Shooting Dogs

[mickyh]

I've been asked to shoot two dogs which regularly chase and attack sheep on the farm next door to my permission.

This will bring a new permission no doubt,which I would like.

A quick google opens a wasps nest of the 'Great British Laws'

Does anyone have any factual experience with dog/sheep problems?

The owner of the dogs is always around and takes no notice of the Farmer.

This would be done with a shotgun,so no worry about whats on my Firearms Cert.

Anyone?

[oscarsdad]

Rather you than me.

[the pigeon man]

I have had this problem I few times with my sheep some young ish lad lets his dog off to chase sheep told him THREE times saying if I saw him again il shoot dog forth n last time it happend shot his dog stone dead police came and nothing came of it al long as they have had warning I ALSO BIN TOLD THEY CAN DO YOU IF THERE'S NO SIGNS !!!! Make sure there's signs up about dogs n livestock ect and things should be ok

 

Joe

[al4x]

yup don't go near it with a barge pole if the owner is in attendance, what needs to be done is video evidence obtained and get them in court for the losses. Shooting while legitimate isn't easy with a shotgun, you have to catch them in the act and you are likely to come to fistycuffs with the owner if they are there

[mickyh]

Good point Joe.

Thanks for that.

I have had this problem I few times with my sheep some young ish lad lets his dog off to chase sheep told him THREE times saying if I saw him again il shoot dog forth n last time it happend shot his dog stone dead police came and nothing came of it al long as they have had warning I ALSO BIN TOLD THEY CAN DO YOU IF THERE'S NO SIGNS !!!! Make sure there's signs up about dogs n livestock ect and things should be ok

Joe

[Scully]

You need to ask yourself(and the farmer)if it's so much of a problem,why he hasn't already done it himself,instead of asking you to do it.

[the pigeon man]

I had it a few times now saying there suing and all that balls but as long as there's signs and they have been warned that it WILL be shot they can't do naff all

 

Best of luck

[al4x]

you as the farmer are in a better position pigeonman as someone being asked to come in and do it things aren't quite as cut and dried. You also don't know if there is any other history between the two parties, the thing to do is to make sure the police have been informed of the issue before you shoot anything

[jonesbach]

If the owner is always around,can the police be called to make them aware and come to have a word with him? Once the police know the situation, let them know, along with the owner that if the dogs persist they will be shot on the spot. Completely within rights to do this. No signs need to be up in my experience, just inform the police after the dog is shot, leaving it where it was done. Any repercussions from the owner after this are criminal offences.

[the pigeon man]

you as the farmer are in a better position pigeonman as someone being asked to come in and do it things aren't quite as cut and dried. You also don't know if there is any other history between the two parties, the thing to do is to make sure the police have been informed of the issue before you shoot anything

True !!

[The Ghost]

The Police shoot dogs that are out of control, recently we have seen some very tragic cases in the news where people have been killed or badly injured.

I would contact the police first and tell them your options have run out and you have a duty to protect the livestock from these dogs.

To solve the problem the dogs should be removed from the owner, this would solve the problem.

[pigeonblasterian]

If you do decide to shoot them make sure the owner does not see you or knows where you live.

Is the person asking you to shoot them just trying to avoid any comeback.

I hope the permission you might gain is worth it for the bother you might get.

[Mentalmac]

Just to throw this out there... When the dog is running around in field, take a shot, but deliberately miss (shoot behind somewhat) and maybe that will serve as a good warning to the owner?

[mickyh]

As expected this is a can of Wasps!

Thank you to all who have replied,I've learned a lot.

I'm meeting the said Farmer on Sunday,so I'll have a good chat before I make any decisions.

Thanks Mick

[washerboy]

The sight of a guy with a gun would keep my dogs under control if they were running around chasing stock, there are some muppets out there.

not a job i would take on for someone, different if its my stock.

[peek-at]

Hi,

 

Have a look on the BASC advice relating to this subject

 

LINK .................(this is a link to the BASC PDF file which you will need to download to read)

 

You would have a defence in any civil action by the dog owner if you were authorised by the landowner and the dog was worrying sheep or about to, and the dog owner was NOT AROUND.....(have a read)

The farmer would be expected to have exhausted other means of fixing the problem

 

The owner of the dog would seem, by what you say, to be guilty of allowing his dog to worry livestock, which the police can prosecute. This would establish a history with the police relating to that dog & owner.

