Dave at kelton Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 So, Thames Water needs to increase bills by 59% to survive. So why not let it go bust by refusing it and take it back under Government control for pennies? Utilities should never have been privatised. It would send the strongest possible message to the other under performing Authorities and stop fat cats and shareholders creaming off money that should be going to service. Debate, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 My thoughts exactly the minute I heard the news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 agree...........the parasites have sucked it dry...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkom Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 Better by far to instruct the fundholding companies( at the time that profits were being taken) to fund the restoration of infrastructure.....after all when the last big crash affected Lloyds with result of massive payouts, the "members" ie those who had invested in the affected syndicates had to dig in to their own pockets to meet the payout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 It's failure is a failure of the regulator under govt pressure. We have to pay more to upgrade antiquated services. We know that, Thames knows that and the regulator knows that but still restricts the amount by which Thames can raise bills. Investors need to make a return and that is allowed under the regulator but still investment and upgrading is restricted. Now the need for investment has turned into a crisis. Fat cat shareholders 🤣 . Don't want to get them involved then lets turn it to a commy state company and see how much that costs to run. You cant have it both ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 Let it go, same as the banks. Why should the public prop up a private company, it's like having their cake and eating it. If you or I defaulted on our council tax, no ones going to pay it for us, you pay or go to jail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 15 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said: Let it go, same as the banks. Why should the public prop up a private company, it's like having their cake and eating it. If you or I defaulted on our council tax, no ones going to pay it for us, you pay or go to jail. It's not a truly private company. It's profit, investment and prices are set by a regulator. The regulator (and it's government masters) has failed. Let it go bust and we will still pick up the tab and pay the price in our pension investments. As a state owned entity, I doubt it will perform as well as it would as a private entity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun4860 Posted August 29 Report Share Posted August 29 33 minutes ago, oowee said: It's not a truly private company. It's profit, investment and prices are set by a regulator. The regulator (and it's government masters) has failed. Let it go bust and we will still pick up the tab and pay the price in our pension investments. As a state owned entity, I doubt it will perform as well as it would as a private entity. There must be figures out there that show how much money the investment companies have siphoned off. If it was government owned that money could have gone towards reinvesting. No countries Gas/electricity/water should be run by foreign countries Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesj Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 One big reason for not taking it back in to government control is the same reason the water companies were sold off in the first place the infrastructure is old out of date and needs replacing, who much do you think it will cost to replace the old victorian sewers in london? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 6 hours ago, shaun4860 said: There must be figures out there that show how much money the investment companies have siphoned off. If it was government owned that money could have gone towards reinvesting. No countries Gas/electricity/water should be run by foreign countries Undoubtedly, but that is gone and there will be no way of getting it back. The infrastructure is old and knackered and "we" will have to pay to fix it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 (edited) 7 hours ago, shaun4860 said: There must be figures out there that show how much money the investment companies have siphoned off. If it was government owned that money could have gone towards reinvesting. No countries Gas/electricity/water should be run by foreign countries Its about 6% of the money put in. The minimum rate of return (set by the regulator) required to keep the investment in. There were some greater profits from the estate that was more proactively developed following privatisation. 40 minutes ago, bluesj said: One big reason for not taking it back in to government control is the same reason the water companies were sold off in the first place the infrastructure is old out of date and needs replacing, who much do you think it will cost to replace the old victorian sewers in london? ^^^^^^ This. The UK is running on past glories. Edited August 30 by oowee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 (edited) You also have to take into account the massive amount of building that's going on in London In the London Borough of Harrow alone they have built or are building 1000 new flats on an old sports field, 3000 flats on a 16 acre brown field site and will soon be building another 1000 flats on the site of the old Civic Centre. Plus other smaller developments. This is just one Borough, the same is going on all over London . That's the Thames Water area Who is going to pay for the extra infrastructure to supply water and sewage facilities to all those new homes? The water doesn't just supply itself . We already know the sewage system can't cope now. We talk about how the population is going up and up, mostly through migration. Well this is the cost of that population increase Edited August 30 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 2 hours ago, Vince Green said: You also have to take into account the massive amount of building that's going on in London In the London Borough of Harrow alone they have built or are building 1000 new flats on an old sports field, 3000 flats on a 16 acre brown field site and will soon be building another 1000 flats on the site of the old Civic Centre. Plus other smaller developments. This is just one Borough, the same is going on all over London . That's the Thames Water area Who is going to pay for the extra infrastructure to supply water and sewage facilities to all those new homes? The water doesn't just supply itself . We already know the sewage system can't cope now. We talk about how the population is going up and up, mostly through migration. Well this is the cost of that population increase Very true, there are countless unrecorded and uncountable costs to mass uncontrolled migration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted August 30 Report Share Posted August 30 (edited) 4 hours ago, bluesj said: One big reason for not taking it back in to government control is the same reason the water companies were sold off in the first place the infrastructure is old out of date and needs replacing, who much do you think it will cost to replace the old victorian sewers in london? so what have the water companies being doing for the last 30 years ?......paying themselves and the investors......they have raped yet another resorce all the water companies are robbers....rather than invest/replace the infrusture....and build reservoirs........they drill more bore holes and rape our ground water.......thats why our streams have dried up ...our rivers are not running right they are bloody theives Edited August 30 by ditchman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted August 31 Report Share Posted August 31 Over 30% of Thames Water is owned by a Canadian Pension fund. 8.7% is owned by the Chinese Govt through a shell company The Abu Dhabi Royal family own a small slice too This is not unusual but it points very clearly to where the problem lies with many of our traditional institutions, not just Thames Water Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted August 31 Report Share Posted August 31 3 hours ago, Vince Green said: Over 30% of Thames Water is owned by a Canadian Pension fund. 8.7% is owned by the Chinese Govt through a shell company The Abu Dhabi Royal family own a small slice too This is not unusual but it points very clearly to where the problem lies with many of our traditional institutions, not just Thames Water Why so? You don't like capitalism? For me the fault lies with the rules drawn up by govt for the regulator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow Bear Posted August 31 Report Share Posted August 31 38 minutes ago, oowee said: For me the fault lies with the rules drawn up by govt for the regulator. Yes it was clever of Blair to change the rules in 2004 to reduce by over half what the water companies had to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oowee Posted August 31 Report Share Posted August 31 1 hour ago, Yellow Bear said: Yes it was clever of Blair to change the rules in 2004 to reduce by over half what the water companies had to do. That's going back a bit. Not so clever and not reversed despite the growing problem in 20 years. Madness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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