Dakers Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 So after the stress of one leak that required me taking part of my hallway to bits and the Insurance Company sending out an emergency plumber to fix that, I've found my shower is leaking somewhere through to the ceiling below! Only seems to be when I'm using the shower, so I've had a bath the last couple of nights. Trouble is, I can't find a plumber locally who wants to come out and take a look. I'm not in a great rush, as I can keep the water on with this leak, but I'd still like it looked at as it's a bit of a PITA. Three plumbers I've tried, all who say they're too busy. One was worried it might be a bigger job when I said the pipework is behind the tiles, and didn't want to get involved (and I've only been trying to pick the ones that say they do bathroom installs, so the tiling shouldn't be an issue for them) The others didn't even want me to leave my details to follow up with, which irked me a bit. I'd happily wait a week for it to be looked at. I wish I could be in a profession where I could turn down work like this! I can't give my money away... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) Phone your insurance company again and tell them you think your shower is leaking now. They will soon find you a plumber when faced with another bill for water damage. Edited October 20, 2015 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dakers Posted October 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 I did try that on Sunday, so they could get their Dynorod/British Gas guys back out again. Never had the call back from them within the four hours so left it, and rang yesterday and even the Insurance people couldn't get through to them. The emergency plumbers are coming as part of a £500 limit I seem to have that doesn't actually register against my insurance. However it won't cover any of the putting right afterwards. I'm keen not to replace my whole shower unit, but I'm aware it may have to come out temporarily while someone figures out what's wrong. I'd still need someone to come in afterwards and make good of the mess, so I was hoping to have one person do it all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLuke Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 I assume its not a simple case of the silicone around the shower cubicle/bath? Seems slightly odd that its not a constant leak with the water on meaning it is between valve and head - otherwise would leak constantly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dakers Posted October 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Doesn't seem to be, and seems to be something going on higher up the side of the shower unit, judging by the way the grout has discoloured and pulled away. I'll let the emergency plumber take a look when they turn up, and go from there. I'll still need to put it right, just rather not have to go through the insurance for the rest of it.I'd rather pay upfront now than have a claim against my record. Just more miffed that there seems to be so much work around these guys don't need to follow up new leads at all. Nice position to be in! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackpowder Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Itrs not like a pipe leak I would say from past experience the seal between shower tray and tiles is faulty, expecially if as you say it only leaks when in use. Blackpowder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLuke Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) If that grout pictured is on the inside of the cubicle then it will leak A pound to a pinch of salt says if you put the shower head on that joint it will pour out below. Rake out the grout, bit of new grout, job done. Edited October 20, 2015 by LondonLuke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dakers Posted October 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 The discoloured/disjointed grout is on the outside of the cubicle, and about 3 feet off the ground. It's pulled away on that joint most of the way up the wall. The step out is where the pipework is hidden behind. I've just had one plumber poke his head round and he thinks the rest if the grout in the shower area might be naff and leaking through generally. Said the sealant looks in good nick all the way around. Could mean having to have the shower enclosure out, tiles and plasterboard off, new ply, and then get it all refitted and retiled. Annoying, as I wasn't really keen on refitting that corner of my bathroom, especially having just had to pay out a significant amount to the Ex as part of the divorce for this house. Oh well, life happens :-) I'll wait and get some quotes to do the work, as it's a bit beyond me I think. In the meantime I'm off to buy a shower curtain to string up to use the hose over the bath. If anyone does want any work up round this way and wants to quote, drop me a line. Would rather it went to someone in the community. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winston72 Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Itrs not like a pipe leak I would say from past experience the seal between shower tray and tiles is faulty, expecially if as you say it only leaks when in use. Blackpowder +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elgreco Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) Removing everything and replacing seems a bit OTT. I think you would probably get away with raking out the grout and regrouting without removing the tiles from the walls if they are not loose Good luck getting a plumber they are getting as picky as gas fitters as to which jobs they want to do Cheers Tom Edited October 20, 2015 by elgreco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banger123 Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 I'm a plumber and it looks like the tilling needs to be renewed, the wall behind will probably be shot as well. Make sure whoever does it uses moisture resistant board or wedi board as it will just happen again. Also seal the shower tray to the wall then tile down to the tray them seal again with good quality mastic. Doing it on the cheap I'm afraid will not work. Good luck in finding someone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dakers Posted October 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Thanks Chaps. I've had another dig around and I think the sealant around one side of the exterior of the shower isn't great. Feels almost crunchy if I run a finger along it. I tried putting the hose just on that corner and there was water coming all the way down the back edge of the tray. Still waiting for the insurance emergency plumber to turn up, hopefully I can get his opinion on this. I'm hoping it's not the tiling and go out as I'd guess it's all been done within the last 10 years given my knowledge of the property. As you say though, who knows what is behind the tiles. I'd like to think whoever did it, did it properly the first time around though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remimax Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) The discoloured/disjointed grout is on the outside of the cubicle, and about 3 feet off the ground. It's pulled away on that joint most of the way up the wall. The step out is where the pipework is hidden behind. I've just had one plumber poke his head round and he thinks the rest if the grout in the shower area might be naff and leaking through generally. Said the sealant looks in good nick all the way around. Could mean having to have the shower enclosure out, tiles and plasterboard off, new ply, and then get it all refitted and retiled. Annoying, as I wasn't really keen on refitting that corner of my bathroom, especially having just had to pay out a significant amount to the Ex as part of the divorce for this house. Oh well, life happens :-) I'll wait and get