davelid Posted October 16, 2016 Report Share Posted October 16, 2016 Hi don't know if this has been done before.I was out last night with the 17 Hmr and out of the 13 rabbits shot 6 of them the bullet did not expanded just passed right through. I am using 17g v max has anyone else experiences this? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casts_by_fly Posted October 16, 2016 Report Share Posted October 16, 2016 Where were they hit and at what range? Longer range and the bullet is losing energy which means less expansion. Softer tissues hits with minimal depth like a neck shot won't have enough resistance to get the bullet expanded before it is already through the other side. The rabbit was DRT though, right? So not really a problem. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted October 16, 2016 Report Share Posted October 16, 2016 If the bullet went right through how do you know it didn't expand ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davelid Posted October 16, 2016 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2016 Hi and thanks for reply it was happening at short and long distance's and yes thay all went in the back of the truck.it must be not hitting bone making no expanded thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted October 16, 2016 Report Share Posted October 16, 2016 It is probably expanding but if not hitting anything substantial passing right through. I have experienced same many times. Sometimes it looks like the rabbit died naturally not a mark another time a small bloody hole on the exit.. Remember the word ALWAYS, it doesn't apply to any rifle shooting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davelid Posted October 16, 2016 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2016 Nice one walker570 that's exactly what be happening to me .there were a few that did have a mark on them.not had the 17 long so it all new to me.loads different to shooting the .22lr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aldivalloch Posted October 16, 2016 Report Share Posted October 16, 2016 It is probably expanding but if not hitting anything substantial passing right through. I have experienced same many times. Sometimes it looks like the rabbit died naturally not a mark another time a small bloody hole on the exit.. Remember the word ALWAYS, it doesn't apply to any rifle shooting. Er, explain this one to me, please - how can a bullet that has expanded pass right through and leave the rabbit looking like it has "died naturally not a mark" or with "another time a small bloody hole on exit"? That's not my experience of bullets that have expanded - I've always found the exit hole to be a bit bigger than the entry wound..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilv Posted October 16, 2016 Report Share Posted October 16, 2016 (edited) I've used 15.5 grain Hornady V Max round quite a lot on rabbits and have found it very destructive at under about 90 yards. I've seen rabbits literally without a head, just a flap of skin like a ragged, bloody glove, and others with massive neck wounds. I've seen one rabbit shot instantly dead with the splatter off a rabbit a couple of feet in front of it that was my intended target. Out at 120 and 130 yards they are hit a lot less hard with much less damage. These rounds are very penetrating. In the spring, I shot a crow 40 yards off that was sitting by a gate. The bullet went right through the bottom steel bar on a new steel gate at 40 yards. I was surprised at that to be honest. It is a very powerful little round in my opinion. Maybe you are shooting your rabbits pretty far off when the bullet has lost energy. The only bad thing about the round for small vermin is the way the wind carries them away ona breezy day. If the wind is blowing, leave it at home and use your .22lr at 60 yard rabbits. Edited October 16, 2016 by Evilv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casts_by_fly Posted October 17, 2016 Report Share Posted October 17, 2016 Evilv, I think you need to check your ballistics. The HMR is a lot less affected by wind than the 22lr. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted October 17, 2016 Report Share Posted October 17, 2016 Er, explain this one to me, please - how can a bullet that has expanded pass right through and leave the rabbit looking like it has "died naturally not a mark" or with "another time a small bloody hole on exit"? That's not my experience of bullets that have expanded - I've always found the exit hole to be a bit bigger than the entry wound..... As I said, I have witnessed a number of times where the bullet has expanded but the exit hole was still very small. We are talking .17 going in and maybe .19 coming out, obviously leaving a hole but on a rabbit the fur hides the exit until you actually pick it up and check the facts. I have had them just lie there like they just died of natural causes, no blood etc etc. BUT bear in mind the word ALWAYS doesn't apply to bullet performance. Once it leaves the end of the barrel it is it's own free agent. Seen some seriously weird things happen over the last 50 years which it was impossible to explain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted October 17, 2016 Report Share Posted October 17, 2016 Evilv, I think you need to check your ballistics. The HMR is a lot less affected by wind than the 22lr. Rick The 15.5g NTX is only marginally so. I think what EVilv might have been getting at is instead of fighting the wind, choose to keep the range short when then the 22LR will suffice. That's how I read it anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPARKIE Posted October 17, 2016 Report Share Posted October 17, 2016 is it dead ? yes....don't worry about it. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aldivalloch Posted October 19, 2016 Report Share Posted October 19, 2016 As I said, I have witnessed a number of times where the bullet has expanded but the exit hole was still very small. We are talking .17 going in and maybe .19 coming out, obviously leaving a hole but on a rabbit the fur hides the exit until you actually pick it up and check the facts. I have had them just lie there like they just died of natural causes, no blood etc etc. BUT bear in mind the word ALWAYS doesn't apply to bullet performance. Once it leaves the end of the barrel it is it's own free agent. Seen some seriously weird things happen over the last 50 years which it was impossible to explain. Well, I suppose going from .17 to "maybe" .19 is - technically - expansion. But it's also just two hundredths of an inch. And with all due respect, I think you're stretching credibility if you're suggesting that you can tell the difference on soft animal tissue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benthejockey Posted October 19, 2016 Report Share Posted October 19, 2016 Possibly what you're seeing is a shrapnel wound. They do tend to explode once they get inside the skin. If you shoot them in the head you'll see it takes the opposite side of the face off generally give or take where in the head you hit them. If you shoot them in the chest then often there isn't any sign that you hit them apart from the thud and the dead rabbit, but squeeze the chest and you'll feel the smashed bones, sometimes you get a decent hole on the other side and some times you get a tiny exit wound. The little bullet is so frangible that it won't mushroom like heavy bullets it explodes, if a piece of shrapnel goes in the right direction it can pop out the other side making it appear that the bullet has drilled straight through. It's also how the first time I went and tried my nv out and was chest shooting everything I ended up with some with ruptured guts - shrapnel had bounced off ribs and gone for the path of least resistance into the belly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilv Posted October 20, 2016 Report Share Posted October 20, 2016 (edited) Evilv, I think you need to check your ballistics. The HMR is a lot less affected by wind than the 22lr. Rick The point is, at over a hundred yards on a breezy day, the HMR will be blown erratically since you probably can't gauge how much wind will be blowing on its path. The windage is obviously a lot worse at greater ranges, so unless you're a lot better than me, or live in a much less windy place, your ability to place teh shot correctly on small game will be pretty dodgy at long range in wind. Since the HMR costs about £32 a hundred and .22 about £6 or £7 a hundred, why waste money on the shots you can actually take on a windy day? You can take your rabbit at 50 or 60 yards in the wind for six or seven pence, not thirty-five. Just my opinion. Edited October 20, 2016 by Evilv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted October 20, 2016 Report Share Posted October 20, 2016 Its already been said, the HMR V-Max works/expands well, but there are possible exceptions for speed/distance/shot placement! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevieknuckles Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 Hello Davelid, I know this is an old post however I just wanted to back up what has been said by some of the guys on here. What has been happening is normal, the rounds are massed produced to a high standard but every shot and situation is slightly different, which for me is part of the enjoyment of shooting. Keep up the good work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 Its already been said, the HMR V-Max works/expands well, but there are possible exceptions for speed/distance/shot placement! Hence that word ALWAYS. It doesn't apply, even to any calibre, bullet, cartridge. Shoot enough and you will discover weird things can happen with no explanation. Just about to buy a new 17HMR and drawn to the straight pull Browning but may go back to the CZ I had before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davelid Posted January 8, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 Hi guys thanks for the comments. It happens quite often now no damage to be seen but rabbit stone dead great calibre just a shame you can't the ammo for it. I wanted to have the browning but went for the cz455 I've got no regrets Cheers dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redgum Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 Just as an ex smoker will be the worst critic on smoking then the same can be said for an ex hmr owner so I will not rant on about the calibre ....... but a ballistic tip bullet is designed to perform in soft tissue so maybe a post mortem will reveal the extent of internal damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donegalcharlie Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 is it dead ? yes....don't worry about it. lol Lmao 👍🏻 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyska Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 Just as an ex smoker will be the worst critic on smoking then the same can be said for an ex hmr owner so I will not rant on about the calibre ....... but a ballistic tip bullet is designed to perform in soft tissue so maybe a post mortem will reveal the extent of internal damage. I agree, I think. The HMR is probably the most frustrating calibre on the planet, it annoys me. Erratic at best and I've had many a rifle, different makes. My WMR isn't as accurate, but far far more consistent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redgum Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 I agree, I think. The HMR is probably the most frustrating calibre on the planet, it annoys me. Erratic at best and I've had many a rifle, different makes. My WMR isn't as accurate, but far far more consistent. yep you got it, had some brilliant still summer evenings shooting bunnies out to 150yds but had more days when I would have gladly used it to bang in fence posts. The final straw was ammo shortages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davelid Posted January 8, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 I think the pros out way the con regards getting rid of the 17 in my eyes .but the ammo situation is a joke . I've been using my 22 rim more because I've only got 50 hmr rounds left and I can't buy any Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe soapy Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 Wind drift is often brought up in the hmr arguments, yet the compartive test at 100 yds show it less affected than 22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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