A bit of an FAC oddity.

[Bleeh]

I've just gotten my FAC back.

 

Every other calibre is written down correctly, apart from the .22lr I applied for is written down as .22RF.

 

As there is no such round as a .22RF, but it has for the last hundred years stood for .22 Rim-fire does this mean I can have any .22 rimfire I wish? Such as a .22wmr (not that I want one).

[Breastman]

Technically yes Some people's FAC's have .22CF meaning they can buy/acquire any .22 centrefire. No such luck with my force, everything is marked down as exact calibres, i couldn't even get away with putting 7.62mm down when i hadn't decided between 7.62x51, 7.62x39 or 7.62x54R

 

Mark

[sheepshed]

That's what I've got on mine. Discussed it with the RFD who was of the opinion that he could probably legally sell me a WMR, but that the FO would not be amused and come renewal time life could get complicated.

In short, it's really just another way of saying 22LR.

[Bleeh]

Well, Hurray for me then. If the need comes to it I can now put all you .17HMR snobs to shame with my WMR! aha!

[apache]

When I spoke to my FLO he said to put down .22RF on the application, still waiting for the ticket back to see what I get.

[Canis]

That's what I've got on mine. Discussed it with the RFD who was of the opinion that he could probably legally sell me a WMR, but that the FO would not be amused and come renewal time life could get complicated.

In short, it's really just another way of saying 22LR.

does anyone still sell 22 short RF ammo any more?

 

(sorry if this is a "silly" question - I havent fired a rimfire for several years!)

[Billy.]

Whilst in theory you can buy any rimfire rifle with your ticket, I would always advise someone to stick to buying what they asked for.

 

It's written on your application form that you wanted an LR and it can easily be cross checked. I'm sure your FEO would not be too happy if he thinks you've tried to get away with a different calibre to the one you wanted.

[Blunderbuss]

does anyone still sell 22 short RF ammo any more?

 

(sorry if this is a "silly" question - I havent fired a rimfire for several years!)

 

No, not a silly question, you can still buy .22 short. I'm not sure if .22 CB & .22 Long are still available? All of these as well as .22 LR and .22 WMR are very definitely .22 rim fire so allowable with that wording on your certificate.

[al4x]

just phone up and ask him pleasantly that way you can't be accused of anything later on. Personally I'd think you'd be doing nothing illegal just might get their backs up a little. Of course if thats what they meant it means you can go and get a WMR without any issues

[casts_by_fly]

No, not a silly question, you can still buy .22 short. I'm not sure if .22 CB & .22 Long are still available? All of these as well as .22 LR and .22 WMR are very definitely .22 rim fire so allowable with that wording on your certificate.

 

 

Not only short, LR and WMR, but also long and WRF are available. Not as many variations, but they are all available.

 

http://www.cci-ammunition.com/products/products.aspx

 

Thanks,

Rick

[Dekers]

I've just gotten my FAC back.

 

Every other calibre is written down correctly, apart from the .22lr I applied for is written down as .22RF.

 

As there is no such round as a .22RF, but it has for the last hundred years stood for .22 Rim-fire does this mean I can have any .22 rimfire I wish? Such as a .22wmr (not that I want one).

 

 

There is a lot of history on this question, much of it recent, have a look back a bit

[Dekers]

No, not a silly question, you can still buy .22 short. I'm not sure if .22 CB & .22 Long are still available? All of these as well as .22 LR and .22 WMR are very definitely .22 rim fire so allowable with that wording on your certificate.

 

 

Not only short, LR and WMR, but also long and WRF are available. Not as many variations, but they are all available.

 

http://www.cci-ammunition.com/products/products.aspx

 

Thanks,

Rick

 

 

Most types of .22Rimfire ammo is still made by someone, the problem is simply finding a RFD who stocks any!

Edited September 17, 2010 by Dekers

[Scully]

When applying for a .22 you should always specify .22RF.This leaves your options open for shorts,longs, or indeed WMR.Neither SHORT,LONG,orWMR are calibres,they are cartridge designations,the calibre is .22.

If your FEO tries to pin you down to a certain cartridge designation,then he's not doing his job properly.It's not down to him.There are many 7.62 cartridge designations for example,but the calibre is still 7.62.If your FEO tries to pin you down to any particular one, then get in touch with your shooting organisation.

[Billy.]

When applying for a .22 you should always specify .22RF.This leaves your options open for shorts,longs, or indeed WMR.Neither SHORT,LONG,orWMR are calibres,they are cartridge designations,the calibre is .22.

 

So what you're saying is that it's fine to shoot a short rimfire cartridge in a long rimfire breech...? So you'd be happy to fire .17 HM2 ammo in an HMR? I would be intrigued to see how the bullet comes pinging out :unsure:

 

Just becuase the calibre is .17, the cartridge should fit snugly inside the breech, not have a bullet ready to fly, dangling out of the brass case in the breech

 

I appreciate that this isn't the case with .22 rimfire, but it's still a dangerous thing to have on people's licences and something which could be mistakenly added to a .17 rifle on a licence.

Edited September 18, 2010 by Billy.

[Dave-G]

I don't read it that way Billy.

 

He seems to be suggesting the types of breech/specific ammo you could get under the .22RF banner.

Edited September 18, 2010 by Dave-G

[Dekers]

So what you're saying is that it's fine to shoot a short rimfire cartridge in a long rimfire breech...? So you'd be happy to fire .17 HM2 ammo in an HMR? I would be intrigued to see how the bullet comes pinging out :blink:

 

Just becuase the calibre is .17, the cartridge should fit snugly inside the breech (it won't as the brass is a different diameter as well, it will flop about!), not have a bullet ready to fly, dangling out of the brass case in the breech

 

I appreciate that this isn't the case with .22 rimfire (it is in comparison to .22WMR), but it's still a dangerous thing to have on people's licences and something which could be mistakenly added to a .17 rifle on a licence.

