Putin announces 'military operation' in Ukraine.

[mchughcb]

4 hours ago, Jaymo said:

For gods sake, if your going to try and strengthen your argument. At least get your linked references right. 
He was included in the Pandora Papers, not the Panama Papers……

Thanks for the correction. How much was in the bank account again?

[henry d]

2 hours ago, ordnance said:

Just one on a long list of miscalculations by Putin / Russia.

No, no, it must be like one of those clickbait videos where they say; "Wait for it!" and when you get there you realise you will never get that time back...ever!

[mchughcb]

2 hours ago, welsh1 said:

Putin holds the record for the longest 3 day war 

 

Did Putin ever declare a 3 day war?

Still 20 years after Bush yelled Mission Accomplished they are still at it.

 

[henry d]

3 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

Thanks for the correction. How much was in the bank account again?

Are you not going to ask for first hand evidence from him instead of possible hearsay or errors? Or do you just use that for your arguments?

[mchughcb]

No I'm not. No I don't.

[12gauge82]

23 hours ago, treetree said:

Most people see this now, but did you think so at the time? For my own shame I remember beating the war drum, urging that we go to war. I bought into the lies sold to us by the politicians, the media and following the herd mentality. We can all look back now and see how we were conned; hundreds of thousands Iraqi civilians died, not to mention the British and US soldiers who also paid with their lives. All for US interest in their oil fields and to protect the dollar.

With that in mind, are you really sure that this conflict is all it appears, or rather all that they are telling you it is?

Funnily enough, I did for a couple of days before it started, what changed my mind (other than I never trusted Blair) was an old veteran who had seen action in ww2, he was interviewed and stated the politicians didn't understand what they had voted for or the horrors of war, he said no good would come of it, despite being patronised like a child during the interview, it left an impression on me. 

 

Fast forward to now, yes I'm sure there are wrongs on all sides, very few things in life are black and white, however the overwhelming, absolute, concrete, black and white fact that is undeniable, is Putin invaded Ukraine, which ultimately makes him responsible for all the subsequent fall out from this conflict, just as Bush and Blair should imo be held accountable for Iraq. 

[timps]

59 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Your posts do confuse me too. 

Because this bit where you say Putin made a mistake declaring martial law is where exactly? 

Are you confused about what you've said? 😂

 

Sigh I’m not confused at all I said.

“History has taught us throughout the years, that a foreign army on foreign land may well be there at the behest of the majority of the population. However, once you start with martial law and controlling the population like a foreign police force on a day-to-day basis rather than fight the so-called common enemy watch the good will sour.

You then lose the moderates and those indifferent to the Russian presence who were broadly supportive, then ultimately it turns nasty as they all see you as a foreign army of occupation impeding and controlling their life and not as allies.”

Obviously the above implies that I think it was a mistake that Putin instigated martial law. I know you are going to argue that it doesn’t.

But let’s try and not go off at tangent on that argument and seeing as you haven’t answered the question let’s try again.

Do you think it is a mistake that Putin instigated martial law ?

Just to preempt you, yes I think the the Americans were wrong in trying martial law and regime changes in Afghanistan and Iraq as a foreign army enforcing it on a foreign land.

No I don’t think Zelenskyy was wrong as it’s his own country with his own troops police and border force.

Stating what about the  USA and Zelenskyy doesn’t answer the question.

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by timps

[Mungler]

8 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Funnily enough, I did for a couple of days before it started, what changed my mind (other than I never trusted Blair) was an old veteran who had seen action in ww2, he was interviewed and stated the politicians didn't understand what they had voted for or the horrors of war, he said no good would come of it, despite being patronised like a child during the interview, it left an impression on me. 

 

Fast forward to now, yes I'm sure there are wrongs on all sides, very few things in life are black and white, however the overwhelming, absolute, concrete, black and white fact that is undeniable, is Putin invaded Ukraine, which ultimately makes him responsible for all the subsequent fall out from this conflict, just as Bush and Blair should imo be held accountable for Iraq. 

 

 

Absolutely.
 

And the invasion and war, so so unnecessary. 

[welsh1]

27 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

Did Putin ever declare a 3 day war?

Still 20 years after Bush yelled Mission Accomplished they are still at it.

 

Did putin think it was going to take this long against a supposedly inferior force?

