Holding/shooting a shotgun.

[Walker570]

I had not really noticed this until watching a number of videos on you tube of drive game but was interested to see quite a few guns holding the shotgun with their non trigger hand very close back against the action some almost at the front of the trigger guard.  I was taught/ brought up to extend the arm forward and hold the forend /barrel well forward. Hence the barrel/hand protection sleaves available for side by sides. Over and unders/semi autos have forends well forward so have no need .

There used to be a fashion back in the seventies/eighties where the forend was held with the index finger pointing up the barrels..

How do you hold your shotguns ?

[WalkedUp]

I honestly have no idea but tomorrow I will check and report back. Will try a selection of my guns and see. I shoot SxS, OU and semi so will be interested to see the results.

With my rifles, for standing shots I know I hold the stock far back near the mag. A big scope puts a lot of weight there so the balance is there with left elbow into left hip. I take quite a few freehand shots.... need to invest in shooting sticks. 

Edited January 2, 2021 by WalkedUp

[WalkedUp]

Ok... I’m too impulsive and impatient. Tested eyes closed picturing a high crossing bird, gun down and then shouldered, side on infront of a big mirror. Results are in:

Semi auto - very far back on forend, just in front of loading port. 

O/U - forward on forend, perfectly covering chequering 1” back from the front. 

SxS - way forward, thumb and forefinger past the forend onto the barrels. 

I need an assistant to measure as I’d guess they may all be the same physical distance from the trigger forward.... now is science worth disturbing my wife for a this time 🤔

[Gordon R]

I hold the forend towards the front - about 2/3 away from the action.

[enfieldspares]

All I can speak of is SBS guns. The fore-end on which really is there only to hold the barrels to the action on most. Thus, as some say, the leather handguards once much sold for quick shooters stood on hot pegs. 

I've seen some SBS users with the hand almost trombone like up and down the barrels depending on which side the shot is being taken. And, yes, I've seen also the finger extended forward, as if pointing, along the underneath or bottom rib.

All reminds me of the old cricket story. The new coach was watching the teams star batsman out at the crease. "Look where his feet are, look where his feet are, they're all wrong!" "Yes," replied the old coach who's position the new coach was taking over, "But look where the ball is."

So there's no correct way, really, only ways that work. There are ways that look more elegant and ways that look positively awkward to those that prefer style. But the test is what works. Birds in the bag is the aim. Not stills for illustrations in a "How to" book.

Edited January 2, 2021 by enfieldspares

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, have you read the Art of Shooting by Ruffer , ? Back in the 1970s when most used a side by side, I used  a barrel sleeve with index finger in same postition, thumb and third finger holding both sides of sleeve, it give a better forward movement of the gun and goes into the shoulder in one go, if you look at this book he shows the way to use both eyes to only see the bead and target, holding the forend to far back will alter the sight plain, well that is what most I know did back then, he also mentions the Churchill style rib, and short barrels being more pointable than those 30 inch on a lot of English shotguns, now saying all this I know 2 people who still use a side by side, one was a champion clay shot and a cracker on skeet, the other a crack shot on pigeons and still is, I can only put my self average despite shooting 1000s of cartridges over 50 plus years 🤔😁, adding that I went over to an O/U mid to late 1980s , 

Edited January 2, 2021 by oldypigeonpopper

[enfieldspares]

A Ruffer's duffer were you? I also read that and Stanbury (with Carlisle) and also Churchill. I think I preferred Stanbury to Ruffer or Churchill as I am at 6'4" more his build and height that the other two. But I hope it makes a point that the gun's own height, weight and build is also relevent.

Edited January 2, 2021 by enfieldspares

[vmaxphil]

I use hand position to suit the target, quick target hand further back, slow target hand further forward seems to work for me just need to stop using blanks 

[London Best]

Good posts from enfieldspares.

Myself I only have SxS and hold with index finger under the bottom rib, thumb and second finger either side of barrels just at fore end tip.

I have found Churchill’s methods very good for quick, close shots. Stanbury’s better for higher, longer shots. My build more resembles Churchill’s, but taller. I have very short arms, six webbed fingers and can’t shoot for toffee.

[wymberley]

10 hours ago, enfieldspares said:

All I can speak of is SBS guns. The fore-end on which really is there only to hold the barrels to the action on most. Thus, as some say, the leather handguards once much sold for quick shooters stood on hot pegs. 

I've seen some SBS users with the hand almost trombone like up and down the barrels depending on which side the shot is being taken. And, yes, I've seen also the finger extended forward, as if pointing, along the underneath or bottom rib.

All reminds me of the old cricket story. The new coach was watching the teams star batsman out at the crease. "Look where his feet are, look where his feet are, they're all wrong!" "Yes," replied the old coach who's position the new coach was taking over, "But look where the ball is."

So there's no correct way, really, only ways that work. There are ways that look more elegant and ways that look positively awkward to those that prefer style. But the test is what works. Birds in the bag is the aim. Not stills for illustrations in a "How to" book.

 

2 hours ago, vmaxphil said:

I use hand position to suit the target, quick target hand further back, slow target hand further forward seems to work for me just need to stop using blanks 

We are often told that some do not see the barrels only the bird. This is a shame for those who don't simply guide or hold the barrels but grip them.

[Walker570]

2 hours ago, London Best said:

Good posts from enfieldspares.

Myself I only have SxS and hold with index finger under the bottom rib, thumb and second finger either side of barrels just at fore end tip.

I have found Churchill’s methods very good for quick, close shots. Stanbury’s better for higher, longer shots. My build more resembles Churchill’s, but taller. I have very short arms, six webbed fingers and can’t shoot for toffee.

Yes, enfield more or less summed it up.

 

I have never stood at a bar with you London Best so cannot comment on the length of your arms

 

[Old farrier]

15 minutes ago, Walker570 said:

Yes, enfield more or less summed it up.

 

I have never stood at a bar with you London Best so cannot comment on the length of your arms

 

Although some say there too short to reach his wallet when it’s his round 😉🤭😂😂

[welshwarrior]

Depends on the bird the hand moves on the forend/barrels depend on the type of presentation. 

[Walker570]

A flush of 30 -35 partridges appear over the horizon with the wind up their tails are any of you telling me you have time to adjust never mind think as to where your hands are going to be.  Maybe a known flight of a clay is different, but that woodcock suddenly flitting across a ride ????   My left hand will always be upfront, either on the barrel sleeve or the front of the forend on an over and under or semi/pump.  I don't have time to think of that, just concentrating on the bird I hope to kill, the rest is just instinct.   If I start thinking, I can guarantee a miss.

[enfieldspares]

55 minutes ago, welshwarrior said:

Depends on the bird the hand moves on the forend/barrels depend on the type of presentation. 

I can see, understand, where this is coming from. Certainly for rabbits, ground game, it helps supposedly if the front hand is nearer to the action that if you were "shooting flying".

[London Best]

2 hours ago, Walker570 said:

A flush of 30 -35 partridges appear over the horizon with the wind up their tails are any of you telling me you have time to adjust never mind think as to where your hands are going to be.  Maybe a known flight of a clay is different, but that woodcock suddenly flitting across a ride ????   My left hand will always be upfront, either on the barrel sleeve or the front of the forend on an over and under or semi/pump.  I don't have time to think of that, just concentrating on the bird I hope to kill, the rest is just instinct.   If I start thinking, I can guarantee a miss.

All very true. With partridge over hedges, particularly on flat land, the horizon is usually about forty yards away.