Think I may have been scammed

[leeds chimp]

FCA/PRA but you will have to push them, the same as with card transactions. They have to investigate and you do have a right to recovery, you are however at the mercy of how hard they try, same with credit cards.

Sorry but going to have to disagree..,

You are covered under section 75 for most card payments aslong as the cost is over £100 to £30000 but a bank transfer is as good as cash and therefore not covered for fraud etc....

 

Again which is the legislation that covers a bank transfer to a person or business that them goes wrong?

[ElvisThePelvis]

Sorry but going to have to disagree..,

You are covered under section 75 for most card payments aslong as the cost is over £100 to £30000 but a bank transfer is as good as cash and therefore not covered for fraud etc....

Again which is the legislation that covers a bank transfer to a person or business that them goes wrong?

This is within the banking code and regulation stipulated by EU driven FCA and PRA regulation, transfers are not as good/bad as cash, they leave a trail which can be tracked and investigated as as a non genuine transaction, you have the same right to recovery. Do not be fobbed off by Banks. The biggest barrier to both recovery channels if processed by a third party if they don't have a clear cancellation of recovery policy. I have seen this succeed and fail from both 'sides of the fence', banks will not volunteer to help you, they exist for their benefit, not yours.

[Cranfield]

I would suggest a personal visit is not wise, if it could involve you in a physical dispute, started by you or not.

As I suggested earlier, a phone call to Guns on Pegs is probably your best bet.

[leeds chimp]

This is within the banking code and regulation stipulated by EU driven FCA and PRA regulation, transfers are not as good/bad as cash, they leave a trail which can be tracked and investigated as as a non genuine transaction, you have the same right to recovery. Do not be fobbed off by Banks. The biggest barrier to both recovery channels if processed by a third party if they don't have a clear cancellation of recovery policy. I have seen this succeed and fail from both 'sides of the fence', banks will not volunteer to help you, they exist for their benefit, not yours.

Again how is it a non genuine transaction? If the account holder has authorized the payment to go.... your only hope is to re call the transaction before its claimed by the other bank (highly unlikely) or the other bank refund it (again very highly unlikely)

 

The only way to deal with it is as fraud which the police would have to deal with... the bank would not deal with it as you have authorized the payment to go and have not paid by card

Please post a link or something to back up your claim as I have never heard of this protection in all the cases I have dealt with

[Dunkield]

That's not true, you have right to recovery through cheque, transfer and credit card, banks won't tell you this though unless you push them. They have a regulated duty to investigate 'non genuine' transactions and a duty of car to you, their client.

 

Despite the law, you may also find banks are quite flexible if you speak to them.

I paid for an event on-line using my debit card rather than credit card, the event never happened and the organising company when into liquidation.

I managed to find an actual person to speak to at the bank (Lloyds) and explained the whole situation to them.

After taking down every bit of detail and checking websites etc they refunded the money back to my account in full.

The only condition was that if they saw a refund to me from the organisers they would reclaim their refund back - which is perfectly fair.

[leeds chimp]

 

Despite the law, you may also find banks are quite flexible if you speak to them.

I paid for an event on-line using my debit card rather than credit card, the event never happened and the organising company when into liquidation.

I managed to find an actual person to speak to at the bank (Lloyds) and explained the whole situation to them.

After taking down every bit of detail and checking websites etc they refunded the money back to my account in full.

The only condition was that if they saw a refund to me from the organisers they would reclaim their refund back - which is perfectly fair.

How much was that for?

They can use chargeback sometimes or section 75 if over £100

 

 

He gave them the money by bank transfer... , the fact they decieved him is irrelevant in the banks eyes he has asked for funds to go....... thats the bottom line. and in that respect the bank wont take it on as "Fraud" The reasons behind him transferring the funds are irrelevant or who they were to be sent to and what for.

 

If the money was of course taken from his account without consent bingo "Fraud payment " easily dealt with.

[AVB]

This is within the banking code and regulation stipulated by EU driven FCA and PRA regulation, transfers are not as good/bad as cash, they leave a trail which can be tracked and investigated as as a non genuine transaction, you have the same right to recovery. Do not be fobbed off by Banks. The biggest barrier to both recovery channels if processed by a third party if they don't have a clear cancellation of recovery policy. I have seen this succeed and fail from both 'sides of the fence', banks will not volunteer to help you, they exist for their benefit, not yours.

Regarding payments by Internet transfers. Banks are under no obligation to refund you if it turns out that your purchase goes bad. Under FCA (not PRA) they have a duty to assist any investigation, so would need to confirm what was paid when and to whom, if asked and they also have an obligation to treat customers fairly.

 

However they don't have to compensate you in the same way as for a credit card transaction. They may but they don't have to.

[MrM]

My daughter had a similar case a couple of weeks ago Saw a compound bow advertised on a Facebook archery group at a very good price (£180). Paid by bank transfer on a Saturday morning, on the Sunday the guy messaged back saying what was happening and claiming that she had "re-called" the money (she hadn't, and I doubt you could on a Sunday anyway), and that he would "go to the sorting office on Monday and get the package back (not sure how). Monday morning messaged again and said that money had re-appeared in his account and that she would get the bow by Monday evening - obviously that never happened!

