Raja Clavata Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 Potentially a more insightful way of looking at it is that the national average of working age population who are “economically inactive” is 21.2% of which 82.4% do not want to work. That 21.2% average rises to 41.5% in bastions of industry like Clacton, Essex. I’ve not looked but would be interesting to know what percentage of our population are actually contributing something. No wonder we’re such an attractive proposition to scroungers beyond our borders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 4 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: No wonder we’re such an attractive proposition to scroungers beyond our borders. Of the "82.4% who do not want to work" I guess you will find that a considerable majority support Labour - which explains why Labour will actually do nothing about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 5 hours ago, Mungler said: 8,000,000 people too sick to work. A remarkable number and statistically improbably too. Our political elites opted to import cheap Labour when we had cheap Labour sitting idly by here - rather than sort the home grown problem out they went for importing Labour (and a work ethic). I know and have seen generationally unemployed through work. People think they don’t exist or they’re in low numbers - they are wrong. Someone in their late teens - already got a kid, not with dad. Teenager’s mum, on her own had 4 kids by 4 different fathers, none of whom are around. No one in the whole family across generations or siblings have a job let alone a career. One massive claim up and income supplemented flogging weed. Absolute hopeless and pointless drain on society. . Well I'm certainly sick along with possibly tens of thousands of others? Sick of all of the greedy, self seeking politicians ignoring their mandates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 3 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: Of the "82.4% who do not want to work" I guess you will find that a considerable majority support Labour - which explains why Labour will actually do nothing about it. I previously looked at the figures for each of the Reform seats and compared those to the national average as well as local Labour and Conservative constituencies in my home county of Essex. What you can see is that, with the exception of Basildon S & Ockenden E, the Reform constituencies have higher than average percentages for economically inactive but, with the exception of Ashfield, several points lower percentages than the national average of those not wanting to work. Economically Inactive % Don't want to work % National Average 21.2 82.4 Ashfield 33.5 82.2 Basildon S & Ockendon E 14.5 76.2 Clacton 41.5 74.7 Great Yarmouth 29.3 76.7 Boston & Skegness 27.4 68.3 Labour (Harlow) 25.6 81.4 Conservative (B&B) 23.9 74.9 What the numbers suggest to me is if >20% of working age people are economically inactive combined with an aging population, then the system is broken and the burden on the rest of us is huge and growing unsustainably. The answer is we need more people who are net contributors, the answer is not more people who are low skilled and a net drain. One of the significant issues is we do not attract enough of those in the net contributor group beyond our borders, for various reasons. Another issue, and pending risk, is what happens when a significant portion of the workforce who are skilled and at or near net contributors today are replaced by AI agents. Perhaps we'll see a positive shift in salaries of people who undertake labour intensive work but then the AI enabled robots will be along shortly afterwards to replace them too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 13 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: I previously looked at the figures for each of the Reform seats and compared those to the national average as well as local Labour and Conservative constituencies in my home county of Essex. I don't know your area at all, so can't really comment other than my own 'suspicion' which is that where there is a high proportion of those 'economically inactive' being of working age and eligible/suitable to work that; the 'economically inactive' would tend to mostly vote for that party which is seen to be generous with benefits and benefit packages - and that is Labour. the working and active would tend to vote more towards 'Reform' as the party (as yet untested) who would be most inclined to be 'tough' on benefit 'fraud' (on the basis that successive past Tory Gov'ts may have 'talked the talk', but never delivered on the rhetoric. In addition, I think that pretty much everyone would want to support (and support properly) the genuinely needy - such as the long term ill, disabled, elderly, injured, widowed, carers of others etc.). Also pretty much everyone wants to see 'fraud' stamped out. If people are too 'bone idle' to work, benefits should be only at a bare minimum subsistence level - and possibly 80% paid by a (voucher type?) system that allows purchase of essentials and excludes alcohol, tobacco/vape products, gambling etc. In particular, benefits should be there to support people when they fall on hard times and should never be a voluntary 'lifestyle choice'. All a bit hard to do, but it won't be done if never tried. