What is wrong with this country?

[Whitebridges]

The system has more holes in it than a colander !

Two quick wins:

 

1. Come down really hard on businesses / individuals that are not paying their taxes.

2. Stop the long term "benefit babes" pilfering from the system and re-introduce workhouses.

[yod dropper]

For the past 2 months I have been working compliance cases for Child Tax & Working tax Credit.The cases I work are classed as High Value claims,i.e £15,000 -£36,000.This is without their Child Benifit and believe me 90% are UK residents (white)

 

 

Add on the child benefit, probable subsidised housing and the benefits that become available once in certain parts of the system, together with the earnings and the net figure is high. The equivalent gross salary figure would shock most people. The figures you're talking about could well equate to grossed up 6 figure salaries. However, try to take some of this off them and make the system fairer and directed more towards the most needy and you're nasty, declaring war on the poor and so on.

 

I'd like to see the value of all benefits rolled into one figure and taxed, the public would then get an idea of who the poorest were. Many of the 'most vulnerable' and 'most disadvantaged' would in fact be paying the higher rate of tax.

[Lloyd90]

The system has more holes in it than a colander !

Two quick wins:

 

1. Come down really hard on businesses / individuals that are not paying their taxes.

2. Stop the long term "benefit babes" pilfering from the system and re-introduce workhouses.

Can't you see the link between the two?

 

The hard working entrepreneurs and people who started companies self employed and struggled on don't want to pay loads of tax to support the scrounges who sit on their ***** all day doing nothing but holding their hands out asking for more!

 

I'm looking into whether I want to start a business in a sector I'm working in, it's a massive risk and be loads of work. If I'm successful I'd already be paying a huge chunk in tax. Why should businesses pay more?

[Whitebridges]

Can't you see the link between the two?

 

The hard working entrepreneurs and people who started companies self employed and struggled on don't want to pay loads of tax to support the scrounges who sit on their ***** all day doing nothing but holding their hands out asking for more!

 

I'm looking into whether I want to start a business in a sector I'm working in, it's a massive risk and be loads of work. If I'm successful I'd already be paying a huge chunk in tax. Why should businesses pay more?

 

Lloyd why do you think i posted in such an expressive way? I'd like to think i'm one of the former. The amount of of corporation tax i pay is a shocker, let alone other taxes such as import duty.

My attitude is if it's due it's due. The waste and how it's spent on the wrong people and causes get's my goat big time.

[Whitebridges]

 

Add on the child benefit, probable subsidised housing and the benefits that become available once in certain parts of the system, together with the earnings and the net figure is high. The equivalent gross salary figure would shock most people. The figures you're talking about could well equate to grossed up 6 figure salaries. However, try to take some of this off them and make the system fairer and directed more towards the most needy and you're nasty, declaring war on the poor and so on.

 

I'd like to see the value of all benefits rolled into one figure and taxed, the public would then get an idea of who the poorest were. Many of the 'most vulnerable' and 'most disadvantaged' would in fact be paying the higher rate of tax.

 

This is perfectly put and wholly accurate. Far too much smoke and mirrors as to who gets what and when. It's disgusting if you think about it. As an example we have a financial services regulator that has rules and regulations about "transparency" to consumers yet our governments make the benefits system that muddy your everyday toad feels so comfy he feels like a pig in ****.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Whitebridges

[pinfireman]

This is one of the very reasons I despise the uber capitalist system which chews and spits out humans lives all in the pursuit of profit. Sadly for us they are meticulous in their thieving endeavours and since they also own the msm and everything you and I get to see and read from birth till death they will make sure you end up pointing the finger at other equally hapless, dispossessed groups rather than the actual source of inequalities. If you don't believe me re-read your own post where you (at least think) race and colour has a bearing and that foreigners are "responsible" for your plight. This is despite the FACT studies and factual records show "foreigners" (on the whole) bring their own investments and make a net contribution. Look around you with an open mind, do they ALL live on hand outs or milk the system or are most working jobs and creating them by opening businesses and paying taxes. What colour was the 13 plate career holiday merchant ?