some quotes to do the work, as it's a bit beyond me I think. In the meantime I'm off to buy a shower curtain to string up to use the hose over the bath. If anyone does want any work up round this way and wants to quote, drop me a line. Would rather it went to someone in the community. never ever,ever use ply in a shower enclosure,slightest crack in the grout and its game over,there is purpose made cement based tile board like hardy backer for the job. see it time and time again on shower failures good old ply swelling , up with tiles falling off. Edited October 20, 2015 by Remimax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 We always used this stuff; http://www.wickes.co.uk/Knauf-Aquapanel-Tile-Backing-Board-1200x900x12-5mm/p/220561 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dakers Posted October 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Thanks all, ever so much for all this information. Never expected everyone to volunteer and take time to post it, so thanks. Given what I've been told, I've spotted this: Looks like the sealant on the outside isn't great in that corner, and from the dark stain where the tray surround normally is, looks like it runs down the back edge of that against the wall and collects on the floor. Wonder if it's simply that, and the capillary action is taking it up the wall and causing it to swell slightly, giving the cracking of the grout on the exterior of the enclosure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLuke Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) never ever,ever use ply in a shower enclosure,slightest crack in the grout and its game over,there is purpose made cement based tile board like hardy backer for the job. see it time and time again on shower failures good old ply swelling , up with tiles falling off. Odd, my preference would be WBP or marine ply in a bathroom. I assume its not a simple case of the silicone around the shower cubicle/bath? Seems slightly odd that its not a constant leak with the water on meaning it is between valve and head - otherwise would leak constantly. Thanks Chaps. I've had another dig around and I think the sealant around one side of the exterior of the shower isn't great. Feels almost crunchy if I run a finger along it. I tried putting the hose just on that corner and there was water coming all the way down the back edge of the tray. Still waiting for the insurance emergency plumber to turn up, hopefully I can get his opinion on this. I'm hoping it's not the tiling and go out as I'd guess it's all been done within the last 10 years given my knowledge of the property. As you say though, who knows what is behind the tiles. I'd like to think whoever did it, did it properly the first time around though. *gets Blackpowder and Winston* *all hold hands* *all bow* Edited October 20, 2015 by LondonLuke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figgy Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) Dig out the old sealant and grout get a grout remover,clean up and regrout with good showerproof grout reseal the tray after cleaning with solvent where you seal and with good sealant and see if it fixes it. From what I've seen on your photos the wall and water marks are not to bad, it can't have been leaking for to long. If after you regrout and seal it still leaks which if done right I doubt it will then it's only cost a few quid and your time. Most leaks are from the seal between tray and wall. I'm just doing my showers in my house and have used CT1 sealant expensive but good. Edited October 20, 2015 by figgy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLuke Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Dig out the old sealant and grout get a grout remover,clean up and regrout with good showerproof grout reseal the tray after cleaning with solvent where you seal and with good sealant and see if it fixes it. From what I've seen on your photos the wall and water marks are not to bad, it can't have been leaking for to long. If after you regrout and seal it still leaks which if done right I doubt it will then it's only cost a few quid and your time. Most leaks are from the seal between tray and wall. I'm just doing my showers in my house and have used CT1 sealant expensive but good. CT1 good but Dow Corning 785 a good alternative Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winnie&bezza Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 I was just going to say that people forget/don't seal the tray to wall and then tile down to Gary and seal again but banger123 beat me to it and going by your pic then that it what is causing it! Take off bottom row of tiles above tray and seal the tray to wall then re-tile. As fight says, CT1 is like gods ****k! Brilliant stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magman Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 looks like a cheap fiberglass tray to me loads of flexing and poor seals don't mix , could be grout joints but unsure with out pics ? But what do i no Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remimax Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Odd, my preference would be WBP or marine ply in a bathroom. *gets Blackpowder and Winston* *all hold hands* *all bow* nothing odd about sir ply is the choice of the diy & uneducated . the clue is in the name " cement based tileing board"! WPB ply when exposed to water swells and marine ply is more expensive than purpose made cement tile board. bit of a no brainer really or am i missing something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLuke Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 (edited) nothing odd about sir ply is the choice of the diy & uneducated . the clue is in the name " cement based tileing board"! WPB ply when exposed to water swells and marine ply is more expensive than purpose made cement tile board. bit of a no brainer really or am i missing something? Horses for courses I would say - think the comment of uneducated a little dismissive. The bathrooms we do are all high end so we spec marine ply as we feel this is the best all rounder. We have found cement board heavy and more of an effort to cut as well as the recommendation to have plastic sheeting (as well as tape and jointing) all extra work compared to marine ply. WBP ply is specified by architects for exterior use too and is, in my experience, incredibly water resistant when left to the elements. Edited October 21, 2015 by LondonLuke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 Cement based board is a pig to cut, you can't fix within 50 mm of the edges and it comes in silly sizes. Plus it worse than loft insulation when it comes to irritant levels Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxshooter69 Posted October 21, 2015 Report Share Posted October 21, 2015 I'd be inclined to make a solid frame underneath that tray to stop any flex/movement in the tray when you are standing in it, the weight could possibly break the sealant seal when you are standing in the shower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) Can I suggest that as an ex Plumber and Gasfitter, I would be very reluctant to look at a job such as yours for several reasons really. I would want to virtually remove the entire shower unit and having made good the rotted areas, then replace the unit. You in turn would probably not be too happy with the cost of such a venture. You must remember that the 'last man there' will be the first to be contacted should a leak reoccur and for that reason alone I would want to be as certain as possible, I would not be coming back. As suggested, make sure the base is well supported, especially if it is a wooden floor, to try and stop any movement in the base unit which would break the seal. Edited October 22, 2015 by Westley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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