Does NV make sense on a legal limit air rifle?

[udderlyoffroad]

Ok chaps, been searching  a few threads but not come up with the answer so far, so apologies if this has been covered before.

One of my permissions has healthy numbers of rabbits, but unfortunately boundary issues/public footpaths preclude walking up along most of the hedges with the shottie.  There are a couple of spots that I can place myself and get a safe shot with the shottie, but there are far more that I can’t.

So back to the legal limit air rifle.  Cover varies between dense as hell and none at all, so it’s hard going and they will usually bolt before I can creep in range.

Bumpy22 has generously donated his old lamping equipment to me, as he’s now a fully paid-up member of the NV club.  Problem is, most of the people I know who shoot have many permissions to cover themselves, so co-ordinating a time when a lamp operator and a rifle operator can go out is difficult; and removes the flexibility to just jump in the car after work and go.

So I’ve been looking at the Pard 007, like ant.mass is selling for £325  Does this make sense on a12ftlb Hatsan AT44-10?  I appreciate of course that the Hatsan will still only be useable out to 40yards or so, and I still need to get close enough to take a shot, without the long-eared bu**ers scarpering.  NV is not a substitute for field-craft.

Before anybody mentions, yes I’d love to go FAC, either LR or even FAC air rifle, but I highly doubt that if I can persuade the farmer (just catching him is hard enough) to put pen to paper, and that’s before you consider the footpaths bounding the land.  Also, the budgetary considerations mean a £300ish NV is realistic (given I’ve just spent many £ on a shotgun), whereas a rifle, scope, case, and separate safe (my missus keeps her shottie in our joint safe) is less so.  Though I suppose I could always move the Pard should I ever go FAC.

So what’s been people’s experiences who’ve done similar?

[Rewulf]

Yes is the easy answer.

However , have you considered lamping with a mounted LED torch ?
You can buy a bracket for a few £ , then mount a T38 or even an Aldi special on to the side of your scope, get one with an easily reachable button, scan and shoot.

[udderlyoffroad]

8 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

However , have you considered lamping with a mounted LED torch ?
You can buy a bracket for a few £ , then mount a T38 or even an Aldi special on to the side of your scope, get one with an easily reachable button, scan and shoot.

I have actually mounted the lamp to the scope; the Hatsan is a heavy beast to begin with, and the lamp makes it even heavier, which means I need to support it on a bipod/gate/prone position.  It works, to the point that will illuminate bunnies well out of range.  Obviously I could buy a more modern torch with LED technology which would alleviate the weight concern  Though, the glare in the scope is still quite bright.

[Ultrastu]

Id say .if its for rabbits in the open ?

Then sub 12 .177 is do able with nv but id say with a . 22 your really gonna struggle .

The issue is accurate range finding .

And also the closer you are at night (to the rabbit )with your nv the more the red light is gonna spook him and he will bolt before you get in range .

Its very tricky stalking a rabbit at night .much more so than it is in the day .imo.

The nv doesnt seem to help with this .somehow. 

A static approach is always best with either set range markers in the field .or an ir rangefinder. 

 

[Rewulf]

16 minutes ago, Ultrastu said:

A static approach is always best with either set range markers in the field .or an ir rangefinder. 

Or know your ground well.

 

24 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

Though, the glare in the scope is still quite bright.

LED with focus able beam, mounted right, it shouldnt be an issue, also weighs very little.

[oowee]

NV on any rifle as long as you have a spotter will transform your options. With a sub 12 try an ambush set up in a field, sitting quietly down wind and waiting for the rabbits to show. Rats in the farm yard. Stalking rabbits over the field it will make all of the difference. When they get used to the IR you can swap for a lower wave length and go even more covert. 

[Walker570]

All down to the situation, ground etc. really. Personally I would sus out the locations most used by the bunnies and then set up a position you can see that area within 25yrds. Zero your air rifle to that and know where it will pitch inside that distance. Then get in position before darkness and be patient and that is the biggest problem, very few people have the patience to lay or sit in wait with little movement.  The other helper is a high seat against a handy tree and then you could go FAC and be safe.  Today I arrived on station at 6am before light and set up my blind, then got settled and sat there till 11am for seven tree rats and considered it time well spent. A coffee flask and some sandwiches helped. I use NV for foxes and any rabbits which come out take little notice of the IR, even under my high seat.  A spotter is useful and I have a BOBLOV which works OK, lets me know when I have a customer. This cost me £75 inc postage but I see they have gone up a bit recently but great for close in rabbits and has it's own IR which is good out to 100plus.