 

At this stage we kind of knew it was a scam, she contacted the bank who said their fraud department would get back to her next day. When they rang they informed her they had tried to recall the money from the guy's bank account but he had already withdrawn it, and as she had willingly sent it is was not their responsibility. Suggested she registered a report with Action Fraud, which she has done. When she initially rang the local police they said not their remit!

 

The person has since taken his FB account down.

 

 

When you rang up about the puppies and then asked about the shoot, what did they say about the money you had already paid as a deposit?

Edited May 19, 2016 by MrM

[secretagentmole]

My daughter had a similar case a couple of weeks ago Saw a compound bow advertised on a Facebook archery group at a very good price (£180). Paid by bank transfer on a Saturday morning, on the Sunday the guy messaged back saying what was happening and claiming that she had "re-called" the money (she hadn't, and I doubt you could on a Sunday anyway), and that he would "go to the sorting office on Monday and get the package back (not sure how). Monday morning messaged again and said that money had re-appeared in his account and that she would get the bow by Monday evening - obviously that never happened!

 

At this stage we kind of knew it was a scam, she contacted the bank who said their fraud department would get back to her next day. When they rang they informed her they had tried to recall the money from the guy's bank account but he had already withdrawn it, and as she had willingly sent it is was not their responsibility. Suggested she registered a report with Action Fraud, which she has done. When she initially rang the local police they said not their remit!

 

The person has since taken his FB account down.

 

 

When you rang up about the puppies and then asked about the shoot, what did they say about the money you had already paid as a deposit?

Seeing as you allegedly know the persons location why not have a word with their local force? As happened over the notorious Cheltenham outfit that scammed airgunners?

[MrM]

Seeing as you allegedly know the persons location why not have a word with their local force? As happened over the notorious Cheltenham outfit that scammed airgunners?

 

The guy said he was from Poole - but the bank account sort code was in Essex, and when I was able to look at his FB profile, pretty much everything had been uploaded only a few days previously, so I very much doubt he was from there - he was very careful not to give out his address either. It stated he worked for a large Courier organisation, which when I googled their website his name came up as an employee - but in Northern Ireland, where incidentally he stated he went to school and college!

Edited May 19, 2016 by MrM

[shoot and be safe]

Have spoken to the bank and there is a little glimmer of hope. They are investigating and if there is still sufficient funds in his account, i may get some monies back. It is now a waiting game.

 

Spoke to guns on pegs and someone is going to give me a ring back. I dont expect them to do anything apart from take the guy's page down from their site. After all, I only used them to make the initial contact.

 

I have learnt a very expensive lessons from this and dont expect to receive anything back. Anything I do will be a bonus.

 

On a positive side, I have saved the price of 500 cartrages and as I only paid half the subs for this syndicate as way of a deposit, I still have the other half to buy five 100 bird days elsewhere.

 

Thanks for your advice so far,

All the best

Mark

[Dunkield]

How much was that for?

 

Either £600 or £660, I can't remember now, I remember being glad to see it again though

[JDog]

I am confident that you will get all of your money back. Just imagine the loss of business Guns on Pegs will suffer if word gets round that one of their shoots has acted in this way.

[Cranfield]

Sabs, I agree you should not minimise the responsibility of Guns on Pegs, if nobody rings you today, ring them again tomorrow.

[davewh100]

take burnley dave he likes going to sort door probs out

[rimfire4969]

I have booked some days using guns on pegs in the past but as you say it's just the first point of contact, not sure how liable that makes them but as a company they may well be able to lend a bit of weight to help.

 

Makes me wonder the best way of paying the deposit to shoots, I normally send a cheque then the balance on the day.

[shoot and be safe]

Qiuck update.

 

Guns on pegs have been in contact with the shoot in question mentioning I have concerns about the shoot.

I have also received a email from them saying that the keeper will be in touch and that he has promised them (GOP) that I will receive a full refund.

Well done Guns On Pegs

 

I have also received a email back off the keeper explaining the situation.

It says that the landowners are not renewing his lease and that he is also to vacate his home within the month.

He goes on to say that all monies he received has been spent on the birds for this coming season and that he has explained the situation to the game farm. The game farm will reimburse him the money and when he receives it he will then refund me.

I am a little doubtful that this will happen, but one neverknows.

 

 

As I said earlier, this is a expensive lessons learned and if I do get anything back it will be a bonus.

[hodge911]

good luck mate I honestly do hope you get refunded ..........................................................

 

 

 

 

but I still get a slight wiff of fish when reading

[reggiegun]

Qiuck update.

Guns on pegs have been in contact with the shoot in question mentioning I have concerns about the shoot.

I have also received a email from them saying that the keeper will be in touch and that he has promised them (GOP) that I will receive a full refund.

Well done Guns On Pegs

I have also received a email back off the keeper explaining the situation.

It says that the landowners are not renewing his lease and that he is also to vacate his home within the month.

He goes on to say that all monies he received has been spent on the birds for this coming season and that he has explained the situation to the game farm. The game farm will reimburse him the money and when he receives it he will then refund me.