 

The stats are freely available and make interesting reading such as the fact that 8 people own as much wealth as the bottom 50% in the WORLD. Whenever these things are mentioned people start laughing (because the msm has conditioned them to) and start hurling their favourite put downs like "resident socialist" or "libtard" or "Guardian reader" little aware they are spewing out the exact thing their capitalist parasite masters have conditioned them to say and think. I personally abhor injustice in society and metaphorically weep every time I see poverty, regardless of whether the victim is down on his/her luck or a so called pro scrounger.

 

We do have problems of poverty, social housing, runaway costs on utilities, high rents and near impossibility of getting on the housing ladder in many places but the guy washing your car for a fiver is not the cause. The cause is wealth is not divided anywhere near equally and by that I don't mean everyone should get a lump sum of £25000 or some other bizarre swipe which I await eagerly from some resident professional capitalist zombie.

 

They always have money for war but they never have it for the NHS, roads, trains, infrastructure, housing, pot holes, etc, etc, they'll also chase you for taxes but let corporations off with billions (because they create jobs and will go elsewhere if we upset them) .

I feel sorry for you, mate, but round here it is the recently "arrived"...30,000 "lucky lavender" sellers from Slovakia and Romania, and Albania and Bulgaria....in our region alone! The saintly Tony Blair said Britain could only expect 10K....what a liar! And, contrary to your statement, they are NOT entrepeneurs, or budding business men, creating jobs etc etc...thats garbage! It,s all car washes, pizza delivery, mini cabbing (and thats the ones who actually go to work!) Please note, ALL these "professions" only take cash.....and we all know what that means...NO TAXES! It,s ALL about cheap labour, instead of training OUR kids for the jobs, on a minimum wage! As for money for the NHS, 3 million arrivals ALL entitled to the NHS, but not enough medical professionals amongst them to take up the slack. And as many of them are women and kids, then not contibuting to the economy to cover their medical costs...

Edited October 3, 2017 by pinfireman

[Hamster]

I feel sorry for you, mate, but round here it is the recently "arrived"...30,000 "lucky lavender" sellers from Slovakia and Romania, and Albania and Bulgaria....in our region alone! The saintly Tony Blair said Britain could only expect 10K....what a liar! And, contrary to your statement, they are NOT entrepeneurs, or budding business men, creating jobs etc etc...thats garbage! It,s all car washes, pizza delivery, mini cabbing (and thats the ones who actually go to work!) Please note, ALL these "professions" only take cash.....and we all know what that means...NO TAXES! It,s ALL about cheap labour, instead of training OUR kids for the jobs, on a minimum wage! As for money for the NHS, 3 million arrivals ALL entitled to the NHS, but not enough medical professionals amongst them to take up the slack. And as many of them are women and kids, then not contibuting to the economy to cover their medical costs...

 

NET contribution from "scroungers and ferinners" is positive but I guess you know things that the official statistics offices don't.

 

All I'm saying is blaming your misfortunes on those even lower down the feeding ladder is exactly what the fat capitalists want. The likes of your good self and others before on the thread going into denial is precisely what I said would happen .

 

"The system isn't broken, it was built that way. "

[Twistedsanity]

its a bit of a misconception, the woman with the 13 plate bmw is probaly up to her wotsits in debt, owes wonga, the rent, the utilities and every catalogue going a fortune, car is probably on some dodgy finance deal and brighthouse own the tv and white goods , it will all come to a head sooner or later whern she is hiding from the bailiffs and gets evicted , the blame can only lay at one groups feet and that is the government who preside over the benefits system I'm afraid

[Whitebridges]

I feel sorry for you, mate, but round here it is the recently "arrived"...30,000 "lucky lavender" sellers from Slovakia and Romania, and Albania and Bulgaria....in our region alone! The saintly Tony Blair said Britain could only expect 10K....what a liar! And, contrary to your statement, they are NOT entrepeneurs, or budding business men, creating jobs etc etc...thats garbage! It,s all car washes, pizza delivery, mini cabbing (and thats the ones who actually go to work!) Please note, ALL these "professions" only take cash.....and we all know what that means...NO TAXES! It,s ALL about cheap labour, instead of training OUR kids for the jobs, on a minimum wage! As for money for the NHS, 3 million arrivals ALL entitled to the NHS, but not enough medical professionals amongst them to take up the slack. And as many of them are women and kids, then not contibuting to the economy to cover their medical costs...

