Dispelling a myth about shooting into the air!

[pandamonia]

Fair enough. I just hope you manage to retain your cert whilst doing it.

 

 

dont worry i use my shotgun for this kinda thing!

 

it just got me thinking when i saw the guy get mullered for roost shooting his 22lr

[pandamonia]

Please don't patronise me

 

Sorry this wasnt my intention. i just read that article and to be honest that bullet could have come from a drive by shooting as far as the news people knew of

[Ozzy Fudd]

i think the obvious question is around exactly where the bullet came from, if you read up i said that 45 degree shooting is stupid and dangerous but vertical was theoretically no more dangerous than dropping the bullet off a building.

 

im seeing a flaw here. you keep saying vertical and straight up, but what happens if the wind catches it so it isnt vertical? or what if you shoot up into a tree vertically, and glance off a branch, sending the round out on a not so vertical trajectory? we all know how .22lr's like to ricochet...

[pandamonia]

im seeing a flaw here. you keep saying vertical and straight up, but what happens if the wind catches it so it isnt vertical? or what if you shoot up into a tree vertically, and glance off a branch, sending the round out on a not so vertical trajectory? we all know how .22lr's like to ricochet...

 

thats a good point about ricochets, i think the wind would just move the POI just like when shooting a target but like a target in the sky. if you think of the arc from the trajectory after its hit its peak it starts to fall but only with the force of gravity.

 

anyway off to pub!

 

thanks for the opinions

[Dekers]

I'm struggling to understand why this is being discussed, is it just a late April 1st windup.

 

Don't even think about shooting a rifle in the air; and debate about angles is pointless, just don't do it!

 

If anyone wants to argue the right or wrong then try it with your FEO on your next renewal.

 

[hookbones]

if you read up i said that i dont shoot up but i was refering to people making comments and their lack of anything fact based. i personally have never seen a story about someone dying from a falling bullet.

 

if you watch that myth busters video they fire a penny at maximum velocity that 2.5 grams can travel from a free fall and it didnt even break the skin. a 40 grain 22lr is 2.5 grams and at maximum speed it is 64mph and this wasnt enough to even hurt them more than a sting. and this was fired with the edge facing down.

 

also the 10ft lbs was the theoretical maximum but air pressure, lift and wind resistance plays a huge part in the velocity.

pandamonia` you said you dont do it SINCE you got a shot gun which implies you did before... even if by your frankly questionable reckoning its the safest thing in the world to be doing then there's still the armed trespass you committing as the bullet leaves your boundary....oh sorry i forgot you calculated exactly where that lead is going to land didnt you

 

if you want to come on a public forum n make this claim that its totally acceptable to shoot without backstop or full knowledge of where that round will go i would suggest you also inform your FEO of this theory and see what happens .

[MC]

I'm struggling to understand why this is being discussed, is it just a late April 1st windup.

 

Don't even think about shooting a rifle in the air; and debate about angles is pointless, just don't do it!

 

If anyone wants to argue the right or wrong then try it with your FEO on your next renewal.

 

 

 

I completely agree with Dekers,

 

Why is this being discussed with someone who doesn't know any better and is not prepared to listen. Personally I never fire a rifle unless I am sure of the backstop.

 

Firing one into the air is just plain stupidity.

[Paddy Galore!]

i wouldn't risk it either, i know you're being hypothetical, but i reckon a 22lr slug fired vertically will get up there some. whatever velocity it reaches by the time it hits the deck, if it hits you it's gonna hurt.

even lead shot stings, if you dont believe me then ask evil elvis, we were both getting peppered at the christmas shoot at hi lodge.

[ST3V3]

so i the bullet is falling at 10lbft is not going to hurt

 

so how many lbft is required to kill a rabbit with a head shot?

 

im sure its about 4 lbft so its gonna hurt end of!

[Paddy Galore!]

so i the bullet is falling at 10lbft is not going to hurt

 

so how many lbft is required to kill a rabbit with a head shot?

 

im sure its about 4 lbft so its gonna hurt end of!

also, top of the skull! ouch!

[Billy.]

Sir, you are an idiot.

 

There's a perfectly good reason why you don't shoot up in the air: Because it's very very very very very dangerous.

 

I take it you know for a 100% certainty that there isn't a rambler walking across a field a mile away, where your bullet will be likely to land.

 

You don't deserve a licence.

[fireshot]

I got hit on my bold head when we were beating with a shotgun pellet and I can tell you I felt that and stung for a few minutes later so hate to feel what a bullet would feel like ?

[Paddy Galore!]

Sir, you are an idiot.

 

There's a perfectly good reason why you don't shoot up in the air: Because it's very very very very very dangerous.