As for bush and that war ,what has it got to do with putins illegal entry into ukraine and the slaughtering of innocent people, or are you just trying to deflect and justify putins invasion and killing? 

[Mungler]

4 minutes ago, timps said:

 

 

Stating what about the  USA and Zelenskyy doesn’t answer the question.

 

Yeah good luck with that 🙂

Oooh look back over there and now over here - look anywhere but at the right here and right now.

.

Edited October 19, 2022 by Mungler

[welsh1]

I bet this man thanks his lucky stars that russia liberated him from the oppressive regime that is ukraine, and just as thankfull he was shot by a russian officer just for the fun of it losing his leg in the shooting.

Yep he's got a lot to thank russia and putin for.

[timps]

16 minutes ago, Mungler said:

Yeah good luck with that 🙂

😂 I know and seeing as Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results I must be insane, but one can hope a question can be answered without “but what about…”😜

Edited October 19, 2022 by timps

[Rewulf]

1 hour ago, timps said:

Obviously the above implies that I think it was a mistake that Putin instigated martial law. I know you are going to argue that it doesn’t

Well because it doesn't. 

 

1 hour ago, timps said:

But let’s try and not go off at tangent on that argument and seeing as you haven’t answered the question let’s try again.

Do you think it is a mistake that Putin instigated martial law ?

You never asked me a question, and you never mentioned a mistake   so sorry, my powers of telepathy didn't get that. 

But now you've finally asked A Question... I'll say No it's not a 'mistake' 

For 2 reasons, the first being   its only been done 24 hours, how would you know its a mistake? Because of your historical precedent? 

Second,  if the area is under hostile military occupation, as you state it is, what's the point of declaring martial law? 

1 hour ago, timps said:

I know and seeing as Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results I must be insane, but one can hope a question can be answered without “but what about…”😜

I could say , ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer, but when you don't ask a question in the first place, why would you expect an answer? 😂

I ask you and Mungler questions all the time, but you both dodge the hard ones, as it makes you examine the narrative a little too closely for your comfort levels. 

Don't forget, Mungler really does believe PW is full of Soviet spies, but it's me that's 'nuts' 🤣

[timps]

49 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Well because it doesn't. 

Oh so what was written in no way implied it was a mistake and that I was actually writing a post supportive of a foreign power imposing martial law in a foreign land, errr my mistake its clearly obvious now, how silly of me.🙂

51 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

You never asked me a question, and you never mentioned a mistake   so sorry, my powers of telepathy didn't get that. 

I guess when I wrote

“Are you now agreeing with me that Putin made a mistake declaring marital law?”

Then put a question mark at the end it wasn’t a question?  

Why did I have to use the word ‘mistake’ previously, it is a simple question with a simple answer to say “No it's not a 'mistake'”. 

If you can’t fathom that I thought it is a ‘mistake’ from all the previous posts I wrote I’m not too sure what you are reading. I knew you would just focus on the word ‘mistake’ just like the word ‘disagree’ in the previous post before.

I thought you would have understood the definition of 'mistake' and applied it to the previous posts, it really isn't that difficult to work out.

54 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

For 2 reasons, the first being   its only been done 24 hours, how would you know its a mistake? Because of your historical precedent? 

Yes, isn’t that what history teaches us?

If it was only going to last 24 hours then you would be correct, however, you and I have no idea how long it is going to last, so I ask you back how do you know it’s not a mistake if time is the only factor?

If it lasts longer would you be incline to agree it was a mistake?

55 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Second,  if the area is under hostile military occupation, as you state it is, what's the point of declaring martial law? 

I didn’t state it was under ‘hostile’ military occupation, is this where because I never mentioned the word ‘hostile’, I ignore the question or pretend I don’t know what the question means without telepathy?

Or do I actually know what the definition of hostile means so I can debate it properly without the silliness.

Anyway, are you trying to say Putin hasn’t declared martial law?

What I did state is how people view an army of liberation as an army of occupation once that army starts to control their every day lives with check points and ‘accidental’ shootings of people who don’t comply (yes just like the Americans did).

If, however, the troops stay on the front line and just engage the enemy this tends not to happen. So based on that I think it is a tactical mistake. 

But I do struggle to understand what point you are making in point 2.

