Sussexboy Posted February 3, 2016 Report Share Posted February 3, 2016 We had our club AGM last night and there seems to be a rumour going round that smokeless powder will need to be stored in a wooden box the same as black powder. I don't recall reading anything about this. Anybody else heard anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted February 3, 2016 Report Share Posted February 3, 2016 FEO told me the same. some on here said it was rubbish but seems its not. there was thread about it a couple of weeks ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sussexboy Posted February 3, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2016 Thanks, I'll have a search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted February 3, 2016 Report Share Posted February 3, 2016 http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/327781-powder-storage/?do=findComment&comment=2973420 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phaedra1106 Posted February 3, 2016 Report Share Posted February 3, 2016 As confirmed to me by David (BASC) there is no requirement for smokeless powders to stored in wooden boxes. The wording on the HSE documentation is incorrect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrowning2 Posted February 3, 2016 Report Share Posted February 3, 2016 As confirmed to me by David (BASC) there is no requirement for smokeless powders to stored in wooden boxes. The wording on the HSE documentation is incorrect. ? So the hse write the legislation ER2014 that is made lawful by an act of parliament but basc say the wording is incorrect !!! David (basc) please can you post why/how you think we do not have to comply with ER2014? Because as per my post in link above the only argument I can see is "should be" the same as "must be"? ER2014 is not voluntary it has the same legal status as all the various firearms law we cannot just chose to ignore it. so whist I agree it is a pain to have to comply and use a wooden box I fail to see how we can use the augment that basc say the wording is incorrect when and if an FEO asks how we store are reloading powder and the FEO enforces ER2014. So David please enlighten us, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berthaboo Posted February 3, 2016 Report Share Posted February 3, 2016 What of the reloading components need to be locked up ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walshie Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 The only reloading components I lock up are expanding bullets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbiep Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 The only reloading components I lock up are expanding bullets. Interesting. I also secure primers - on the basis that I must present my FAC to purchase them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 I store my powders in the container they came in, tipping it all in a wooden box is dangerous. I don't lock any components away. Non issue as any one could get my angle grinder and pri bars to get in the cabinets. Red tape clap trap. Just a thought! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berthaboo Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 I have to show my license to get power too they also log what was sold and how much as well as log my details. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbiep Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 I have to show my license to get power too they also log what was sold and how much as well as log my details. I assume that's pyrodex or BP ? Never had to show my FAC for buying smokeless powders, or had details logged Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 I assume that's pyrodex or BP ? Never had to show my FAC for buying smokeless powders, or had details logged As of last year there is an EU barcode system that powder has to be log to final user, however it never seemed to amount to anything in Britain but some RFDs are doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 I store my powders in the container they came in, tipping it all in a wooden box is dangerous. I don't lock any components away. Non issue as any one could get my angle grinder and pri bars to get in the cabinets. Red tape clap trap. Just a thought! You should put the original container in a wooden box, expanding bullets should but stored the same as full rounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 You should put the original container in a wooden box, expanding bullets should but stored the same as full rounds.They are, an old wooden cabinet.Never did with missiles, lock them up that is. Many shops don't lock them up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berthaboo Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 Robbiep Its Blc-2 I buy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 This is all creeping rule making, there is no requirements about storing powder, there is no requirement to produce your licence when buying powder, but if people get told something enough times they start to believe it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 This is all creeping rule making, there is no requirements about storing powder, there is no requirement to produce your licence when buying powder, but if people get told something enough times they start to believe it But there is hse ER2014 Regulation 27(3)(b), © and (d) disapplies separation distance requirements for keeping small quantities of shooters’ powder, water-based explosives and detonating cord. The following sections describe the conditions that should be met to qualify for the disapplication. These conditions apply at all premises including domestic premises. Shooters’ powder 2 Shooters’ powder includes both black powder and smokeless powder. 3 The powder should be kept in containers with no more than 1 kg of powder per container. The containers should be constructed in such a way that, in the event of a fire they do not provide additional containment that will either increase the explosive force of any deflagration or cause smokeless powder to detonate. Normally plastic/polythene or paper/cloth containers should be used. Metal containers with a screw cap or a push-in lid must not be used. 4 Although shooters’ powders are generally not very sensitive to ignition by electrostatic discharge, homeloaders or others who decant the contents of plastic containers should take care to reduce the risk of static electricity build-up. Advice on precautions may be sought from the manufacturer. 5 The containers of powder should be kept in a box constructed of plywood with a minimum thickness of 18 mm and a maximum thickness of 24 mm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 (edited) All powders are now designated as 'shooters powders' ....black powder is now required by law to be stored in an approved container....so it will not be a massive step for the authorities to insist nitro powder is a 'Shooters Powder' so needs to be treated as and stored in the same manner! Another slash in the 'Death by a thousand cuts' shooting is presently suffering from the authorities......that our representative organisations failed to identify and protect us from! Edited February 5, 2016 by panoma1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 Its a misuse of the term shooters powder. I cant speak for the other organisations, you will need to contact them to see what they are doing about it, but BASC are in discussion with the HSE about this. For nitro-cellulose propellants of hazard type 3. no separation distance applies for stores of powder less than 15kg. A home loader does not need to store nitro-cellulose propellants in a partitioned wooden box so long as he is storing less than 15kilos where no other powder (i.e. black powder) is held. Regulation 7 of the Explosives Regulations 2014 provide full details of what explosive and ammunition combinations may be held If any BASC member has problems or questions about this please get in touch with our firearms team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrowningB525 Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 The containers of powder should be kept in a box constructed of plywood with a minimum thickness of 18 mm and a maximum thickness of 24 mm. It says should not shall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 (edited) My tame FEO said it only applies to amounts over 15kg and thats no different to how it was before. Below 15 kg there is an exemption for shooters provided it is for private use. It is a fire issue only and nothing to do with security. Its an HSE regulation and not a firearms licencing matter. He also said all powder should come with a hazchem sticker on it and a lot doesn't, but as long as its catagory (whatever he said) its OK He also said in his opinion it should be lower, anyone who keeps 15kg of powder in their house mad. He was aware that some authorities are saying these things. . this is also incorrect http://www.####.co.uk/page1.pdf Edited February 7, 2016 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 I personally don't have a problem with storing powder in a box, you've got to put it somewhere. I don't have a problem showing my fac when buying powder, primers or bullets, after all why would you want it if your not making up rounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Its all a mute point really. Come October you could if so sadly inclined fill a van with fireworks in short time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortune Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 (edited) The problem with all of this is that it is like the tide of a thousand cuts. All of this isn't being turned back why is fes putting that on their site when it isn't right. (Is there a ruling in this law that certificates have to Be shown on purchase? Or is it misinterpretation?) Why are people kind of accepting more and more regulations by saying that they don't have a problem with complying when it is just a made up law or a bent interpretation of some law. http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/327781-powder-storage/?do=findComment&comment=2973420 Edited February 7, 2016 by fortune Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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