 

 

I understand what you are saying and this is a point I have made many many times, RF should not be used as a descriptive item on a FAC ever in my opinion.

 

.22longs, shorts, caps all have the same size diameter cartridge case and all fit snugly in .22lr breech due to the bullet/cartridge overhang but, but the .22WMR case is a different diameter to the .22lr case.

 

This is the same for the .17HMR and Mach2, not only is the cartridge length different, but so to is the brass diameter, this does still mean it is possible to put a Mach2 up a HMR breech, I guess you could fire it, probably have a hell of a job extracting it, but a HMR would simply not fit into a Mach2 breach at all!

 

ATB!

[Scully]

I didn't say I would be happy to shoot a .17HM2 through a .17HMR or anything similar Billy,I was merely trying to explain how you can rule yourself out of options if you are unaware of how literal licensing offices can interpret applications.You can put through your gun whatever you fancy.

When I applied for my .22 many moons ago I fancied a .22Mag' but didn't tell my FEO this,I simply applied for a .22 Rimfire,then went and got a .22mag,it's still a rimfire.When I applied for another I bought a .22Longrifle,but the ammo allocation for both is on my ticket as rimfire,which is how I wanted it.I can now buy up to 1000 rounds at a time and there is no specification between the two,it's all down as rimfire,not longrifle and magnum.

When I shot pistols new applicants were advised to specify .38/357 for PP1 and 2,which left your options open for .38S&W(short),.38 Special(long) and 357(magnum).357 is a cartridge designation,its calibre is .38.

[hunters_return]

I went through the very same thinking, finaly called my local office and was told. "NO. well yes but don't as we will not be happy, if a WMR is what you wanted you should have ask for one". or somthing alone them lines.

So i did and now have both :-)

 

Paul

[DaveK]

If your FEO tries to pin you down to a certain cartridge designation,then he's not doing his job properly.It's not down to him.There are many 7.62 cartridge designations for example,but the calibre is still 7.62.If your FEO tries to pin you down to any particular one, then get in touch with your shooting organisation.

 

 

Scully, do you actually know what you're talking about? I can see where you're coming from but would equally like to know what you're on and is there any spare? 7.62 may be a calibre in your eyes but you're selectively missing an important bit.

 

7.62x25, 7.62x39, 7.62x51 (.308win), 7,62x54. All 7.62 calibres but very different. 7.62 is also designated as .30 calibre and that opens up shedloads of options (in your book anyway) such as .303, 30-06 and then there's the .30 calibre magnums. I don't recommend anyone approaches their shooting organisation based on what you've suggested mate. Such a wide flexibility of choice aint never gunna 'appen. Unless of course someone that it's happened to posts it in reply.

[daz2202]

Why not just have what you knowingly applied for rather than twist wordings putting yourself in a very grey area thus putting your ticket at risk !!!

[Scully]

My point exactly DaveK....it's a mess isn't it?

It's also one of the reasons my licensing department think I'm a pain in the ****!I take great pleasure in knowing this!

You should have seen their reaction when they found out I own an unproofed gun!

[THEINVISIBLESCARECROW]

What is on the ammo side of things ?

My understang is the WMR rimfire ammo isn't available if your ammo authority says 22lr.

If the ammo just says 22RF then that's it.

Allso what does the mod authority state.

If everything says RF then you can buy RF of any type within the "size" stated.

[Bleeh]

What is on the ammo side of things ?

My understang is the WMR rimfire ammo isn't available if your ammo authority says 22lr.

If the ammo just says 22RF then that's it.

Allso what does the mod authority state.

If everything says RF then you can buy RF of any type within the "size" stated.

 

That's a good question, but both 'boxes' for Maximum possed and maximum acquired both say .22RF

Edited September 23, 2010 by Bleeh

[Scully]

Sorry....had to rush off before finishing my post.

Why shouldn't you have great flexibility of choice?Why can't you simply apply(for example)for a .30 calibre rifle,if that's what you desire?You may have a classic .303 Lee Enfield in mind and then searching through a gun rack discover a Springfield .30-06.What greater threat to the general public are you going to be by buying a .243 Win or a 6mm Remi?

When you apply for a 12 bore shotgun you don't specify the cartridge length,nor does licensing attempt to pin you down to one.It makes as much sense as having high capacity magazine shotguns on your FAC....no sense at all.

It's not as if you would be doing anything underhand;you have to inform licensing what you've bought anyhow,so what's the problem?

As far as I'm aware,haven't BASC proposed to the HASC that the applicant should be licensed(as is current practise with shotguns)rather than the weapon?It would make so much more sense if once an individual was licensed to hold a centre-fire rifle they could then choose the one of their choice.

There'll be a load of posts now about people rushing out and buying .50 Barrett's etc! For vermin?I don't think so.We 're all responsible adults here,aren't we?

I got the .357 designation wrong,by the way.Had a look on an old Hornady chart and apparently .357 is a calibre.If a 9mm is .355 then .38 also has to be .357.Sorry.

Sorry Dave....I can't tell you what I'm on as it's very addictive and I don't have much left!

[Vermincinerator]

I purposely asked for a 22RF so that if i wanted i could buy a .22WMR, in the end i bought a .22LR

I have similar for my C/F rifles apart from two specific cartridges, being 22-250 and 20 Vartarg,

Other authorities are 6mm on which i bought a 243, .25 cal on which i bought a 257 Roberts and .300 cal on which i bought a 300 WSM.

Alternatively i could have bought a 6mmBR, a 25-06 and a 300 Win mag. (actually bought a 6mmBR after selling the 243)

I have been listing my firearms on my FAC like this since the pistol days.

 

Ian.