I am a little doubtful that this will happen, but one neverknows.

As I said earlier, this is a expensive lessons learned and if I do get anything back it will be a bonus.

 

 

Would of thought the lease is negotiated, before any outlay on birds happens. Not good for the shooting fraternity, what would of happened if you didn't chase your money.

[magman]

Qiuck update.

 

Guns on pegs have been in contact with the shoot in question mentioning I have concerns about the shoot.

I have also received a email from them saying that the keeper will be in touch and that he has promised them (GOP) that I will receive a full refund.

Well done Guns On Pegs

 

I have also received a email back off the keeper explaining the situation.

It says that the landowners are not renewing his lease and that he is also to vacate his home within the month.

He goes on to say that all monies he received has been spent on the birds for this coming season and that he has explained the situation to the game farm. The game farm will reimburse him the money and when he receives it he will then refund me.

I am a little doubtful that this will happen, but one neverknows.

 

 

As I said earlier, this is a expensive lessons learned and if I do get anything back it will be a bonus.

 

 

He pays up front for birds

[scotslad]

good luck mate I honestly do hope you get refunded ..........................................................

 

 

 

 

but I still get a slight wiff of fish when reading

Must admit i have heard of things like this happening before, quite rare thou.

I also have heard of folk paying up front for birds or atleast a deposit or %.

 

It is a strange thing with more and more shoots encouraging folk to pay upfront in advance

[secretagentmole]

Qiuck update.

 

Guns on pegs have been in contact with the shoot in question mentioning I have concerns about the shoot.

I have also received a email from them saying that the keeper will be in touch and that he has promised them (GOP) that I will receive a full refund.

Well done Guns On Pegs

 

I have also received a email back off the keeper explaining the situation.

It says that the landowners are not renewing his lease and that he is also to vacate his home within the month.

He goes on to say that all monies he received has been spent on the birds for this coming season and that he has explained the situation to the game farm. The game farm will reimburse him the money and when he receives it he will then refund me.

I am a little doubtful that this will happen, but one neverknows.

 

 

As I said earlier, this is a expensive lessons learned and if I do get anything back it will be a bonus.

Did you get their address?

[shoot and be safe]

Sorry, yes it was deposit on birds.

 

 

 

I'm glad I found out now rather than on the first day of the season.

Suspicions were brought to my attention having spoken with a shooting pal, that had been told there was a keeper in the area leaving his estate.

It was only last night that I had confirmation that it was this syndicate I had joined and this has now been confirmed by the keeper himself.

 

I will agree that there is a strong smell of fish regarding this situation now and I am looking a little foolish for being caught out.

All I will say is that I spent a lot of time researching this shoot and asked a lot of questions. I spent the best part of 90 minutes on the phone with the keeper before viewing the shoot, where I also spent a fair amount of time with him and his wife, as well as viewing the land.

Everything seemed in order and what you would expect to see on a shoot.

Countless emails were also exchanged before I took the plunge back in mid March.

 

I enjoy a wind up too much to be getting too worked up over this situation, which is keeping me level headed. Some may say I have received karma for all the wind ups I have been part of in the past. Hey ho, you pay your money, you take your chances.

 

All I have lost is 5 days shooting, which could have been a total washout, standing in a field, in the pouring rain and not a bird to be seen. Been there done that.

 

I will wait to see what occurs with the banks and if the keeper adds anything else.

 

Thanks for your time.

 

All the best

Mark

[reggiegun]

Sorry, yes it was deposit on birds.

I'm glad I found out now rather than on the first day of the season.

Suspicions were brought to my attention having spoken with a shooting pal, that had been told there was a keeper in the area leaving his estate.

It was only last night that I had confirmation that it was this syndicate I had joined and this has now been confirmed by the keeper himself.

I will agree that there is a strong smell of fish regarding this situation now and I am looking a little foolish for being caught out.

All I will say is that I spent a lot of time researching this shoot and asked a lot of questions. I spent the best part of 90 minutes on the phone with the keeper before viewing the shoot, where I also spent a fair amount of time with him and his wife, as well as viewing the land.

Everything seemed in order and what you would expect to see on a shoot.

Countless emails were also exchanged before I took the plunge back in mid March.

I enjoy a wind up too much to be getting too worked up over this situation, which is keeping me level headed. Some may say I have received karma for all the wind ups I have been part of in the past. Hey ho, you pay your money, you take your chances.

All I have lost is 5 days shooting, which could have been a total washout, standing in a field, in the pouring rain and not a bird to be seen. Been there done that.

I will wait to see what occurs with the banks and if the keeper adds anything else.

Thanks for your time.

All the best

Mark

 

None of it your fault Mark, it's the rip off keeper that should me named and shamed. He shouldn't be taking monies if the lease isn't even in place.

We pay our rent April, then order the birds after the rent is paid.

[shoot and be safe]

None of it your fault Mark, it's the rip off keeper that should me named and shamed. He shouldn't be taking monies if the lease isn't even in place.

We pay our rent April, then order the birds after the rent is paid.

Know what your saying, I just took it that he had been running the shoot on the estate for over 10 years it was a given that he had everything in place.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing to learn from.