[Dave-G]

NV can be more beneficial than lamping or daylight for legal limit air ranges than longer distance because of the POTENTIAL stealth available if you do your part, bearing in mind you are in very close proximity to Brer Rabbit who has big ears and a great smell. 

As said, you can lay up at an optimum position that means you don't make any noise stalking into range. You won't then be giving away your presence by noise nor sweeping a torch or IR illuminator glow to locate them.

Some NV rigs with outgoing CCD sensors work better than newer types with minimal illumination because they are more sensitive to low light than recent HD CMOS sensors. This offers amazing performance at dusk and dawn when the human eye thinks it's dark but the better CCD sensor still sees for an hour or so in the summer months.

I'll blow my own trumpet here and point out there is even a specific add-on rig that you can remove the monitor and lay it down in front of you using an extension cable so you don't need to raise your head above the grass if its a few inches high and your rifle is on a bipod. I've used the monitor inside my car with the rifle on the door window a few times. 😁

Edited March 5, 2019 by Dave-G

[Walker570]

Hmmmm!!!    You didn't give me a pretty blue thumb screw, mine was a drab purply colour.  Joking apart I have one of Daves units and certainly in that last half hour before true dark it turns night into day without the IR on, but even with the IR on,even in the two high settings which you would not need at 25-30yrds, rabbits do not appear concerned. I put mine on the 17HMR for a rabbit control job and can expect to see them from 10yrds to 200yrds.  The trick is like foxing ...don't educate them ...kill them.

Go on then Dave, I'm curious. What is that thingy stuck on the side fo the camera tube for, or is it secret.

 

Edited March 5, 2019 by Walker570

[oldypigeonpopper]

hello, with the summer coming along and light evenings you will not need much N/V where as a good red torch out to 40 yards is very suitable, i see 4 choices,  home made add on/bought add on/ second hand photon scope but you will need an extra I/R torch for these 3/ or the pard 007 and tony (ant mass) said the on board I/R is very good, but note most people use a side focus scope, if that is what you have then its just a matter of deciding what is best for you, cheers     

Edited March 5, 2019 by oldypigeonpopper

[Dave-G]

18 minutes ago, Walker570 said:

Hmmmm!!!    You didn't give me a pretty blue thumb screw, mine was a drab purply colour.  Joking apart I have one of Daves units and certainly in that last half hour before true dark it turns night into day without the IR on, but even with the IR on,even in the two high settings which you would not need at 25-30yrds, rabbits do not appear concerned. I put mine on the 17HMR for a rabbit control job and can expect to see them from 10yrds to 200yrds.  The trick is like foxing ...don't educate them ...kill them.

Go on then Dave, I'm curious. What is that thingy stuck on the side fo the camera tube for, or is it secret.

 

Lol, I glued a plate to velcro a DVR onto it, and splice it into the camera feed with a 'Y' lead:

Edited March 5, 2019 by Dave-G

[Walker570]

Neat.

[bumpy22]

stick with the lamp matt for the time being. nv is not the be all of everything. you are on a budget so persevere with the lamp. trust me how many have i shot under a lamp?

there are a lot of people i know if you took all there fancy gear away they would not be able to catch a thing. before night vision and thermal came along a lot of rabbits and foxes were shot using a car battery in a bucket and a car headlamp. i have one longer arm to prove it

[villaman]

Go for it , it’s a game changer wether it’s on air gun any cal . I use pard 007 on my sub 12 and can expect a very good bag when I go out . 

[udderlyoffroad]

Thanks for the responses all, will continue the research.  It’s a .177

 

On ‎05‎/‎03‎/‎2019 at 21:44, bumpy22 said:

stick with the lamp matt for the time being. nv is not the be all of everything. you are on a budget so persevere with the lamp. trust me how many have i shot under a lamp?

there are a lot of people i know if you took all there fancy gear away they would not be able to catch a thing. before night vision and thermal came along a lot of rabbits and foxes were shot using a car battery in a bucket and a car headlamp. i have one longer arm to prove it

He’s right of course….I don’t particularly have £325 floating around.  The lamp requires perseverance, and I take your points about getting yourself in a good spot to ambush.  I picked up a pair of secatuers in Lidl for £2.50, so have cleared a couple of overgrown paths (really badger tracks) this past weekend which should allow me to creep up to a couple of good spots.

I might, however, invest £30-odd in a more scope-friendly T38 lamp, and use Bumpy’s old gear when I have a willing assistant.  Missus is disappearing off on her annual girls holiday at the end of the week, so should have plenty of opportunities to go out over the next week or so.