 

I take it you know for a 100% certainty that there isn't a rambler walking across a field a mile away, where your bullet will be likely to land.

 

You don't deserve a licence.

i think he was only being hypothetical, not that he actually does this. Anyway, he's gone down the pub!

[Blunderbuss]

Guys, guys you've got it wrong. We are all just "grumpy old men" and this daft idea about not shooting in the air is "just another load of British ********". We are all wrong and pandamonia, who bases his science on a yank TV show and thinks ice is denser than lead is right

[humperdingle]

to put this into perspective some hail stones in this country weigh more than this and travel from higher up and are also much more dense than soft lead.

 

Actually, good point there...

 

How does the density thing work? My understanding was the opposite.

[Ozzy Fudd]

come on lads no point laying into him, he raised a valid question going by information he received and posted it here (albeit he could have worded some/most of his replies better )

 

now which would you rather have, someone being able to ask a daft question on here without being pounded for it, or someone being too afraid to ask a question so going out and trying it, with disastrous results! i know which id pick...

 

and for the record id never shoot up, no matter what

[MC]

The density of ice is 0.9167 g/cm³ at 0°C, whereas water has a density of 0.9998 g/cm³ at the same temperature

 

Density of lead 11.34 g/cm³

 

 

It looks to me as if lead is about 12 times denser than ice but then maybe pandamonia will find a reason why this is incorrect.

 

 

Harfordwmj,

 

Don't worry about his licence, he doesn't have one. It is the easter holidays after all.

[humperdingle]

now which would you rather have, someone being able to ask a daft question on here without being pounded for it, or someone being too afraid to ask a question so going out and trying it, with disastrous results! i know which id pick...

I think the point is that he's asked the opinions of members, received much the same answer off everybody, and still is managing to come up with "Black is white".

[Blunderbuss]

The concern is though that someone new to shooting or a few pork pies short of a picnic might be swayed by such rubbish.

 

And how arrogant is this:

 

I'm frankly getting so tired of hearing grumpy old men telling people you are an idiot for shotting a 22lr into the air, its unsafe bla bla bla.

Edited April 3, 2010 by Blunderbuss

[drut]

""Anybody remember the site How Do Bullets Fly ?

 

From a FAQ at www.nennstiel-ruprecht.de/bullfly

 

Q: If a bullet is fired vertically from a rifle, what will its terminal velocity be if it strikes the top of someones head on its way back down?

 

A: This question is hard to answer in general. The best I can give is a "worst-case" estimation.

When a gun is fired vertically, the bullet after some time reaches a summit where the velocity is zero, and then falls back. The bullet will fall back base first which is hard to calculate. I can estimate the velocity if it would fall nose first, that is the normal flying position for which drag is well known - so the real terminal velocity will actually be smaller than the following prediction.

 

For a .22 lr bullet (m=40 grain, v0 = 1150 ft/s)

the summit will be at 1164 ft, the total flight time 30 seconds and the terminal velocity 270 ft/s

For a SS109 military bullet (m= 55 grain, v0=3200 ft/s)

the summit will be at 2650 ft, the total flight time 44 seconds and the terminal velocity 404 ft/s.

For this bullet are indications that it will become unstable. This will further reduce summit height and terminal velocity considerably"

 

Taken from http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=178969

I for one don't want to hit anyone with 270fps/6.48ft/lb.This thread is best suited to April 1st.

[Chard]

I don't know whether it would be fatal or not, but I'm hardly going to accept some trumped up BS figures from some kid who's been reading too many survivalist books as "fact".

 

Load of cock.

 

By the same mindless logic, he's saying that it would be OK to fire a BB gun into my face at point blank range because it wouldn't kill me.

 

That would result in me ripping the shooter a new ****hole in double quick time, fatal or not

[Ozzy Fudd]

I think the point is that he's asked the opinions of members, received much the same answer off everybody, and still is managing to come up with "Black is white".

 

 

The concern is though that someone new to shooting or a few pork pies short of a picnic might be swayed by such rubbish

 

im not disputing that it was a stupid question and that the op was being a *** in his replies. all i meant was one post detailing why its wrong and should not be done is more useful than 1000 replies simply stating "dont do it you idiot" (which pigeonwatch seems best at lately), ESPECIALLY for new shooters

[Floating Chamber]

What's a **** who fires in the air doing with a SGC or FAC in the first place?

[Ozzy Fudd]

What's a **** who fires in the air doing with a SGC or FAC in the first place?

 

i fire in the air with my shotgun all the time :lol: :no:

[Chard]

What's a **** who fires in the air doing with a SGC or FAC in the first place?

 

 

You grumpy old man :no: