peteri Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 Hi Sorry - long time lurker, making my first post. My wife and I have been clay shooting for the past 6 months and are really into it, for the past few months she's been borrowing a 20g Silver Pigeon, she needs to stick on a reversed comb raiser - but overall has been getting on well with it. We're getting to the point of plunking down the money on a new gun, but are twitchy about 12g or 20g? We'll need to spend on getting the stock shortened and the comb raised (my wife is quite small, 8 stone and 5'2" and seems to need a very, very high stock to see over the action). She's not recoil sensitive at all, but is to the weight of the gun as we're carrying it around etc. Any experience/advice? We're not harbouring illusions of Olympic competition, but would like a gun that is going to stay with us for a while, given the needed stock work. She tried a Remington 1100 semi yesterday, absolutely no problem on the recoil - but hated the faff of semi-auto loading, so that's out! Any opinions at all welcome! Cheers Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbo33 Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) I have an SP 12g and an SP20g. The 20g goes out more, largely due to its weight. Its every bit as potent as the 12g, I might even chance better If your lady is shooting well with the SP20g why not stay with it? There's likely to be replies about less kick with a 12g, but I think there's too much fuss made about recoil. The upside to a 12g is the carts are cheaper, but for me I would keep the 20 over the 12 all day long Just my views. Edited October 20, 2013 by turbo33 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 I would say stay with a 20 bore due to weight sensitivity or you could try something very light in 12 like the beretta ultra light but I'm not a fan of the ultra light 12 the balance never seems quite right to me a the stocks are normally very hollow and feel it. For a 20 the Beretta SP1 S has a higher comb as do the Miroku/Brownings but if it more than 10 mm you are looking at a comb insert or adjustable comb the latter is better IMHO and may even add value to the gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biketestace Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 If you both can shoot the same gauge then its far easier in the long run.. Field versions of guns fair well for the ladies and then find a softer cartridge mate, unfortunately lighter guns don't absorb recoil aswell, 21g and 24g Express Hv loads are brilliant. Bta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lksopener Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 I've had this self same problem recently started with a 20 and althought lighter. Lighter = more recoil. So we went with a 12 gauge and the recoil issue was sorted by using a medium weight gun (my old skeet gun) shortened and a nice recoil pad and using 24 gram shells. That's my experience anyway and I think it helps to be shooting the same gauge not random shells all over then. The 20 shot well but I'm not all that interested in small bores. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gduk Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 I have an SP 12g and an SP20g. The 20g goes out more, largely due to its weight. Its every bit as potent as the 12g, I might even chance better If your lady is shooting well with the SP20g why not stay with it? There's likely to be replies about less kick with a 12g, but I think there's too much fuss made about recoil. The upside to a 12g is the carts are cheaper, but for me I would keep the 20 over the 12 all day long Just my views. Well said, only downside is shell prices as mentioned! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehb102 Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) We're getting to the point of plunking down the money on a new gun, but are twitchy about 12g or 20g? We'll need to spend on getting the stock shortened and the comb raised (my wife is quite small, 8 stone and 5'2" and seems to need a very, very high stock to see over the action). She's not recoil sensitive at all, but is to the weight of the gun as we're carrying it around etc. Any experience/advice? We're not harbouring illusions of Olympic competition, but would like a gun that is going to stay with us for a while, given the needed stock work. The ladies I know who shoot fall into two categories. The ones who use their guns for game and shoot clays for fun outside the season have 20g because they don't want to carry a heavy gun in the field all day. The ones who like shooting clays and think of themselves as clay shooters have 12g sporters that they will happily shoot game with occasionally. The tiniest clay shooting ladies I know have DT10s and DT11s. My 6' husband shoots clays with a 20g because he is what my father calls "a swivel chair warrier" and doesn't want to be holding up a 7lb gun for 100 clays. He suffers with the kick though, although I've put him on 21g cartridges. The consequence was: it's an individual choice. If you're going for clays I'd look for a lighter 12g personally, but if she has a 20g she likes that's okay too. If the stock needs to be very, very high is it worth looking at the pitch instead? Just a thought. ETA following PM my point is that it might be a general gun fit problem. Can't tell without looking. It's just that the butt of my gun was massacred because ladies have breasts and therefore need their stocks on upside down dontcha know. This has just been fixed. Edited October 20, 2013 by ehb102 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbiep Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 My wife is of a similar height / build / weight, and has ended up with a silver pigeon in 20 bore. The gun itself is a fair bit lighter in 20 as opposed to 12, and to her, that makes a considerable difference. She uses it for clays, pest control, a bit of game shooting, and is extremely happy with it. Paired with 21-24g cartridges, she is happy to carry and shoot it all day. I suspect with a 12 bore that would not be the case. One last point (maybe irrelevant). The 20 bore may well hold its value better in 10-20 years, due to it being a bit more rare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaserF3 Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 A good article on the subject http://www.shotgunlife.com/shotgun-lives/women-shooters/women-and-shotguns.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun4860 Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 this thread is useless without pictures..... Sorry I'll get me coat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pontbeck Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 The ladies I know who shoot fall into two categories. The ones who use their guns for game and shoot clays for fun outside the season have 20g because they don't want to carry a heavy gun in the field all day. The ones who like shooting clays and think of themselves as clay shooters have 12g sporters that they will happily shoot game with occasionally. The tiniest clay shooting ladies I know have DT10s and DT11s. My 6' husband shoots clays with a 20g because he is what my father calls "a swivel chair warrier" and doesn't want to be holding up a 7lb gun for 100 clays. He suffers with the kick though, although I've put him on 21g cartridges. The consequence was: it's an individual choice. If you're going for clays I'd look for a lighter 12g personally, but if she has a 20g she likes that's okay too. If the stock needs to be very, very high is it worth looking at the pitch instead? Just a thought. ETA following PM my point is that it might be a general gun fit problem. Can't tell without looking. It's just that the butt of my gun was massacred because ladies have breasts and therefore need their stocks on upside down dontcha know. This has just been fixed.[/quote Couldn't agree more , if it's primarily clays with a bit of game , definitely a 12. If it's an all round gun a 20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) A good article on the subject http://www.shotgunli...d-shotguns.html Mike - it is well worth a read. :good: Edited October 20, 2013 by Gordon R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peteri Posted October 20, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 Thanks - excellent article and excellent points. I think pitch is definitely a contributing factor, when we were checking out fit yesterday - it's what that article says, the stock needs to be close to upside down. Her mount isn't always consistent and I think that's related. She's definitely a clay shooter - would be surprised if it were ever anything else at all Thanks again for all the opinions - more the merrier! Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 Very good article and one I shall print for clients I teach a lot of ladies to shoot. A fair few turn up with Dads old gun or husbands spare. At the larger grounds it's nice having 10-12 20 bores to choose from to get the fit correct for her. Pitch will may a massive difference to her even a recoil pad with the toe reduced a lot make a nice difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
throdgrain Posted October 20, 2013 Report Share Posted October 20, 2013 Loading an 1100 is a faf??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehb102 Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 Please, gents, when fitting a gun to a woman don't perpetuate the myth that the toe needs removing. It really doesn't. Straight pitch, maybe but not the toe. The attached picture is the state of my gun now. It took a lady coach to recognise the problem. Now the gun looks like hell but fits properly in my shoulder. Before I was trying to balance it far too centrally. It made going gun down near impossible. Obviously the gunsmith made the "large breasts, toe off" deduction. That was a wrong decision. If anyone wants to bring their lady to try my short stock 12 bore get in touch. With 21g cartridges it feels lovely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehb102 Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) Trying again for pic. See the nice white bit of wood that I had put in last week? Feh! Edited October 21, 2013 by ehb102 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 Trying again for pic. See the nice white bit of wood that I had put in last week? Feh! That's stupid and he didn't know what he was doing the toe off is a slight chamfer not inches as he obliviously did it would all be in the recoil pad not the stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferguson_tom Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 My wife struggles with the weight of a 12g when clay shooting, my gun fits her quite well and is a game gun so quite light. She borrowed a 20g and enjoyed shooting a lot more as she didnt get as tired and achey. I would suggest try your wife with a 12g that fits properly and take her for a round of clays and see how she feels after it, they could simply be too heavy for her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 There are some lightweight 12 around that weigh less than many 20's franchi Falconet being one As for that abortion of a stock job get it properly sorted! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehb102 Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 There are some lightweight 12 around that weigh less than many 20's franchi Falconet being one As for that abortion of a stock job get it properly sorted! I'm going with this version for a bit to see how it works. I suspect I might need a little bit more length as well. This is my first gun and I've had it since January, so I'm still in the continuous learning stage. New mount, new hand position and new stock all in the last three weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) Where are you? What gun is it? And who made that awful cut? On my phone sorry for bring breif! Edited October 21, 2013 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehb102 Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 I'm in Cambridge. It's my gun. The original fit was done by a local gunsmith, an established figure on the local clay shooting scene for many years now. If you know the Cambridgeshire clay shooting scene, you'll know this chap. The best I can say is that I was a bit fatter in January than I am now and this is a very traditional cut. The new fit was done by Don Custerson. I'm liking it much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mda998 Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 +1 for Don Custerson top gunsmith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted October 21, 2013 Report Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) Dont know cambridge, glad your shooting well with it... Having some experience in the field of introducing ladies to shooting this is what i found. 1) gun weight is a big issue the first time out but gets less so as muscle memory is built but weight helps soak up recoil 2) choice of underwear is critical as is footwear 3) a raised comb often helps an adjustable is best 4) 21g from a 12 gauge kicks as much 21g from a 20g but it costs less 5) a balanced gun is better than unbalanced, shortening the stock often unbalances the gun making it barrel heavy...... 6) most women shooters start on a 20 bore then progress to a 12... Edited October 21, 2013 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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