57 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

I ask you and Mungler questions all the time, but you both dodge the hard ones,

What hard questions? Please enlighten me

You have asked irrelevant ones that have nothing to do with the current conflict that I haven’t answered, like what about this or what about that.  

[Mungler]

6 hours ago, Rewulf said:

I ask you and Mungler questions all the time, but you both dodge the hard ones, as it makes you examine the narrative a little too closely for your comfort levels. 

Don't forget, Mungler really does believe PW is full of Soviet spies, but it's me that's 'nuts' 🤣

PW is full of ever so clever alternative deep thinkers who refuse to be sheeple and who actively look to find conspiracy everywhere.

These people have been entirely brainwashed by Kremlin propaganda because it’s all down the same rabbit hole - it’s alternative, it’s not MSM, it’s stuff only they can cleverly search for and find in the far corners of the internet and all Kremlin content cannot feed truth but easily feeds conspiracy.

In fairness, of the Kremlin shills we have Reuwolf at the saner end of the spectrum and Stonepark and MCHughCB at the other totally bonkerooney end.

As for tough questions I’ve ducked - I love a test. Fire away, list them out. Shall we impose a voluntary word count for question and answer?

.

Edited October 20, 2022 by Mungler

[mchughcb]

How much is the government paying your heating bill?

[Mungler]

27 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

How much is the government paying your heating bill?

I don’t need and don’t expect government to fix any and all problems that come my way.

As far as I am aware the government isn’t paying anyones heating bill and that is because no government has money of its own, it only has money it collects off tax payers. So, even if the government were to pay my heating bill, that would be a bill I would end up ultimately wearing through taxation.

Also, I have a confirmed installation date this month for a roof solar system I ordered the very day Putin invaded Ukraine (and I’m not joking either).

[mchughcb]

Thankyou for the reply. Word count was what?

[Jaymo]

48 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

How much is the government paying your heating bill?

We are due to receive a rebate of £400 paid directly to the energy provider that the consumer is utilising to help with the cost of living.
 

But…… isn’t this the same sort of ‘assistance’ of 250AUD offered in your region? 
 

I am left wondering the price of fish with your obsession to our energy rebate. 

[mchughcb]

Not sure. I receive nothing.

Is assistance per month or annual?

[Newbie to this]

26 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

Not sure. I receive nothing.

Is assistance per month or annual?

1 off

[Jaymo]

The Victorian Government have implemented as scheme to help with the cost of living crisis by offering a ‘one off’ payment In return for users searching out better energy deals. 
 

Quite clever really. By not giving it out in blanket fashion there are those who won’t know to apply. Then there is the part where people using the site discover they can get a cheaper provider thus saving money and being less reliant on Government handouts. 
Makes the Victorian Government look good too. 

[mchughcb]

I had martial law in Victoria for months. 23 hours a day home detention,  5km limit, nobody on the streets after 8pm. Old people still died and the economy lost $65B in cash payments.

Coincidentally the same payment to Ukraine by the west.

[welsh1]

29 minutes ago, mchughcb said:

I had martial law in Victoria for months. 23 hours a day home detention,  5km limit, nobody on the streets after 8pm. Old people still died and the economy lost $65B in cash payments.

Coincidentally the same payment to Ukraine by the west.

Did the military take control of Victoria?

[Stonepark]

2 hours ago, Mungler said:

PW is full of ever so clever alternative deep thinkers who refuse to be sheeple and who actively look to find conspiracy everywhere.

In fairness, of the Kremlin shills we have Reuwolf at the saner end of the spectrum and Stonepark and MCHughCB at the other totally bonkerooney end.

As for tough questions I’ve ducked - I love a test. Fire away, list them out. Shall we impose a voluntary word count for question and answer?

.

Thank you for acknowledging that we spend a good time of our lives thinking. The problem is that every where we look we do find "conspiracy", government lies, MSM lies, deplatforming, "fact checking misinformation", etc etc..... If it's true, it's not a conspiracy.....

Fortunately, we are nowhere near the "bonkeroony" end, we simply are prepared to question what we are told, consider other sources and make up our own minds based on having as complete a picture as possible. The fact that this does not coincide with the mainstream "concensus" parroted by the MSM merely shows how much "control" they have.

Question... Should the UN\Nato have intervened in Ukraine and supported the last democratically elected Russian orientated Ukranian government in order to prevent the illegal coup in 2014?