Sub 12 or fa

[Rewulf]

3 minutes ago, figgy said:

The new X twist FX barrels seem to be very accurate at range.

Im sure they are, slightly better than a 'normal' barrel.

 

13 hours ago, figgy said:

Rewulf have a watch of his videos, some are silly others informative. In one the twig shoots a TX200 218 yards and hits a Firebird target. The dents in it are impressive when he hits it right it explodes. 

Watched it.
The person shooting is aiming upwards in the general direction of the target, and keeps firing until a lucky shot (allegedly) hits the firebird.
They dont even bother with a rest, there is  decent wind, its all a bit unscientific really.
Not really sure what its supposed to prove ?
A 12 ft lb gun can set a firebird off at 218 yards ?
Its certainly not a test of accuracy,  as they are not really 'aiming'

[Ultrastu]

13 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Agreed.

But it makes a massive difference when using  a ballistic calculator.

I used to do a lot of national level FT (always .177 obviously) and we did a lot of experimentation with 100 yard shots as a bit of fun.
Whilst getting decent groups at up to 60 -70 yards , after that, the decrease in velocity and stability, made getting any kind of group at 100 + yards very optimistic.
This is with match guns , match pellets, and some very expensive glass !
This is why Im always dubious of these claims of long distance sub 12 ft lb shooting, some of the best shots in the country struggle to hit a 25mm kill zone at 60 yards, with the best equipment available.
Then you hear someone with a TX 200 hitting sub inch groups at 100 ?

I have to agree with this fully .

My own experience with .177 in sub 12 and fac .is that the max range for inch kills is around 65 yds  after which the dispersion massivley increases .

I limit my .fac 177 to 65 yds and my sub 12 s to 50 yds  .

This is often touted as a reason not to get fac.177 .but the trajectory of the fac is much flatter and as such makes the chances of hitting that 65 yds target much greater  .

 

 

There is also an increase in rotational momentum with the larger pellets which helps with stability at longer range.

[ratass]

17 hours ago, Rewulf said:

With around 1.5 ft lbs of energy remaining, I highly doubt that. 

 

 

It might be what his scope/gun/ammo combo is capable of? 

 

not bad for a springer an open sights methinks

[Rewulf]

1 minute ago, ratass said:

not bad for a springer an open sights methinks

[Whitetail]

If your going to shoot rabbits beyond 80yds I'd recommend a 22rf and if your seriously going to be shooting at them at 120 yds get a 17 hmr. You'll need perfect conditions and know the range to within a yard or two using a air rifle at these ranges, inside 80 yds a fac air rifle makes perfect sense but if you look at mat dubber struggling at 60-90 yds trying to shoot rabbits with a fx impact in 30 cal in blustery conditions you see what I'm talking about . A cz rf can be picked up for £200-£300 look what a fx airrifle will cost and the rf wii run circles around it 

[Dekers]

On 15/09/2019 at 15:47, ladyjack said:

Is talking to someone yesterday who says he knocks over rabbits at 80yrds regularly, e end had so e at 120yrds,fx sub 12ftlbs, I thought fac meant more power more distance,got me confused now, as I dont know what route to go down now,any advice would be appreciated. 

I'm not sure what language some of that is but 80 yards with a12 ft lb is a LONG way and 120 is rather silly.  Of course it can be done but those distances are not for the VAST MAJORITY of people in the field against live quarry!  I have 12 ft lb and FAC Air and I wouldn't be considering either of those distances.

My .22lr is zeroed at 60 yards (circa 100ft lb)  and my HMR at 100 yards (circa 245ft lb)!

[villaman]

2 hours ago, Whitetail said:

If your going to shoot rabbits beyond 80yds I'd recommend a 22rf and if your seriously going to be shooting at them at 120 yds get a 17 hmr. You'll need perfect conditions and know the range to within a yard or two using a air rifle at these ranges, inside 80 yds a fac air rifle makes perfect sense but if you look at mat dubber struggling at 60-90 yds trying to shoot rabbits with a fx impact in 30 cal in blustery conditions you see what I'm talking about . A cz rf can be picked up for £200-£300 look what a fx airrifle will cost and the rf wii run circles around it 

And with 22lr rounds which bounce around the place , not so much with pellets , for this reason my .25 impact running @ 77 ft/lbs is the gun I go out with

[Dekers]

2 hours ago, villaman said:

And with 22lr rounds which bounce around the place , not so much with pellets , for this reason my .25 impact running @ 77 ft/lbs is the gun I go out with

They certainly can, and .22lr is possibly the most likely to bounce, but it hasn't stopped .22lr being the most popular civil calibre in the world by miles, and if you actually hit the quarry the chance of bounce/ricochet is minimal!

[bruno22rf]

Such is the popularity and variety of .22lr ammunition that you can buy rounds that will mirror image any .25 PCP round that you care to mention - you also dont need to refill with air and an accurate .22lr can be bought for pennies - I would guess that £200 would buy you a rifle/scope/Mod.

[villaman]

But it still will not stop rounds bouncing around unlike .25 pellet 

500 .22 rounds about £80 

500 pellets £12  so swings and round abouts 

[Rewulf]

29 minutes ago, villaman said:

But it still will not stop rounds bouncing around unlike .25 pellet 

500 .22 rounds about £80 

500 pellets £12  so swings and round abouts 

Sounds like very expensive .22 lr rounds , and very cheap .airgun pellets.

My club sells decent S and B .22 lr for £3.50 x 50 rounds = £35.00 for 500
Im not sure what sort of ammo you get for £80 a brick , but Ive never bought any !

Anyway, I know which Id rather be shooting.

[oldypigeonpopper]

hello, i thought ladyjack mentioned what rifle would be suitable for shooting  feral pigeon in a long building, ??   