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 4 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: the working and active would tend to vote more towards 'Reform' as the party (as yet untested) who would be most inclined to be 'tough' on benefit 'fraud' (on the basis that successive past Tory Gov'ts may have 'talked the talk', but never delivered on the rhetoric. The data I shared in the table, which comes from official sources, predominantly shows the complete opposite of that for the five seats that Reform won! I agree with everything else you stated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 (edited) 4 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: Of the "82.4% who do not want to work" I guess you will find that a considerable majority support Labour - which explains why Labour will actually do nothing about it. Ah? but I suspect that quite a fair number of that 82.4% have got some form of side hustle going on. That's another issue that the new government have hinted they will be looking at. They have said they will be looking at the bank accounts of benefit claimants To me that's so bloody nieve . It shows to me they don't realise money can be paid into a family members account or cash in hand to hide earnings Edited October 4 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 22 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: The data I shared in the table, which comes from official sources, predominantly shows the complete opposite of that for the five seats that Reform won! And I cannot explain why that might be - to me - turkeys voting for Christmas springs to mind ......... but you could I suppose say that about the UK voting for a Labour Gov't anyway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 5 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: Of the "82.4% who do not want to work" I guess you will find that a considerable majority support Labour - which explains why Labour will actually do nothing about it. Why do you think its so high after the Tories? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 9 minutes ago, Vince Green said: I suspect that quite a fair number of that 82.4% have got some form of side hustle going on. Very likely. Just now, oowee said: Why do you think its so high after the Tories? As I said above, "past Tory Gov'ts may have 'talked the talk', but never delivered on the rhetoric." There could be many reasons for that - one of which would be that the people charged with 'operating a much tougher system' find it all a bit like hard work - and so it all gets pushed over the horizon all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 7 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: Very likely. As I said above, "past Tory Gov'ts may have 'talked the talk', but never delivered on the rhetoric." There could be many reasons for that - one of which would be that the people charged with 'operating a much tougher system' find it all a bit like hard work - and so it all gets pushed over the horizon all the time. By which logic Labour will do a better job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 Quote Why do you think its so high after the Tories? Never mind, Starmer will sort it. How many years will pass before he / Rayner et al stops blaming someone else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 2 minutes ago, oowee said: By which logic Labour will do a better job. Unfortunately - we will all find out the answer to this ......... and I doubt very much it will be good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 Just now, Gordon R said: Never mind, Starmer will sort it. How many years will pass before he / Rayner et al stops blaming someone else? How long do you think Starmer and Raynor will keep their jobs before they get kicked into the long grass by the hard liners? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 The more I see of Starmer on You Tube, the less I think he will be around for much longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 10 minutes ago, oowee said: By which logic Labour will do a better job. I doubt that Labour will have any more success than Conservatives did in over coming the inertia in the Civil Service Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 3 minutes ago, Vince Green said: I doubt that Labour will have any more success than Conservatives did in over coming the inertia in the Civil Service /\ This Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 11 minutes ago, Vince Green said: How long do you think Starmer and Raynor will keep their jobs before they get kicked into the long grass by the hard liners? Rayner has the unions on her side, Starmer would love to get rid of her but he doesn't have the power to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow Bear Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 9 minutes ago, welsh1 said: Rayner has the unions on her side, Starmer would love to get rid of her but he doesn't have the power to do so. She is, and always has been, their puppet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 53 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: Unfortunately - we will all find out the answer to this ......... and I doubt very much it will be good. I doubt it will be a priority. Too much in the pipeline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 13 minutes ago, oowee said: Too much in the pipeline. Yes, stealing from pensioners seems a higher priority than tackling fraud. Still, that always was Labour's way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 6 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: Of the "82.4% who do not want to work" I guess you will find that a considerable majority support Labour - which explains why Labour will actually do nothing about it. To be fair the Cons had 14years to do something about it and they did virtually nothing to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 2 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: successive past Tory Gov'ts may have 'talked the talk', but never delivered on the rhetoric. Indeed - I accept that - see above quote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow Bear Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 12 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said: To be fair the Cons had 14years to do something about it and they did virtually nothing to. I believe some tried but ended up sidelined for "bullying*" said (un)civil servants. * union term for trying to get them to do their job as required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted October 4 Report Share Posted October 4 7 minutes ago, Yellow Bear said: I believe some tried but ended up sidelined for "bullying*" said (un)civil servants. * union term for trying to get them to do their job as required. True, but the point remains the Cons were useless to. Tough talk and no action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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