Dirty Harry Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 FairPlay to the woman. She is standing up for what she believes in and appeared to get stuck in when she needs to. I think before the ban they hounds would have been a bit more proactive in dispatching the fox but maybe they have got a bit soft. Like someone else has said if the hounds stumble across a fox it's accepted that they may have it. It's hard enough getting one dog to sit when you need it to let alone a pack of hounds who for generations have been bread for fox hunting. Without evidence that they had been chasing foxes to this point I don't think it's going anywhere. Don't forget the fox was unharmed. Harry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED BEARD Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 "The fox was released unharmed" ... And shot 3 days later by a PW member, and the photos were put on the Internet i know one PW user that shoots foxes that get releaed onto a piece of land next to one of his permisions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 Facts are very thin on the ground here! Those dogs are pets, used to running around for a drag hunt, they didn't know what to do with the fox except play with it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 I suppose your response depends what you think you see in the video. I see the Hunt appear to be going about their lawful business when the hounds accidentally come upon a fox (they certainly don't seem to be on to it). They are called off and respond and the woman picks the fox up. Do you think that the woman could have picked up that fox from a group of hounds if they hadn't been called off ? The "sinister" comment about a Hunt supporter videoing the rescuers , is as "sinister" as the rescuers videoing the Hunt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1957 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 I suppose your response depends what you think you see in the video. I see the Hunt appear to be going about their lawful business when the hounds accidentally come upon a fox (they certainly don't seem to be on to it). They are called off and respond and the woman picks the fox up. Do you think that the woman could have picked up that fox from a group of hounds if they hadn't been called off ? The "sinister" comment about a Hunt supporter videoing the rescuers , is as "sinister" as the rescuers videoing the Hunt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magus69 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 To me it was as the above said nothing more than an accident, the dogs didn't have a clue and backed off when told to "leave it" the pack have probably never seen let alone encountered a fox before. I do think the woman who rushed in and grabbed the fox has big cahunas, but I also think she believes the hunt had gone out with the intention of hunting fox which to me is clearly not the case. It's a shame that this accident happened and a bigger shame that it was caught on camera and put on youtube. Mike... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweazle Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 What is the significance of the huntsman blowing the horn ? Does that mean a fox has been spotted ? If so, probably not a good thing to have on Youtube. Either way, did anyone else notice how well the horses were turned out ? There's a lot of rural work in those horses, breeding, stabling, shoeing, veterinary and day-to-day care. Somebody made the saddles and the clothes. The dogs need kenneling too. Work for people in areas where it's hard to find a job. I like to think I'm a humane person, and I'll admit I don't like the idea that a fox might suffer for 30 seconds after being caught, but In my mind I weigh it against the suffering caused by unemployment in rural areas and I find myself coming down on the side of the humans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshLamb Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 I have ridden to hounds for nearly 20 years. This is clearly a piece of pre-formed anti-hunting propaganda. It's also been said that the woman is well known, and probably planted the already tame fox there just to get it on film Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshLamb Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 Her name is Judi Gilbert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockercas Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 were all doomed. just remember the fluffed shots you have made. pigeon,fox,deer its the same slow and painful death if not retrieved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomov Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 I haven't really got much to add to some of the posts here but to aid those who may not know much about hunting with hounds: 1) You can tell that hounds were not hunting the fox, simply because there is no record of them 'speaking' (barking) as they are following it's scent trail. 2) The huntsman is simply using his horn to communicate with his hounds - in the first few frames he's encouraging them to draw or look for the trail. He's actually calling hounds back to him in the bit of the video immediately preceding the clips of the fox. 3) You can see that the hounds are surprised to see a fox that has just jumped up in front of them. 4) Make no mistake about it, if the woman hadn't intervened, that fox would have been very dead in less than ten seconds. There are some well off folk who go hunting. There's also a shed load of folks who have perfectly normal jobs and lives just like a lot of people on here. I'm sure an awful lot of the public think that all shooters drive range rovers and shoot 'grice'... As has already been pointed out, the video was filmed by a very well known anti hunting activist - to say the woman has an axe to grind is understatement of the century. To those who shoot live quarry but don't like hunting with hounds, I must admit, I find your thinking a bit odd, but you're entitled to your opinion. Don't fall into the trap of thinking that people like Judy Gilbert, LACS, POWA, IFAW or the hunt sabs will find what you do any more acceptable though will you guys? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 I haven't really got much to add to some of the posts here but to aid those who may not know much about hunting with hounds: 1) You can tell that hounds were not hunting the fox, simply because there is no record of them 'speaking' (barking) as they are following it's scent trail. 2) The huntsman is simply using his horn to communicate with his hounds - in the first few frames he's encouraging them to draw or look for the trail. He's actually calling hounds back to him in the bit of the video immediately preceding the clips of the fox. 3) You can see that the hounds are surprised to see a fox that has just jumped up in front of them. 4) Make no mistake about it, if the woman hadn't intervened, that fox would have been very dead in less than ten seconds. There are some well off folk who go hunting. There's also a shed load of folks who have perfectly normal jobs and lives just like a lot of people on here. I'm sure an awful lot of the public think that all shooters drive range rovers and shoot 'grice'... As has already been pointed out, the video was filmed by a very well known anti hunting activist - to say the woman has an axe to grind is understatement of the century. To those who shoot live quarry but don't like hunting with hounds, I must admit, I find your thinking a bit odd, but you're entitled to your opinion. Don't fall into the trap of thinking that people like Judy Gilbert, LACS, POWA, IFAW or the hunt sabs will find what you do any more acceptable though will you guys? EH? even the sabs would comprehend the fox gets to be dead in a much more humane process. A pack of dogs ripping a live fox to bits is clearly going to invoke more empathy than a quick shot that foxy never knew was coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 EH? even the sabs would comprehend the fox gets to be dead in a much more humane process. A pack of dogs ripping a live fox to bits is clearly going to invoke more empathy than a quick shot that foxy never knew was coming. I bet if you let someone like that woman know that you are going to humanely dispatch a fox by shooting it,and let her know the time and place,then she and all her mates will turn up and try and stop you,these people are animal extremists who will put the life of an animal over your life as a hunter without even thinking about it. Whatever your views on fox hunting you should be aware that these people want all field sports stopped,and fox hunting is a start,what next,fishing,shooting hawking,some times you have to stand together to defeat a common enemy,because they are well organised and media savvy,while we bicker about the rights and wrongs of each field sport on forums, they gain support from the public by media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomov Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 EH? even the sabs would comprehend the fox gets to be dead in a much more humane process. A pack of dogs ripping a live fox to bits is clearly going to invoke more empathy than a quick shot that foxy never knew was coming. Tell you what, you can contact Judy Gilbert through her good friend Penny Little, whose website is here - http://www.littlefoxes.org.uk/ . Explain to them that you shoot foxes and see what response you get... Look at the reaction to the badger cull - there's a whole lot of people out there who just don't see why anything should die. Ever. In any way... And spare me the stuff about the 'quick shot that foxy never knew was coming', I've been around a bit. Step forward the shooter who has never had something leg it with a dose of lead in it or thinks it could never happen to them. Sure, 99 times out of 100 all's rosy, but that one time it goes wrong, who gets to judge the suffering of the fox that is limping around with blood poisoning that eventually starves vs the one that hounds take a few seconds to kill? Doesn't look all that black and white to me... (Which is why I will never condemn shooting or hunting with hounds). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 (edited) You are both totally correct in what you say and I am not condeming huunting with horses and or packs of dogs here. It's an inescapable fact though that one method involves deliberately chasing down a quarry until it exhausts before ripping it to pieces - and taking what is intended to be a one shot humane kill. For the record, I think that fox was either a tame or drugged up plant. Edited November 24, 2012 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 We are all taking this too seriously - the woman was obviously short of something for the nights curry ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomov Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 (edited) Or... One method involves hunting a quarry species that has evolved to hunt and be hunted, that shows no particular distress at hearing some hounds, in its own environment, with a good chance of it escaping where it is killed very quickly or escapes completely uninjured. The other involves luring an unsuspecting creature using all the technology known to man, sometimes playing on it's hunger or mating instincts and dazzling it with a bloody great torch before wounding it so it can die a lingering death. It's all in the marketing Dave. And the hunting (with hounds) world was **** (bad) at marketing for a very, very long time! (The shooting community should take note here!). I agree by the way - that fox acts very strangely, there's definitely something up with it. Let's hope it lives a long and happy life in the home for old foxes that Mrs Gilbert will have found for it and that it gets good medical treatment when the end comes. Cause that's what happens to wild animals isn't it? Edited November 24, 2012 by tomov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_commoner Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 what a wind up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willow32 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 (edited) Fox hunting , terrier work ,ferreting,lamping ,coursing (when legal ),ratting and shooting.......love them all Edited November 24, 2012 by Willow32 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomov Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 We are all taking this too seriously - the woman was obviously short of something for the nights curry ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno22rf Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 I dont believe some of the comments that I am reading.As for the hounds being called off,it sounds like the woman herself or one of her friends shouting at the dogs and not,as should be,the huntsmen.I,m not entirely sure what look the fox should have when faced with a pack of hounds,I,m guessing that its his first time and I,m sure that he could improve with practice.As for people who think that we should support this outdated pastime because once banned the anti's will start on us,do you not think that by being associated with it the vast majority of people in this country who think it abhorrent will consider that we all behave in a similar manner. And,yes,I have been fox hunting,the sight of 4 cubs being torn to pieces will stay with me forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul T Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 (edited) It's illegal mate. So you want to show support to a group that are breaking the law? I won't be. Riding out with the hunt is not illegal mate. You might be confusing that little point with hunting foxes with hounds, which is. So, don't believe everything you see - there's no way these hounds were onto the fox! Cranfield was bang on the money in his earlier post. As a slight aside, I'm just back from a game shoot. I called in the pub on the way back and Landlord asked if we'd had a good day, One bloke sat at the bar started giving verbal about the shoot - lot's of mis-informed rubbish as usual (all millionaires taking pot shots at wild birds etc ), so as I said in my first post on this thread, it's a country sport and we all need to stick together. edit: typo Edited November 24, 2012 by Paul T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomov Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 You obviously feel pretty strongly about this bruno22rf - I notice the text in your profile. Good job you only shoot vermin and don't like driven pheasants either - all of the anti groups I quoted previously will understand that I'm sure. Brilliant effort on not wounding anything in over 30 years shooting as well. You must be quite some shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reece Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 However unpalatable you find the process of hounds killing a fox, one thing you cannot deny is that there is no chance of the fox escaping injured. However rare it is for a shooter to injure one, there is still a chance of it happening. This cannot happen with hunting. If a fox escapes from the hunt, it escapes uninjured because it managed to run away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_commoner Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 awful lot of hypocrisy on here tonight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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