[Ultrastu]

Conversations evolve. Or at least they should do .unless they get boring and repetitive 

[bruno22rf]

Why will a .22lr round, of the same weight and velocity as a .25 (or as near as you can get) bounce around anymore than a .25 pellet? Look up .22 BB Cap rounds.

[Rewulf]

25 minutes ago, bruno22rf said:

Why will a .22lr round, of the same weight and velocity as a .25 (or as near as you can get) bounce around anymore than a .25 pellet? Look up .22 BB Cap rounds.

Who says it wont ?

Most of it is down to the fact , the .22 lr round , being solid, is not as frangible as a skirted pellet.
If it were a .25 air slug, at same velocity, weight ect, theres no reason it wont 'bounce' just the same.

[Ultrastu]

True .and 1 of the reasons i dont shoot 34 grn .25 cal pellets .too close to a 40 grn .22lr  .

And obviously  a .30 cal pellet at 50 grns going slower than a .22 lr could be more prone to bounce skip and ricochet ..

 

Its speed and fragility, That reduces the bounce element .so a fast .177 pellet , should bounce much less than a heavy slow solid slug  . (.22 pellet..22lr.... 35 cal slug  ... 177  15 grn pellet ) take your pick .

[ladyjack]

13 hours ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, i thought ladyjack mentioned what rifle would be suitable for shooting  feral pigeon in a long building, ??   

Yes I did oldypigeonpopper, not sure how we got to this

[oldypigeonpopper]

4 minutes ago, ladyjack said:

Yes I did oldypigeonpopper, not sure how we got to this

hello, ok  let us know what you decide then when you get your rifle, i shoot ferals in a grain dryer barn but only use a sub 12 air rifle being a tin roof, anyway good luck  

[ladyjack]

1 minute ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, ok  let us know what you decide then when you get your rifle, i shoot ferals in a grain dryer barn but only use a sub 12 air rifle being a tin roof, anyway good luck  

Well I am at a total loss,someone selling a Wembley fx 200 on freeads,he'sin liverpool asked when I could come and try it,he says not 23rd not 25th nor 30th this month,and not the 1st of next month, he said I could try it in his  back garden,its 25yrds long, I thought no it doesn't matter 25yrds with a fac air rifle,I am getting a bit fed up with looking ,don't know if worth all the bother, pity really as I was up the farm today, fxxxxxg hundreds of feral pigeons in the shed,that's without the thousands of crows Jay's jackdaw and magpies, I shot about 40 gerald,and crows,but loads just to far for 12ftlbs,

[bruno22rf]

My response was to villaman's post regarding a .22lr round "bouncing around" UNLIKE a .25 pellet.I'm suggesting that, with the variety of .22lr rounds available, you can mimic just about any Air Rifle performance.

[oldypigeonpopper]

8 hours ago, ladyjack said:

Well I am at a total loss,someone selling a Wembley fx 200 on freeads,he'sin liverpool asked when I could come and try it,he says not 23rd not 25th nor 30th this month,and not the 1st of next month, he said I could try it in his  back garden,its 25yrds long, I thought no it doesn't matter 25yrds with a fac air rifle,I am getting a bit fed up with looking ,don't know if worth all the bother, pity really as I was up the farm today, fxxxxxg hundreds of feral pigeons in the shed,that's without the thousands of crows Jay's jackdaw and magpies, I shot about 40 gerald,and crows,but loads just to far for 12ftlbs,

hello, have you decided on FAC air ? if so what will you use to fill pump or cylinder ? whats your budget, you will not get many shots per charge on that webley fx, far better a bottle rifle, hope you find something suitable, that FX vermy is only 18 ft lb max so a bit low for longer ranges

[Mice!]

10 hours ago, ladyjack said:

Well I am at a total loss,someone selling a Wembley fx 200 on freeads,he'sin liverpool asked when I could come and try it,he says not 23rd not 25th nor 30th this month,and not the 1st of next month, he said I could try it in his  back garden,its 25yrds long, I thought no it doesn't matter 25yrds with a fac air rifle,I am getting a bit fed up with looking ,don't know if worth all the bother, pity really as I was up the farm today, fxxxxxg hundreds of feral pigeons in the shed,that's without the thousands of crows Jay's jackdaw and magpies, I shot about 40 gerald,and crows,but loads just to far for 12ftlbs,

Can't see why you would want to travel from Newcastle to Liverpool to try a rifle? There must be something available closer to home?

or can you not get closer to the ferals? Put a trailer or tractor in there?

have you watched any of the videos on YouTube of guys shooting ferals with night vision? Really effective.

[Mice!]

this is a rat video, but the same guys do ferals as well using the same kit.

[ladyjack]

2 hours ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, have you decided on FAC air ? if so what will you use to fill pump or cylinder ? whats your budget, you will not get many shots per charge on that webley fx, far better a bottle rifle, hope you find something suitable, that FX vermy is only 18 ft lb max so a bit low for longer ranges

Thanks for that info he told  e he was shooting 60/65yrds,good shot count and reckons easily shoot further,this is the problem when your not sure what to buy,you take people at their word so definitely not going to liverpool, thanks again,PS pity theres no one nearer me.

[oldypigeonpopper]

39 minutes ago, ladyjack said:

Thanks for that info he told  e he was shooting 60/65yrds,good shot count and reckons easily shoot further,this is the problem when your not sure what to buy,you take people at their word so definitely not going to liverpool, thanks again,PS pity theres no one nearer me.

hello, i had a look at that and did not think ideal, and over priced, is there nothing in your local RFDs or air rifle shops, i see Ed has some in his shop South Wales but that would mean a transfer cost, have you tried the UK airgun forum or the BBS forum, ?