 

Nice post pinefireman. These good folk are "doers" simple. Now we've got them here they need to partake in our welfare system and be housed which fuels the biggest evil of all on our island - housing development.

 

How go you think the 30K vote once they become Brittans? Best guess 29K Labour.

[AVB]

 

NET contribution from "scroungers and ferinners" is positive but I guess you know things that the official statistics offices don't.

 

All I'm saying is blaming your misfortunes on those even lower down the feeding ladder is exactly what the fat capitalists want. The likes of your good self and others before on the thread going into denial is precisely what I said would happen .

 

"The system isn't broken, it was built that way. "

Ok Ill bite. But if Socialism isn't taking more from the hard working richer people to give to some of the less hard working poor people then what is it?

[Hamster]

Ok Ill bite. But if Socialism isn't taking more from the hard working richer people to give to some of the less hard working poor people then what is it?

 

It's not about biting, why would you even say that ? I know, maybe because the capitalist system has conditioned you into taking an automatic defensive stance against anything else ! I'm not even against capitalism, only opposed to it when it doesn't pay its way and amasses what it can't possibly spend and stashes it away without even paying taxes on it. These fortunes are then used as influence and little else, you can't possibly spend more than 200-300 million anyway. In simple terms I am against successful companies such as Google or Amazon not paying due taxes using loopholes placed by politicians who work for them and not the ordinary worker, if you can't see that it's no good feeling sorry for ME.

 

I believe ©apitalism with a Socialist conscience is the way forward and NO, socialism doesn't take away from the rich to give to the lazy, rather to the needy and we can all fall into that category unfortunately. It is Capitalism which denigrates and mocks all others despite the reality that there are dozens of socialist structure countries in Europe as well as other places in the world which have proved it can work.

[scobydog]

Which countries please, because all the ones i looked up are either on there ***** or not real socialist states.

[Me matt]

Sorry to hear of your plight, but this country no longer favours people from this country.

Your best chance of securing assistance is to apply for Romanian citizenship then ask again.

[Mice!]

I know that feeling mate ive been on half wages since july , ive felt for a bit i should be back at work on a phased return works doctor wont here of it , And now they want me to see a shrink i really think im getting depression being off that long anyway they have been taking my holidays to top up my pay but im going to be out of holidays next month so the Hr department letter gave me a government site to get my pay made up and said you might need to go to citizens advice get a free app with a lawyer and get the form filled in , So i phoned the 0800 number to be told unless i have a SSP1 form from my work its a waste of time , so last tuesday phones the Hr department im still waiting a return call i think if it was there wages i would of had the call back .I think there waiting till i have my meeting later on in the week and hit me with everything . What they dont know is my sister in law runs one of the biggest Hr dep in Scotland and i can run everything past her i think that might get dropped into the meeting .

Bob you might from the sound of things be better taking your sister to the meeting with you, chances are things will get lost in translation, check when your sister can go with you and ask to rearrange the meeting to suit it could well put the frightners ip them??

[yod dropper]

 

In simple terms I am against successful companies such as Google or Amazon not paying due taxes using loopholes placed by politicians who work for them and not the ordinary worker, if you can't see that it's no good feeling sorry for ME.

 

 

I think we're all against that. And some of us are not just against fat capitalists as you put it but also against companies such as the Rolling Stones or highly paid people from the Sports, Arts & Media using tax loopholes to avoid paying tax. Many of us are also against the welfare state being unfair meaning that those who can access the funds are better off than many who work and take very little out. As to your 'net contribution', I'm pretty certain that a family with two children doesn't actually contribute until it earns somewhere just over £40k p.a. which I doubt many 'scroungers and ferriners' earn, up to those earnings they take from the pot.