[Rewulf]

37 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

I might, however, invest £30-odd in a more scope-friendly T38 lamp,

This would be my primary mission here, get a decent one ,with a focusable beam,  and a couple of 18650 batteries.
At airgun ranges it makes perfect sense.

[udderlyoffroad]

On ‎11‎/‎03‎/‎2019 at 13:54, Rewulf said:

This would be my primary mission here, get a decent one ,with a focusable beam

Any recommendations anyone?  There seem to be a myriad of options on Ebay and Amazon.  I'm thinking red light rather than white

[oldypigeonpopper]

15 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

Any recommendations anyone?  There seem to be a myriad of options on Ebay and Amazon.  I'm thinking red light rather than white

hello, look at a TR 38 (far better than the original T),   with red led from ludicrous lumins, get a thumb switch to, ask andy which red led for air rifle range,  i started off ratting 15 years ago with an air rifle and red torch, 

[Rewulf]

This, with 2 batteries charger and mount.

https://torchfactory.com/evo-38-lamping-kit

These are out of stock in anything except IR unfortunately, so no good at the moment.

https://www.ludicrous-lumens.co.uk/collections/t-series-t20-t38-t50-t67-torches-ir/products/bundle-deal-t38-illuminator-gun-light-38mm?variant=18135422471

Both of these torches can go IR with a separate 'pill' if you decide to go NV in the future.

Edited March 12, 2019 by Rewulf

[manthing]

Yes. But know your ranges. 

[Walker570]

On 05/03/2019 at 21:44, bumpy22 said:

stick with the lamp matt for the time being. nv is not the be all of everything. you are on a budget so persevere with the lamp. trust me how many have i shot under a lamp?

there are a lot of people i know if you took all there fancy gear away they would not be able to catch a thing. before night vision and thermal came along a lot of rabbits and foxes were shot using a car battery in a bucket and a car headlamp. i have one longer arm to prove it

Yep, been there done that(remember the old Lucas 'Flame thrower' spot lights)   BUT I am recently converted to NV and as a result my success rate has doubled and I haven't spent a fortune either.  Less than £400 including a NV spotter.   The only thing wrong with it is if you hunt with a mate, then it can be very antisocial because they just see  nothing, unless they have a spotter as well.

 

I have a Hawke IR torch clipped on the rail below the BOBLOV and this gives me a good three hundred yards when on full power. It has three settings.

Edited March 22, 2019 by Walker570

[oldypigeonpopper]

14 minutes ago, Walker570 said:

Yep, been there done that(remember the old Lucas 'Flame thrower' spot lights)   BUT I am recently converted to NV and as a result my success rate has doubled and I haven't spent a fortune either.  Less than £400 including a NV spotter.   The only thing wrong with it is if you hunt with a mate, then it can be very antisocial because they just see  nothing, unless they have a spotter as well.

 

I have a Hawke IR torch clipped on the rail below the BOBLOV and this gives me a good three hundred yards when on full power. It has three settings.

hello, i have a similar hand held N/V and use a on board  T38 I/R good for spotting

[bumpy22]

11 hours ago, Walker570 said:

Yep, been there done that(remember the old Lucas 'Flame thrower' spot lights)   BUT I am recently converted to NV and as a result my success rate has doubled and I haven't spent a fortune either.  Less than £400 including a NV spotter.   The only thing wrong with it is if you hunt with a mate, then it can be very antisocial because they just see  nothing, unless they have a spotter as well.

 

I have a Hawke IR torch clipped on the rail below the BOBLOV and this gives me a good three hundred yards when on full power. It has three settings.

I use thermal and NV mate. I wish my set up was the great price you have👍the op on this thread is due a night out with me foxing with thermal etc. The problem is he won't be seeing a lot as you said. He used to come lamping with me. I have said to him if you can afford NV it's a big difference. But if not the lamp will work

 

 

[happyshooter]

NV is a game changer ,the only thing is it can become an obsession,  i started off

one of the first Nite -site-NS-200,s and used that for 3 yrs with great success ,I now own a NS-wolf, a NS-Viper

a pard NV008 , a pulsar N750,and two nv addons built by two friends of mine,

so i have a few NV goodies   I use these on rimfires, fac air & sub 12fpe airguns.

atb brian

[Dave-G]

36 minutes ago, happyshooter said:

NV is a game changer ,the only thing is it can become an obsession,  i started off

one of the first Nite -site-NS-200,s and used that for 3 yrs with great success ,I now own a NS-wolf, a NS-Viper

a pard NV008 , a pulsar N750,and two nv addons built by two friends of mine,

so i have a few NV goodies   I use these on rimfires, fac air & sub 12fpe airguns.

atb brian

Yup - he's just plain greedy.