 

The farmer should involve the police in the first instance and make a formal complaint. Also have the police make it clear to the dog owner that he is prepared to shoot the dog on the next occasion of it attacking livestock

 

If there is a 'next time' and the dog is shot, he only needs to notify the police within 48 hours.

If the dog owner then decided to take civil action, after the farmer has taken all of this time and effort to try and 'avoid' a reoccurrence, I would say that the owner would not have a leg to stand on.

 

There doesnt seem to be any requirement to have warning signs posted, but it would go to show that the farmer has gone to some effort to try and stop the problem without resorting to killing the dog.

 

Good luck

Edited April 26, 2013 by peek-at

[CharlieT]

Let's just get the facts right.

 

Signs are not needed.

A person shooting or wounding a dog leaves themselves open to both a criminal and civil prosecution. You may find yourself in court having to defend your actions.

If you shoot a dog worrying livestock you must inform the police of your actions within 48 hours.

To be able to defend your actions you must have shot the dog whilst it was in the act of worrying, not at any time later or before.

Wounding a dog can lead to prosecution under the Animal Welfare Act.

Ensure you have written instructions to do so from the stock owner.

 

With the dog owner present you can guarantee that it will end in tears.

 

As a sheep farmer I can assure you that I would not dream of asking anyone else but an employee to shoot a dog. It is not a step to be taken lightly and can land the shooter in court defending his actions.

 

Keep well out of it.

[Archie-fox]

some good advice above, its a massive can of worms and you could end up in court or with a good beating, best avoid anything like that..

[Muddy Funker]

I'd avoid this like the plague, get the farmer to do it if it's that much of an issue.

 

Sounds like he wants you to have all the grief that will come of it if any dogs are shot.

[jonesbach]

Have we just assumed that the farmer has a sgc?! He does a favour by allowing you to shoot on his land, pay him the same dues and help him when needed. Dogs hassling stock can be costly (I speak from experience!!) If shooting the dogs for him is the only way this continuing problem can be solved, it's just got to be done.

[Reece]

It would be good to, next time the man lets his dog worry livestock, tell him that his dog can be shot if it worries livestock. A warning is usually enough, further action could be taken if the warning goes unheeded.

 

The only time my dad has ever had to shoot a dog for a farmer was when poachers looking for deer instead started setting dogs on sheep (killing the sheep). That was over a decade ago, warnings have been sufficient since.

[Cannon]

Could you not use scare tactics and shoot near the dog but deliberately miss? If the owner has any sense they'll keep the dog on a lead in future. There may be some lip and slabbering from the owner, but you have shown restraint and have taken non lethal preventative action.

[CharlieT]

Have we just assumed that the farmer has a sgc?! He does a favour by allowing you to shoot on his land, pay him the same dues and help him when needed. Dogs hassling stock can be costly (I speak from experience!!) If shooting the dogs for him is the only way this continuing problem can be solved, it's just got to be done.

If you read the OP again you will see that it is not his "farmer" but the next door neighbour.

 

Secondly I would imagine every sheep farmer has a gun otherwise how would he shoot his sick/injured sheep. I, like every other sheep farmer, shoot plenty every year for one reason or another.

 

In any event, it would be highly unlikly that the OP would be on the spot at the exact time this farmers stock was being worried.

[malantone]

I've been asked to shoot two dogs which regularly chase and attack sheep on the farm next door to my permission.

This will bring a new permission no doubt,which I would like.

A quick google opens a wasps nest of the 'Great British Laws'

Does anyone have any factual experience with dog/sheep problems?

The owner of the dogs is always around and takes no notice of the Farmer.

This would be done with a shotgun,so no worry about whats on my Firearms Cert.

Anyone?

Firstly the OP states "two dogs which regularly chase and attack sheep,"the owner ignors the farmer, therefore warnings have been given he only needs to tell the police. Secondly if the farmer pays the OP then he becomes an employee and entitled to act on his behalf. If the OP is attacked after the event that would be a criminal act on behalf of the dog owner.

having said all that I would try the near miss first which in itself might result in an attack by the dog owner, just make sure that the owner isn`t threatened with the gun, and you only defend yourself don`t attack him, once he starts swinging then feel free to wade in.

[ordnance]

Tell him to shoot them himself why would you do his dirty work for him. If he hasn't got a firearm he should get one. If you shoot the dog while the owner is present you could end up with the shotgun wrapped round your neck.

Edited April 26, 2013 by ordnance