 

Your image from an earlier post doesn't describe Socialism, or Capitalist but the theory of Marxism as I understand it from one of the most painful and widely acknowledged flawed books I've ever read - Das Kapital.

[poontang]

its a bit of a misconception, the woman with the 13 plate bmw is probaly up to her wotsits in debt, owes wonga, the rent, the utilities and every catalogue going a fortune, car is probably on some dodgy finance deal and brighthouse own the tv and white goods , it will all come to a head sooner or later whern she is hiding from the bailiffs and gets evicted , the blame can only lay at one groups feet and that is the government who preside over the benefits system I'm afraid

 

Rubbish.

There's only one person to blame in the above scenario, and that's the silly bint who's stupid enough to rack up so much debt without being able to comfortably pay it back. It's time people took responsibility for their own actions and stopped relying on the state to fund their lifestyle.

The government, no government, is responsible for people's personal spending habits.

[Jaymo]

30000? Are you sure!!!! Thought it was 29869 when you last carried out your own census

On the positive thats a lot of Heather being grown and harvested, so some good job creation.

 

Judging by the comments then by my reckoning EDLs coffees must be swelling daily.

 

Maybe they are not declaring all of their earnings ( most likely under the current tax free amount anyway, but dont let that alter your mindset), but they will be spending that money back into the economy ( yeah yeah, some will go to relatives overseas).

Now, what about blogsy who couldnt care less as he is white British and feels a sense of entitlement to all the benefits going- those benefits come from the Welfare budget which guess what, is paid for by taxation.

So in effect, even though they may be putting it back into the economy via means such as Sky tv/fags/Wetherspoons and Nike trainers. Its ALL being subsidized by us

 

The constant reference to Ethnicity and/ or Religion, is most likely why tensions run so high everywhere.

 

The why not me generation has vastly changed peoples expectations and desires. Seems to be that everyone wants minimum effort for maximum output- except maybe those hard working souls who can be bothered to carry out labour that others feel is beneath them......

[Whitebridges]

 

Rubbish.

There's only one person to blame in the above scenario, and that's the silly bint who's stupid enough to rack up so much debt without being able to comfortably pay it back. It's time people took responsibility for their own actions and stopped relying on the state to fund their lifestyle.

The government, no government, is responsible for people's personal spending habits.

 

Confused here. Who is that "silly bint" ? Name and shame. If you do be prepared for an avalanche of background about racking up debt in England's green and pleasant land .

[JohnfromUK]

Firstly I am genuinely very sorry for all of those genuine people who have suffered from the broken benefit system. But what a load of cobblers is being posted here! Its not the Tory 'capitalist' system to blame, nor would Corbyn's socialist Venezuelan solution miraculously fix it - nor would taking money from the 'rich', Amazon, Google - or any others.

 

The problem is the benefits system is well and truly broken. It pays out to the undeserving scroungers and ignores those with genuine need.

 

Benefits should support people who can't - through no fault of their own - fully or partially support themselves. This includes the disabled (mentally and physically), the sick (both short term and long term), the elderly, those who have lost jobs through no fault of their own etc, you get the picture. It should provide a decent standard of living for these people (i.e. food, rent/accomodation, heat, light, transport etc.). In particular, they should be available to those who have contributed to the system and through no fault of their own have fallen on difficult times due to illness, injury or old age. Like the state pension, they should be a 'safely net' .

 

Benefits should NOT be freely available to the plain lazy, the 'career scroungers', the 'too many kids to work' mob, etc. Benefits should not be expected to finance 'luxuries' such as foreign holidays, 20 fags a day, 15 pints a week, cosmetic surgery, Sky TV packages etc. These are privileges, not essentials and should be earned.

