subsonicnat Posted October 26, 2012 Report Share Posted October 26, 2012 You made a rod for your own back mate, and maybe a few others as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted October 26, 2012 Report Share Posted October 26, 2012 (edited) Removed as I rambled a bit. Edited October 26, 2012 by welsh1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanl50 Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) I have no written permission for the 4 farms I shoot on its all a gentlemans agreement and we shake hands, if I were to ask they would probaly be insulted, there word is there bond. As I said before in previous posts covering this I only ring 101 for 1 farm and thats only when lamping. its no big deal and if it saves an ARV arriving and the Force helicopter, 15 pence is a small price considering the cost of the Helicopter and the ARV turning out. You must do what you think is best for your circumstances Edited October 27, 2012 by Alanl50 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Al Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 I have never rang the police in 30 years of shooting and have never being asked to by the police to do so. And i live in N Ireland you would think the police here would be wary of reports of gun shots but its never being a problem. They will be asking to go with you next. Me too. Well said. You are engaging in a lawful activity with the land owners permission. No need to tell them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaserF3 Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 I honestly think that the police of today are lacking in a little bit of commonsense where law abiding shooters are involved, they seem to want to turn a legal activity into an armed response scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 once you start that they will want it all the time, then it will become law, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchieboy Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) This has been done to death so many times and different members have different opinions on the matter! Mi line of thoughts on the matter (Once again) are: While there is no legal obligation to phone up and create a "log number" or "Incident report" if you are likely to be shooting in a "sensitive location" (i.e. where there are known antis living locally) then phoning up to let the police know that you are going to be legally shooting nearby can be an advantage. I does not need you to phone 101 or any other "premium rate number" as has been suggested, all you need to do is find the (Local National rate) number of your local call centre and call them on that local number (Mine is 01282). It only takes a couple of minutes and then if someone does phone in and reports someone for shooting in the area or a "suspicious car/vehicle parked in a lane" then the police only need to phone you on your mobile to confirm that it is you which can save both the police and you time and inconvenience by them having to be called out to check on who it is. I do call in but only when I am in one particular permission where the immediate neighbour is a confirmed anti and have saved myself a lot of uneccessary agro by doing so with the police only having to call on my mobile to confirm that it is me that is shooting. With this in mind I believe that the reply that Dirty Harry has put up is fair and accurate, and it does look like he knows what he is talking about. Edit. Let's put it this way - If you are out shooting in what could be classed as a "sensitive area" (Where antis are known to live or relatively near to a school or whatever) which would you rather have? I quick call on your mobile asking if it is you or if you have seen or heard any other shooter in that area or an armed response unit and hellicopter turning up and spending half an hour or more questioning you and possibly completely ruining your shooting session? I know what I would prefer but that's just me, everyone has and is entitled to have their own different views and opinions on the matter! Edited October 27, 2012 by Frenchieboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedwards1966 Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 But for the sake of a 30 second call to 101 (the non emergency police number if people don't know) then is it really a big hassle? 30 seconds to connect, speak to a person and finish? It usually takes me twice that long for the stupid voice recognition to finally get it right, never mind actually then holding a conversation! Now, for goodness sake, let me make this clear: STOP CALLING THE POLICE TO TELL THEM WHEN YOU ARE OUT SHOOTING. Shooting over land is a perfectly legal activity. Now, I don't want the ARU coming and interrupting me either, however can you not all see that by informing them we're making it the norm? Then, 'as everybody does it' it will be made a requirement, and we will have to tell them every time we take a gun out. Next, they'll require 24 hours notice. Then that will change to written notice 7 days in advance, then 'notice' will change to a request for permission. We already have a large number of rules and restrictions upon us, shooting is suffering because of this, why do we want to shoot ourselves in the foot and kill shooting even further, by doing something that is not required of us? I don't ask the police every time I'm taking my car out, both activities are as legal and necessary as each other. As things are, the only circumstances I would ever consider telling them would be if I were shooting in an area that could cause (me) problems. Such areas would be outside gov listening stations or other such secure and secretive bases, where they might get worried. Even then, if I felt they could be concerned, I think it would be much better to tell someone at the site what you were doing, rather than the police, who'll come out and check anyway if phoned by the security. Stop helping the demise of our sport and for many of us, work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 Knock on a few local doors and you can usually find out who owns the land. Why not justy check the mans FAC cert or photo driving card for his address? do we not have coppers with any common sense these days? jeeze i am finding more and more they think too darn much of the word force rather than service and thier tazers and pepper spray are more important than a brain- all can be sorted later (poachers and villans are not likely to be forthcomming with such things) Running away is a blooming good clue someone shouldn't be there BTW. Want to alienate the general public? then carry on making your own non-existant laws and wearing combat boots cargo pants etc. Forget about all the things your grandfarthers knew. Oh while we are on it put up some posters saying "police are active on crime in this area" its a good clue to villans they arnt and its about an hour away from a responce! Glad i got that of my chest LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 30 seconds to connect, speak to a person and finish? It usually takes me twice that long for the stupid voice recognition to finally get it right, never mind actually then holding a conversation! Now, for goodness sake, let me make this clear: STOP CALLING THE POLICE TO TELL THEM WHEN YOU ARE OUT SHOOTING. Shooting over land is a perfectly legal activity. Now, I don't want the ARU coming and interrupting me either, however can you not all see that by informing them we're making it the norm? Then, 'as everybody does it' it will be made a requirement, and we will have to tell them every time we take a gun out. Next, they'll require 24 hours notice. Then that will change to written notice 7 days in advance, then 'notice' will change to a request for permission. We already have a large number of rules and restrictions upon us, shooting is suffering because of this, why do we want to shoot ourselves in the foot and kill shooting even further, by doing something that is not required of us? I don't ask the police every time I'm taking my car out, both activities are as legal and necessary as each other. As things are, the only circumstances I would ever consider telling them would be if I were shooting in an area that could cause (me) problems. Such areas would be outside gov listening stations or other such secure and secretive bases, where they might get worried. Even then, if I felt they could be concerned, I think it would be much better to tell someone at the site what you were doing, rather than the police, who'll come out and check anyway if phoned by the security. Stop helping the demise of our sport and for many of us, work. So when I'm shooting on the sports ground being overlooked by commuters on the railway embankment stopped and queueing on the train to get into the station during rush hour there is no need to call the police, when I am shooting at a Garden centre on a major roundabout on an "A" road with a massive pedestrian walkway over it and it full view of pedestrians and vehicle drivers there is no need to let the police know, when I am in the company car park in full view of anyone who wants to look shooting pigeons there is no need to let the police know, etc etc as I said in post 22 above... As always there are some very macho responses here born out of little experience, or thought, in many cases............. .........You have to be realistic and sensible and use your brains! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedwards1966 Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 So when I'm shooting on the sports ground being overlooked by commuters on the railway embankment stopped and queueing on the train to get into the station during rush hour there is no need to call the police, when I am shooting at a Garden centre on a major roundabout on an "A" road with a massive pedestrian walkway over it and it full view of pedestrians and vehicle drivers there is no need to let the police know, when I am in the company car park in full view of anyone who wants to look shooting pigeons there is no need to let the police know, etc etc as I said in post 22 above... As always there are some very macho responses here born out of little experience, or thought, in many cases............. .........You have to be realistic and sensible and use your brains! So if you don't tell them, and they actually get round to coming round to investigate, you show them your certificate(s), something showing you have permission, and carry on. If you do tell them, they might still come and check, then in a few years I'll have to ask to be able to take my gun with me to shoot any vermin I come across as I'm working. I'll have to ask if it's OK to go out lamping, I'll have to be in by a certain time and anything else they dream up. Yep, really sensible. Lets all just get on with our Lawful activity. I do agree with you btw about not wearing this stupid cammo gear - dress up as a pretend soldier and go round with a gun, then wonder why people phone the police in the first place... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 the situations Dekers describes are very different to general shooting, under those circumstances i should get a log number and give it to the MRS as evidence to sue the cops if they slipped up and shot me as a terrorist or nutter! In reality round here keepers drive on public roads with loaded guns clipped to thier quads and i must be one of the few who actually own a gunslip, nobody bats an eyelid to this sort of thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 So if you don't tell them, and they actually get round to coming round to investigate, you show them your certificate(s), something showing you have permission, and carry on. If you do tell them, they might still come and check, then in a few years I'll have to ask to be able to take my gun with me to shoot any vermin I come across as I'm working. I'll have to ask if it's OK to go out lamping, I'll have to be in by a certain time and anything else they dream up. Yep, really sensible. Lets all just get on with our Lawful activity. I do agree with you btw about not wearing this stupid cammo gear - dress up as a pretend soldier and go round with a gun, then wonder why people phone the police in the first place... You have an interesting view, which is not born out by my experiences. Round this way the police use their brains and call me if they get a report. And I don't ask them anything, I tell them. I'm not interested that it is a lawful activity, if the police keep getting called and interrupt my work then they get ****** off, so do I, and that leads to grief, and is MORE likely to make police advice mandatory rather than less, it also doesn't help my relationship with the police and potentially makes life interesting at renewal under the heading of NOT A SUITABLE PERSON, as I apparently have no consideration for them! as I said in post 22 above... As always there are some very macho responses here born out of little experience, or thought, in many cases............. .........You have to be realistic and sensible and use your brains! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) the situations Dekers describes are very different to general shooting, under those circumstances i should get a log number and give it to the MRS as evidence to sue the cops if they slipped up and shot me as a terrorist or nutter! In reality round here keepers drive on public roads with loaded guns clipped to thier quads and i must be one of the few who actually own a gunslip, nobody bats an eyelid to this sort of thing Precisely, and when I'm out in the middle of a country estate with nobody but the quarry to worry about do I call the police every time, certainly not! I am not for one second suggesting you should rush to the phone every time you grab you gun. So just what is this about? "Now, for goodness sake, let me make this clear: STOP CALLING THE POLICE TO TELL THEM WHEN YOU ARE OUT SHOOTING." as I said in post 22 above... As always, there are some very macho responses here born out of little experience, or thought, in many cases............. .........You have to be realistic and sensible and use your brains Edited October 27, 2012 by Dekers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerCat Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 As has been said before, unless YOU think you might get a visit from plod as you happen to be shooting in a sensitive area, I wouldn't call the police to let them know, they don't need to know. I never have and can't see that I ever will due to where I shoot and a lack of antis in the area. If I was shooting by the m25 in view of passing cars I might change my mind, or at the end of a school playing field or similar, other than that I'd just carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12boreblue Posted October 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 Just to update this thread, finished shooting today and now at home, just received a call on my home telephone (a number I did not give to them) asking if I had finished shooting?I told them I had and now they want me to call them when I have finished. I am going to contact the chief of Police for that area and see what he has to say about these requests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikk Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 Chaps, The person at the end of the phone line will likely not be a police officer but civilian call handler. They are under immense pressure not to screw up so they will often take more and ask more than is necessary. Giving the car registration could be handy as members of the public do ring up a lot saying this or that car is parked up and it looks unusual or out of place. That would then save time for us. Likewise if someone phones up saying I've seen a bloke with a gun and he got out of this car we can deal with it without sending anyone out. Same for the timings. Also remember these call handlers are not legal experts. It's not their job so they can't know everything. They take calls from people about absolutely everything and I'm sure you have seen the sort of stuff I'm on about on tv. Having said that there is no requirement to inform the police. I don't and have no intention of doing so but if you do have the courtesy to let them know when your done if its asked as they can then shut the log down and know your not there later when shots are heard and it might be poachers. I forgot to say when you phone up and they create a log depending on the type of call a certain set of questions are generated. They can be quite general so some of the questions might not seem meaningful to you but they would be to reports of someone shooting/poaching who has a vehicle nearby. Don't take it to heart and don't dwell on it. You will just be one of thousands of people to call the police that day. Remember 5WH......Who , What, Where, When, Why, How.......the police ask questions.....it's what we do! Harry Hi Harry I have always wanted to ask this because one of the worst things I can imagine happening would be getting confronted by pumped up armed response types thanks to an ill informed call from the public. When the handler receives a call do they use a bit of common sense and try and find out if the 'man with a gun' is likely to be a legal shooter or do they just cover their backsides and send in armed response? I mean a man with a gun in the middle of a field far from people is no threat even if he is a madman. The reason I ask this is because I saw a video on youtube titled what to expect from armed response or something...It looked way way over the top to me lots of shouting and grabbing. If I ever had a gun pointed at me regardless of who they were I would absolutely sue even if I wasn't going to win, after all accidents can happen. Cheers Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Harry Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 Why not justy check the mans FAC cert or photo driving card for his address? do we not have coppers with any common sense these days? jeeze i am finding more and more they think too darn much of the word force rather than service and thier tazers and pepper spray are more important than a brain- all can be sorted later (poachers and villans are not likely to be forthcomming with such things) Running away is a blooming good clue someone shouldn't be there BTW. Want to alienate the general public? then carry on making your own non-existant laws and wearing combat boots cargo pants etc. Forget about all the things your grandfarthers knew. Oh while we are on it put up some posters saying "police are active on crime in this area" its a good clue to villans they arnt and its about an hour away from a responce! Glad i got that of my chest LOL Kent, I don't carry any id with me when I'm out shooting and even if I did how would this confirm what land I own. FYI we don't have a choice what uniform we get issued and I preferred the shirt and tie with normal trousers. Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Harry Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 Hi Harry I have always wanted to ask this because one of the worst things I can imagine happening would be getting confronted by pumped up armed response types thanks to an ill informed call from the public. When the handler receives a call do they use a bit of common sense and try and find out if the 'man with a gun' is likely to be a legal shooter or do they just cover their backsides and send in armed response? I mean a man with a gun in the middle of a field far from people is no threat even if he is a madman. The reason I ask this is because I saw a video on youtube titled what to expect from armed response or something...It looked way way over the top to me lots of shouting and grabbing. If I ever had a gun pointed at me regardless of who they were I would absolutely sue even if I wasn't going to win, after all accidents can happen. Cheers Nick They are not all pumped up ARV types. A good few of my ARV mates are shooters and loads more are ex forces. Most callers are taken by call handlers. They are supposed to get as much detail as possible and then it's passed to the control room for allocation. The control room inspector will be the person who makes the decision to deploy the ARV. That decision will be based on the information they have. If part of that information is that there is a bloke lawfully shooting in that very area then it will effect the deployment decision. If you did come into contact with them I suggest good manners and honesty and you won't go far wrong. Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncan Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) the only time we call the police is when we are shooting rabbits on a country park and a local school where members of the public can have access , a 5 minute call and we are given a u.r.n. number , when shooting on farms i don`t bother to call them Edited October 27, 2012 by duncan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuartbrierley Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 i used to phone in not anymore while lamping rabbits police 4x4 came across stuble field all lights on then got out and asked me by name how i was doing ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedwards1966 Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 You have an interesting view, which is not born out by my experiences. Round this way the police use their brains and call me if they get a report. That's perfectly sensible, I'd be fine if I got a call from the police saying 'is it you shooting at..., as someone has phoned in about a man with a gun...'. But I'm not stupid enough to tell the police where I will or won't be in advance, just in case they want to investigate something that may happen. And I don't ask them anything, I tell them. Your missing the point - keep telling them and it's then expected of you, as we are already seeing. It then becomes a requirement, and then you will end up asking. I'm not interested that it is a lawful activity, if the police keep getting called and interrupt my work then they get ****** off, so do I, and that leads to grief, and is MORE likely to make police advice mandatory rather than less, it also doesn't help my relationship with the police and potentially makes life interesting at renewal under the heading of NOT A SUITABLE PERSON, as I apparently have no consideration for them! That's utter rubbish. Not phoning the police to tell them when and where you shoot does not effect your suitability to hold a FAC/SGC. Not telling them where and when your shooting is not being inconsiderate, it's simply getting on with your sport/hobby/work. Not telling them which roads I will be using to get to work when driving my car isn't being inconsiderate either. It's the same thing. as I said in post 22 above... As always there are some very macho responses here born out of little experience, or thought, in many cases............. .........You have to be realistic and sensible and use your brains! It is not difficult to work out that by telling them where and when we're shooting we are making the path to it becoming a requirement. Using your brain tells you that being required to tell, and eventually ask, the police every time you shoot is a very bad idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livefast123 Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 Bear in mind that generally the people in the control room are not police officers and therefore do not have any experience of how police on the front line operate. Every call is generally treated as a major Jeremy Kyle emergency when to the average officer it is clear that nothing out of the ordinary is going on. In our force they operate a system of pre programmed questions and have to go through these before they can continue and forward the call to dispatch, most of these questions are completely irrelevant and a waste of time. The Force Incident Manager will then look at the call and decide whether to code a armed unit or send a district unit. You would be suprised at the amount of firearms calls that district get send to when I'm thinking mmmm thats a bit dodgy. If you've done nothing wrong then it should take literally minutes while you get checked, mind you I accept that most police don't have a clue around firearms legislation and thats where the danger comes in. I will never call in to let the police know I'm taking part in my lawful hobby, it's a slippery slope to it becoming a condition on your licence and I for one do not want that kind of infringement on my liberty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperfection Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 Bear in mind that generally the people in the control room are not police officers and therefore do not have any experience of how police on the front line operate. I agree,but a reported incident will always get looked at by a senior officer to whether it requires going any further because not everything has a sinister reason. Classic example of common sense prevailing was with someone i know who rang the Police at 1.00am to say he and his missus could hear 'muffled gunshot' in the fields behind his house (he literally lives in the middle of nowhere). Needless to say Cambridgeshire Police exercised common sense and deduced it was someone lamping rabbits and didnt follow it up. It were the farmers two sons lamping by quad bike and i know this because i shoot on this farm too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurch Posted October 27, 2012 Report Share Posted October 27, 2012 Must remember to 'phone the police next time I drive to work. Or walk my son to school. etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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