Another E.U. turn of the screw

[old man]

Yep they are working hard for us?🤮

[TIGHTCHOKE]

2 hours ago, JohnfromUK said:

Speaking for myself, no, but it forms a part of the whole - which comprises both savings in pension schemes and savings in other schemes such as ISA.  I did not go the 'buy-to-let' property route that some have used. Eggs in many baskets is wise (in my view)

Yes, extremely so, I like the index linked side of my first pension and the fact that I could take it at 40!

[JohnfromUK]

56 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

Then Gordon Brown came along in 1997 and changed the rules and stole my old age.

He did that to all of us, but that is why 'eggs in several baskets' helps.  The final salary ones I had gave a 'guaranteed minimum' which had to be included to be 'contracted out' as the phrases were then (back in the 1970s and 80s).  Then PEP/ISA didn't get the same tax relief 'on the way in', but gives tax relief on the payout and capital gain. 

I have to say it was more by good luck than good management ....... but I did have a spread of risk.

[oowee]

 

Interesting that it was a coalition govt that brought in tax relief on pension contributions in 1921. All parties have had a hand in cutting benefits one way or another. 

Let’s be clear: there has not just been one pension “thief”. In my view, there has been a coalition of culprits who through their own greed, selfishness and regulatory incompetence have systematically raided workers’ employer’s defined benefit pension funds. Listed on the charge sheet are a muddled assortment of inept and grasping politicians, some misguided accountants and ultra-cautious actuaries, a complacent Bank of England, a docile pension regulator and, finally, increasingly indifferent and uncaring employers.

https://theconversation.com/britains-great-pension-robbery-why-the-defined-benefits-gold-standard-is-a-luxury-of-the-past-100844#:~:text=The chancellor%2C Gordon Brown%2C abolished,this tax snatch was colossal.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Well we really didn't expect you to allow people to lay any blame at Labour/Browns door!

[JohnfromUK]

 

In general, Labour are always worried about pensioners; they are a large - and currently growing section of the electorate, they tend to actually turn out to vote and they have a higher tendency to avoid the Labour party than the young because they have heard Labour's 'promises' and seen the results. 

By contrast, the younger voters haven't actually lived under Labour and believe the promises.

Brown wished to reduce pensioners independence by reducing their non state controlled income and make them more dependent on the state.  An old Labour principle that the more people who have to rely on state handouts, the more you can 'buy' their votes.

[enfieldspares]

26 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

An old Labour principle that the more people who have to rely on state handouts, the more you can 'buy' their votes.

Yes. Shameful that it benefitted Labour to seemingly preserve a white poorly educate underclass dependent on benefits on large sink estates within or on the fringes of a city (such a Leicester's Braunstone Estate, with Greville Janner in the 1970s and 1980s) to keep Leicester "red".

Clientelism it's called in some countries. At least where my wife comes from (they're voting today for the new President) they had the honesty to be up front about it. I remember being in Benin City in 2012 for the gubernatorial election. A 25 kilo bag of rice was the price of determining the ballot of one PVC (Permanent Voters Card) then.

The unarguable logic of those that took the offer was that they might as well get something then and now as an immediate direct benefit rather than depend on a promise of something, if elected, that might not happen. As they say everywhere "a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush".

Edited February 26, 2023 by enfieldspares

[12gauge82]

All this back and forwards arguments over who did what between Labour and the Conservatives detracts from the real issue, which is glaring us in the face, our political system is broken and no major partie will do anything more than the bare minimum for the average person, the type of person who has worked their whole life, taken little from the state and generally been or are going to be a good citizen. We need a colossal change and that won't happen until the main parties realise they have competition from other parties, no matter how unlikely they are to lead the country in the beginning. 

[oowee]

1 hour ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Well we really didn't expect you to allow people to lay any blame at Labour/Browns door!

🤣 You did not read the article then?

38 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

All this back and forwards arguments over who did what between Labour and the Conservatives detracts from the real issue, which is glaring us in the face, our political system is broken and no major partie will do anything more than the bare minimum for the average person, the type of person who has worked their whole life, taken little from the state and generally been or are going to be a good citizen. We need a colossal change and that won't happen until the main parties realise they have competition from other parties, no matter how unlikely they are to lead the country in the beginning. 

 This this and this. It's not about who is in power its about the way power is awarded. 

[discobob]

2 hours ago, oowee said:

🤣 You did not read the article then?

 This this and this. It's not about who is in power its about the way power is awarded. 

We agree on something at last Grant

 

[12gauge82]

2 hours ago, oowee said:

🤣 You did not read the article then?

 This this and this. It's not about who is in power its about the way power is awarded. 

👍

[Cosmicblue]

I'm on the brink of retirement, state pension age birthday in August, and just booted up the road (redundancy with severance pay not the worst situation to be in).  Fortunately I'd tasked a Chartered IFA to produce a report on my pension position (complex because of having around 20 jobs in my 50 year working life) back in September 2022.   Crikey it's complicated...it would so useful if we came with a year counter so you knew when you were going to die...the report is here, all 33 pages of it.

[JohnfromUK]

25 minutes ago, Cosmicblue said:

Crikey it's complicated...it would so useful if we came with a year counter so you knew when you were going to die

That's true!  Enjoy your retirement (I am enjoying mine).

I'm ahead of you (66 in before you this year and state pension triggered to start then) but I took voluntary retirement early (=redundancy) with a reasonable deal a few years ago and two 'employment' pensions kicked in last year.  One was really well organised and went through like magic 2 days after my 65th ........ the other was loads of hassle and took 8 months and loads of letters and complaints to actually start paying (I am fortunate to have a knowledgeable relative who helped on this).

[Penelope]

On 25/02/2023 at 13:43, ditchman said:

at the moment it seems to be just Italy...........the Italian wine growers are climbing the wall over this...and i cant blame them

A slap for electing a conservative leader.