 

It is a difficult thing to set down in law, but I think people here will understand my sentiments ....... Having a civilised society is about the strong assisting those in genuine need, NOT supporting the lazy and plain scroungers

[Hamster]

Firstly I am genuinely very sorry for all of those genuine people who have suffered from the broken benefit system. But what a load of cobblers is being posted here! Its not the Tory 'capitalist' system to blame, nor would Corbyn's socialist Venezuelan solution miraculously fix it - nor would taking money from the 'rich', Amazon, Google - or any others.

 

The problem is the benefits system is well and truly broken. It pays out to the undeserving scroungers and ignores those with genuine need.

 

Benefits should support people who can't - through no fault of their own - fully or partially support themselves. This includes the disabled (mentally and physically), the sick (both short term and long term), the elderly, those who have lost jobs through no fault of their own etc, you get the picture. It should provide a decent standard of living for these people (i.e. food, rent/accomodation, heat, light, transport etc.). In particular, they should be available to those who have contributed to the system and through no fault of their own have fallen on difficult times due to illness, injury or old age. Like the state pension, they should be a 'safely net' .

 

Benefits should NOT be freely available to the plain lazy, the 'career scroungers', the 'too many kids to work' mob, etc. Benefits should not be expected to finance 'luxuries' such as foreign holidays, 20 fags a day, 15 pints a week, cosmetic surgery, Sky TV packages etc. These are privileges, not essentials and should be earned.

 

It is a difficult thing to set down in law, but I think people here will understand my sentiments ....... Having a civilised society is about the strong assisting those in genuine need, NOT supporting the lazy and plain scroungers

 

So you're saying the country's problems are down to benefits fraud etc, ? Do you have a chart to prove that assumption, you know, like one that shows what's spent where and by whom so we know what proportion of the budget is even taken up by social security.

[JohnfromUK]

 

So you're saying the country's problems are down to benefits fraud etc, ? Do you have a chart to prove that assumption, you know, like one that shows what's spent where and by whom so we know what proportion of the budget is even taken up by social security.

No - its not by any means all fraud. It simply doesn't address those in genuine need fully, but is available (and not fraudulently)to people who can live a very comfortable lifestyle with some 'luxuries'.

 

Social 'protection' takes £240 billion pounds, 31% of government spending. In comparison Defence takes £46 billion, or 6%

Edited October 3, 2017 by JohnfromUK

[Hamster]

No - its not by any means all fraud. It simply doesn't address those in genuine need fully, but is available (and not fraudulently)to people who can live a very comfortable lifestyle with some 'luxuries'.

 

Social 'protection' takes £240 billion pounds, 31% of government spending. In comparison Defence takes £46 billion, or 6%

 

Now break down Social Protection and we'll start getting to the bottom of whether your assertions have enough substance.

[Wooder]

If you ain't paid in you shouldn't take out !!!!!!! makes my blood boil

[JohnfromUK]

 

Now break down Social Protection and we'll start getting to the bottom of whether your assertions have enough substance.

My point is that the money (and there is a lot of it, 5 x as much as is spent on defence) isn't reaching the right people, but is going to some who don't need it as a genuine support, but treat it as a 'lifestyle'. That is plain wrong in my book. The figures can neither prove nor disprove that, but here are the figures anyway. The actual breakdown is like this;

 

Actual government welfare spending

Pensions £108bn = 42%

Incapacity, disability & injury benefits £41bn = 16%

Unemployment benefits £3bn = 1%

Housing benefits £27bn = 10%

Family benefits, income support & tax credits £44bn = 17%

Personal social services and other benefits £34bn = 13%

If you ain't paid in you shouldn't take out !!!!!!! makes my blood boil

Agree in principle, but there would have to be exceptions - for example I would still wish to support those (such as the severely disabled) who haven't been able to contribute .......

[timmytree]

I think we can all agree that there is something wrong with a system that allows some people to make the choice of not working when they are able, maybe I made the wrong choice for nearly 44 years.

We still have a situation where single people who own their own homes can't get help when they need it most. If it wasn't for my family helping I may have been forced to go back to work even though the Dr says its the worst thing I could do right now.

I and no doubt many others have been faced with this dilemma, its not good.