂

To justify our impending restrictions we have had  this morning by local politician our worst case  upgraded from friday it being 11k cases to 30k a day.... by christmas......we average 15/1700 daily....utterly impossible from where we are at the minute but sure does scaremongering well to cover major mismanaged nhs in n.ireland

 

Why do you think they are doing similar in other countries in Europe with different health care systems some rated among the best in the world, if here its just about covering up the mismanaged NHS in NI ? As for the 11k a day we will see in a few weeks. 

[TRINITY]

The problem with lockdowns is that we have had three so far and still have not solved the problem. It's now obvious that the loudest voices for lockdowns and restrictions are coming from labour and the left . However these same groups will then be screaming for more government bailouts, furlough etc. How long can we sustain this cycle of lockdown, then live with it a while and lockdown again. The country could become bankrupt if the never ending cycles of restrictions continue.

 

[JohnfromUK]

29 minutes ago, TRINITY said:

have not solved the problem.

The "problem" was to stop the NHS being overwhelmed.  That was achieved.

No one ever claimed lockdowns were going to make Covid 'go away'.

[Mice!]

54 minutes ago, TRINITY said:

The country could become bankrupt if the never ending cycles of restrictions continue.

That would probably make the luny left quite happy.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-59717571

I mean when Corbyn's brother is calling for MPs offices to be burned down because of restrictions, how is that normal behaviour ?

[TRINITY]

1 hour ago, JohnfromUK said:

The "problem" was to stop the NHS being overwhelmed.  That was achieved.

No one ever claimed lockdowns were going to make Covid 'go away'.

There is one school of thought regarding this. The true financial cost of a lockdown is vast. Instead of the cost of that , throw some of that money at the NHS and it should enable it to cope with the peaks of disease when they occur. This would most likely be the most cost effective and efficient way to deal with this.

[JohnfromUK]

Just now, TRINITY said:

This would most likely be the most cost effective and efficient way to deal with this.

I don't disagree - but there wouldn't have been the time.  The huge gamble to have Nightingales and buy lots of ventilators, few of which were ever used (so far) worked politically because it could be seen to be done fast. 

The idea of a Gov't standing by and doing 'nothing' whilst the NHS gets swamped to the extent patients were being turned away in droves with many dying - whereas countries that locked down had a much less severe outbreak/deaths would be politically unacceptable.

Protecting the NHS and saving lives was a card that 'had to be' played.  Sacrificing lives of elderly and vulnerable to protect 'businesses and shareholders' would be a message that would be played by the other parties and very probably have resulted in political disaster.

Maybe things will change going forward ......... but I doubt it.  The NHS will always 'bloat' to use up the money, but not provide the capacity.  It is the nature of things when there is no competition to drive efficiency.

[ordnance]

Quote

There is one school of thought regarding this. The true financial cost of a lockdown is vast. Instead of the cost of that , throw some of that money at the NHS and it should enable it to cope with the peaks of disease when they occur. This would most likely be the most cost effective and efficient way to deal with this.

More capacity in the NHS would be useful but would not help us now, as that takes years recurring nurses doctors etc.  

 

Quote

The NHS will always 'bloat' to use up the money, but not provide the capacity.  It is the nature of things when there is no competition to drive efficiency.

Have most countries not had problems with capacity during Covid, some with the highest ratings in the world for their health care systems. 

[TRINITY]

Just watched my local news and they have done a report from covid intensive care unit at Harrogate Hospital. Doctor in charge said the vast majority of people on the unit were un vaccinated.

If true and if the trend is country wide, I would feel really miffed if we had to go into lockdown to save NHS 

[JohnfromUK]

5 minutes ago, TRINITY said:

If true and if the trend is country wide, I would feel really miffed if we had to go into lockdown to save NHS

I think it is true. 

My niece and husband both work in major hospital (medical staff).  They say much the same, although also mentioned the very overweight were also more at risk of much more severe symptoms. 

My clays shooting doctor friend (different hospital) also said that there were a far higher proportion of hospital cases in the un-vaccinated compared to the vaccinated.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

1 minute ago, JohnfromUK said:

I think it is true. 

My niece and husband both work in major hospital (medical staff).  They say much the same, although also mentioned the very overweight were also more at risk of much more severe symptoms. 

My clays shooting doctor friend (different hospital) also said that there were a far higher proportion of hospital cases in the un-vaccinated compared to the vaccinated.

Surely that is why we have been urged to get vaccinated and boosted.

[JohnfromUK]

Just now, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Surely that is why we have been urged to get vaccinated and boosted.

Exactly - and I have done 'as urged' and had all 3.

[Mice!]

1 hour ago, JohnfromUK said:

I think it is true. 

My niece and husband both work in major hospital (medical staff).  They say much the same, although also mentioned the very overweight were also more at risk of much more severe symptoms. 

My clays shooting doctor friend (different hospital) also said that there were a far higher proportion of hospital cases in the un-vaccinated compared to the vaccinated.

Putting on my tin foil hat, would anyone expect them to say anything other than its mostly the unvaccinated who are being hospitalised?

I was just glad watching the news that nothing had changed,  despite them saying things are getting worse on Mars, sorry London, with the next piece saying how bad things are going to be for businesses that are seeing less footfall so aren't making the money they normally would in December. 

If it is the unvaccinated who are catching this latest strain and spreading it then I hope we avoid more lockdowns,  everyone has had the same opportunity to get vaccinated.

[JohnfromUK]

10 minutes ago, Mice! said:

would anyone expect them to say anything other than its mostly the unvaccinated who are being hospitalised?

I would expect (and I'm sure correctly) my relatives and friends to give me their honest findings, not an 'official' line.

[captainhastings]

Now a legal requirement to work from home in wales if you can. On other I can leg it down bozzer and sink 10 pints. Where do they get the logic from